Starter whirring

[calvong]

Hi,

Sometimes when I hit the starter switch I hear the starter motor whirring on a fairly high pitch but it seems to not 'catch' or crank the engine. I then immediately switch off the starter and wait for say 10secs before giving it another go. After 2-3 attempts it catches and the engine starts strongly and cleanly. Anyone with any ideas of what the issue is here?

 

[Davegriff]

Presumably its quite an old engine without a pre-engaged starter motor, in which case it'll be a dirty bendix. Remove the motor and clean the threaded bit at the end. Don't grease it.

 

[calvong]

Cheers Dave - yup an old yanmar ys8. It's been bulletproof apart from niggles like this

 

[john_morris_uk]

Presumably its quite an old engine without a pre-engaged starter motor, in which case it'll be a dirty bendix. Remove the motor and clean the threaded bit at the end. Don't grease it.

And if I remember correctly the bendix is not supposed to be oiled either. They run dry? Perhaps someone with a better memory will give a definitive answer?

 

[Daydream believer]

Do not know the engine but if the starter has a solenoid then the solenoid could be nearing the end of its life & is not pushing the lever that engages the starter motor to the flywheel
Take the starter off & clean it & check it is not a rust problem & that the gear wheel moves in & out OK

I have just had this on my digger a couple of days ago
Disconnect the battery before doing this until ready to start the engine
I managed to start it by dismantling the solenoid & exposing the lever that pushes the gear wheel into drive on to the starter ring.
I connected the main power wires to each other with a small nut & bolt & taped them over to prevent a short.
By manually pushing the lever while someone cranked the starter i got the engine going
I had to be careful to disengage the lever & then had to stick a couple of cable ties around the lever to stop it re engaging the starter gear on the flywheel
But the digger can be used until the new solenoid arrives. Just have to leave it ticking over during tea breaks!!!

Even if it is not on your engine this may help someone else in an emergency

 

[Otter]

I had the same symptoms with an outboard that used the same system as your ys8. It was dirt and crud and once cleaned it was fine.

 

[NickRobinson]

All the YS series used pre-engaged motors.

A stuck solenoid (piggy backed on top of the starter) would just give a single click at most

Low volts may give a repeated clicking.

A whining ('circular saw through knotty pine') noise suggests the one way roller clutch is failing.

They're sealed but you can swish petrol on it to sometimes get a bit more life (not recommended on a safety critical item)

If so, new Yanmar ones IIRC, 350 pounds ish.... seek your local reconditioner c.30 pounds...

N

 

[vyv_cox]

Can I clarify the terminology? The 'old fashioned' type of starter had what was known as an inertia starter system. When the motor starts the small geared wheel is thrown forward to engage with the starter ring. This is the Bendix type. Dirt and grit can make the Bendix sticky, which can be fixed by cleaning.

In a pre-engaged starter the solenoid throws the small gear forward before the motor starts to turn, hence the name. What NickRobinson says about the roller clutch is a new one on me. I have had problems in the past when the gear was thrown forward but the motor did not turn, identified as corrosion of the braided copper conductor between the solenoid and the motor, or pitting of the electrical contacts inside the solenoid.

 

[NickRobinson]

Hi Vyv/All

The roller clutch is needed to stop the engine driving the starter when it fires to avoid damage.

The old Bendix did not need one as the faster revs of the engine 'threw' the pinion up the coarse thread and so out of engagement.

 

[pampas]

Or the ring gear is badly worn?

 

[vyv_cox]

Hi Vyv/All

The roller clutch is needed to stop the engine driving the starter when it fires to avoid damage.

The old Bendix did not need one as the faster revs of the engine 'threw' the pinion up the coarse thread and so out of engagement.

Yes, I know the device you mean but have not come across this particular problem before. It's a needle roller bearing with a cage that has a slope on one side, so the needles roll up it and lock rotation in one direction. Replacements for the one in my windlass came from Simply Bearings.

Pampas offers another possibility but I cannot see how re-trying the starter would fix it unless the engine was turned over a little first.

 

[NickRobinson]

"Pampas offers another possibility but I cannot see how re-trying the starter would fix it unless the engine was turned over a little first. "

I can't remember a worn starter ring on a pre-engaged starter. It used to be a regular job on customers inertia started Mk1 Cortinas etc.

Nudging the car forward in 4th would give you some better teeth to start on, though a bit tricky on a yacht-

 

[VicS]

It used to be a regular job on customers inertia started Mk1 Cortinas etc.

Nudging the car forward in 4th would give you some better teeth to start on, though a bit tricky on a yacht-

I cant think why anyone would have a Mk 1 Cortina on a yacht

 

[NickRobinson]

I cant think why anyone would have a Mk 1 Cortina on a yacht

Someone will post they're better than a Rocna

 

[BobnLesley]

...I cannot see how re-trying the starter would fix it unless the engine was turned over a little first...

Just once in a blue-moon, ours (Yanmar 3GM30F) pulls the same stunt, often after I've been doing something else which has perhaps disturbed the usual/natural alignment - checking/adjusting tappets can almost guarantee it 'whirring' on attempting the first re-start. My so far infallible remedy has been to just pull on the alternator/waterpump belt to move the crankshaft a few degrees and try the starter again; having restarted correctly, it rarely reoccurs until next time I move something.

 

[Spi D]

Just to make this clear: