Stuck between 2 boats....

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Markysailingsparky

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I am currently looking at 2 boats-priced almost the same, at the same size in the same marina. I am hoping to sail the boat on the northumberland coastline originally then as my confidence and experience goes see where I end up! The 2 boats in question are a bilge keel MacWester 27 and a lifting keel Jeaneau Fantasia 27. Initially the Mac took my interest with just a more homely feel and a decent Volvo Penta 23hp and although the Jeaneau only has a yanmar 1gm10 the boat has a nice layout and being 8 years younger has a more modern feel. Sail ability wise.....I have no idea.....the lifting keel seems to make the Jeaneau flighty as I've been told. I need some good honest advice as currently it's looking like a coin flip on first impressions!
 
Decisions, Decisions

The Macwester is built like a brick outhouse so should give a fairly slow and seakindly ride. It was probably built with very durable components too. (seacocks, deck hardware etc)

The Jeanneau will point better but quite possibly give a harsher ride. Downwind it'll wallow less. Everything on it is probably also 8 years less knackered, though that is a matter for survey plus hardware is possibly modern plastic or lightweight with inherent shorter lifespan.

Lifting keels are a source of maintenance & noise, bilge keels a source of leaks.

If you hit the putty with bilge keels you get turned into the bank and can ground hard. Do so with (most) lifting keels and you can raise the keel to get off.

Bilge keels more tolerant of bottom quality when taking the ground.
 
Good advice there. I don't know the Jeanneau but we had the Mac28 (same as 27 with larger lazarette) don't discount the sailing - you need to think of it as a motor sailer at less than 45 degrees to the wind - it will maintain a good speed but the leeway will make you cry! They have an old fashioned tenderness - it will heel over in a cap full for wind - almost no initial form stability but then it will sit there and go no further - rock steady, reducing canvass does nothing to reduce the heel really. Pretty awful weather helm but that was the style in those days - get an oversized genoa and reef the main a bit early - it helps a little.

Once you get past 50 degrees it's a different animal - good rate of progress but you will find all newer designs sailing past you, it's an old design and monstrously heavy.

Having said all that it has a fantastic cockpit, lots of room to spread out, a good sized cabin, cramped heads and a large forecabin. Cockpit lockers could accomodate about 4 inflatable dinghys - they are truly massssssssssive. With a good engine it's a hell of a lot of boat for the money but don't pay more than £5,500 - lots are advertised for £8k plus but they never make that. Friend had a nice 27 with brand new Beta and got £5,250.

Make sure it's the deep keel and tall mast version, the very first 27's were the same keel and mast as the 26 and that is one slow mother - quite awful sailing 'qualities'. It should have a draught of 3' 8".

We had two good seasons in ours, we ran aground lots of times and it never minded, it looked after us in some grim weather and generally taught us a lot by being forgiving. In the end we moved on because of the heeling and the poor windward performance. Only managed to cure one of those as we bought a shallow draught cat next, then a Colvic Watson 35 so I guess it was always the heeling that bugged us most.
 
I own a Jeanneau Fantasia lift keel.

My opinion on my boat.

1, Open plan interior suits me.
2, Points well into wind.
3, 1GM Yanmar, enough punch for me on the east coast.( 2 wing prop)
4, Lifting keel (swings down realy is only a metal plate, like a centre board) is well handy for shallow water off Essex,
5, Good head room, bedroom, and toilet with a door.nav table,cooker,cool box,plenty stow areas.
6, Sails well in light winds.
7, Just a little light in a blow, you have to reef down just a little early.
Some people add a little weight under bilges, ( i have not).
8 Nice size cockpit, lockers.
9,All lines lead to cockpit.
I have had my boat 5 years now, suits me %100.

Cant comment on other boat, but Fantasia sails well enough for me, as mostly single handed.
Used to be owners club called "club fantasia" on web, but think it is now closed down.
Also resale value will be good, as it still has Jeanneau name.
Hope this is of some help..
 
Sorry few points, i thought i may add.

1, Head lining on my boat, the foam insulation turns to dust after many years, i rellined mine, heard Jeanneau boats suffer from this.

2, On my Yanmar IGM, there are no glowplugs (pre heater) so can be a little slugish to start in cold temps, but always starts at least 3rd time.

3, Feel the rudder is a little small, but then it may be my poor sailing. :D

I used to own a Jaguar lift keel what sailed like a Transit van, so Fantasia is like a BMW to me.

My boat was owned by only one owner from new, so was in mint condition,
I replaced, Sails and new rigging.

Paid £ 11.000.
Have a look on apolloduck, for price comp.

Good build quality, in my eye i must say.
 
It would be difficult to find two more dissimilar monohulls in that size! I've sailed both, and would be happy to own either, but you might want to look also at something in between, something more moderate.
 
Great feedback as usual.....so with a budget of 10k +/- 2k what could people suggest for a strong well built cruiser, decent under power and a forgiving sail suitable for the North Sea?? I'm a dinghy man from experience so these big girls are a new field to me!
 
Centaur but twice the price of the Mac27; it's a nicer yacht but no way is it twice as good! Similar sized Snapdragon which has similar characteristics, a Halcyon 27 but cramped inside compared to the others. A Nantucket Clipper gives huge row-away-factor, I think it's the nicest of all the classic plastics but again short of room inside. The pick of that bunch is the Centaur for only one reason - you will sell it relatively easily for what you paid and your first yacht after dinghies is a chance to experiment. You could go a bit left field and pick up a Heavenly Twins for that money - safe in a storm, similar sailing to a Centaur but faster on a reach, about four times the internal volume.
 
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