Spinnaker pole vs Genoa poling out pole

[rwoofer]

What's the difference? Are poling out poles shorter? Can they be made of a lighter construction?

I'm pretty sure that I'll stick with assymetrics and genoas poled out rather than get a proper spinnaker, so it would be great to be able to get a cheaper pole for the job.

thanks

 

[Evadne]

I've only got one pole so it does both, I'm pretty sure it is a spinnaker pole. The only differences I can think of, apart from length, which would depend on the relative dimensions of your spinnaker and genoa, is that a poling out pole wouldn't need fittings for up and downhaul.

 

[rwoofer]

Is there a way of calculating the length of the pole with some genoa dimensions in mind?

On past boats, whenever I used the spinnaker pole to pole out the genoa it always seemed too long.

 

[alan]

I use a whisker pole for both genoa and genaker; mine is the adjustable type. I think I read somewhere a whisker pole is usually about 1.25 times the 'J' measurement (a rough guide). There are a few makes around - I think(if I remember correctly) that Mailspeed Marine have some in their catalogue.
To be honest all you need is some anodised alluminium tube the correct diameter to take spi pole ends; cut the tube to the length to what you require and attach two spi pole ends of the type which suit your use (there a few different types of "jaws"). That wont cost you anything like as much as a "shop" one!! If you can find some rich ex-racers broken spi pole, you can even salvage the pole ends and save even more money..............
/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Alan.

 

[rwoofer]

Thanks for the reply Alan. I am thinking of doing exactly what you are saying because for my size boat, I'm getting quotes of over a £1000 for a new spinnaker pole - which just seems a rip-off.


1.25 * J does sound very long ( I would say longer than a spinny pole)

 

[alan]

Typically they are longer than spi poles. I believe spi poles are limited by racing regs (if you race that is) to the J measurement. I read somewhere that whisker poles are usually about 1.25 times J as a rough guide but I assume that it depends on your sails and further assume that someone was quoting 1.25J as being a media for use with genoa, genaker or MPG e.t.c.

I bought an adjustable pole so as I could use it with just about any sail, and also use it on other boats if I should ever buy another boat. Mine is made in Germany by a company whose name is Pfeiffer (see below) and cost me about £350 (I think).


web page
Forespar (American) and IYE also make adjustable poles. Mine is fixed in length by a pin through the telescopic sections. IYE use (I think) a twist and lock mechanism and Forespar use a rope/pulley arrangement which allows you to adjust the length whilst standing at the mast. I opted for the simple mechanical arrangement which means removing the pole to adjust the length, but which I believe is less prone to failure.

Alan.

 

[alan]

Typically they are longer than spi poles. I believe spi poles are limited by racing regs (if you race that is) to the J measurement. I read somewhere that whisker poles are usually about 1.25 times J as a rough guide but I assume that it depends on your sails and further assume that someone was quoting 1.25J as being a media for use with genoa, genaker or MPG e.t.c.

I bought an adjustable pole so as I could use it with just about any sail, and also use it on other boats if I should ever buy another boat. Mine is made in Germany by a company whose name is Pfeiffer (see below) and cost me about £350 (I think).


web page
Forespar (American) and IYE also make adjustable poles. Mine is fixed in length by a pin through the telescopic sections. IYE use (I think) a twist and lock mechanism and Forespar use a rope/pulley arrangement which allows you to adjust the length whilst standing at the mast. I opted for the simple mechanical arrangement which means removing the pole to adjust the length, but which I believe is less prone to failure.

Alan.

 

[Jacket]

Yep, it should be longer than a spinny pole. You really want the genny held perpendicular to the boat, so that it presents as much area to the wind as possible (In reality, not quite perpendicular for stability). So even for a non-overlapping jib you want a pole that's significantly longer than a spinny pole (Have a look at the length of those used on Folboats).

 

[Stemar]

FWIW, I use a spinny pole to pole out my genoa, but it's way too short, so I have to poke it out between the forward lower and cap shrouds, which is far from ideal!

I'm looking at making a longer one, but the ends aren't cheap either, and there's always something else nibbling at the cash flow!

Does anyone have a DIY solution? (24ft boat, so loads aren't huge)

 

[Strathglass]

Normally as has been said a spinny pole is normally the J measurement. Which is the distance from the mast to the bow.

A pole for using with a foresail is normally best the length of the foot of that sail.

There are much higher forces on a spinny pole and it needs to be stronger than the pole which is only used on a jib.

On a 24ft boat one could probably get off with an 1.5" pole on a foresail and use dinghy sized fittings and extrusion(eg Holt Allen) at much lower cost.

Iain

 

[Evadne]

I'd pay a visit to the chandlery barge at Bursledon, they're bound to have something. I found a box of spinnaker pole fittings when I was looking there a while ago, but sadly not the one I had on the other end of the pole.

 

[fireball]

on the 22'er I used a telescopic pole from B&Q - it was meant for paint rollers or mops, but with a spinny pole fitting on one end and a bolt through the other it became a wisker pole - fine for light-medium winds, wouldn't use it in anything above a 4 though.
It was made of fibreglass with an Ali extension piece.

 

[Strathglass]

Re: pole fittings

The 1.5" end fittings I refered to for a lower cost jib pole are HA4331. I did not see a matching pole but I imagine that would be quite easy to find.

Iain

 

[pappaecho]

Re: pole fittings

Best source of poles for either spinacre or whisker is the local TV aerial shop - they have a range of different diameter poles ideal for the yachtie. As they are not anodised, I find that a couple of coats of car laquer keeps corrosion at bay.

 

[ditchcrawler]

Re: pole fittings

I use a pole which extends up to 2.5m with my cruising chute.I got it from Compass Watersports, current price is £79.95.
They do a 3.8m one for £139.95 & a 4.5m one for £199.95.

 

[angelsson]

Hi,
This post is of interest to me as I have been considering using a pole with my genoa when sailing downwind goosewinged.
Can you tell me what is meant by the 'J' measurement?
I can then as you suggest making one up from a aluminium pole.
As to the spi ends, would need to know there sizes in order to match the pole to them, are they readily available.
Many thanks
Mike

 

[alan]

Hi Mike,
The 'J' measurement is the distance from the mast to the forestay attachment point and would be the maximum length permitted for a spi pole (for racing). The length of a whisker pole should be sufficient to hold the genoa at right angles to the boat (more pr less). Thus the length of the whisker pole would depend on your boat and the sails. I have seen 1.25*J quoted and I assumee this is a rough guide to work with most of a boats genoas.

As far as spi end fittings go, have a look at the Forespar web site, that will give you an idea of types available or else look at some fittings for dinghy spi poles (if you want something lighter/smaller). Yes, end fittings come in 'standard' sizes, so you need to judge what size of pole will be strong enough for your boat/sails (have a look at spi poles and whisker poles from a manufacturer and this will give you an idea) then pick a tube size to go with the standard pole end fittings.

Of course having some sort of telescopic arrangement enables the whisker pole to be used with a larger range of sail sizes. Two pieces of pole with different diameters, and a couple of nylon ring inserts epoxied to the inner pole for bearings, and a few holes (in both inner and outer) and a pin would do the job quite well.

Alan. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[misterg]

Just made one for our 22 footer using Holt Allen end fittings (38mm) which were a perfect fit inside a length of aerial pole described as 1.5 inch. Total cost less than 30 quid, including monel rivets.

... Not used it yet, though....

Andy

 

[angelsson]

Thank you Alan,
I sail a 38' Nicholson, will now be able to take some measurements for constructing a pole. To hold it out at 90deg probably 1.25 x 'J' measurement will be right.
Many thanks for your help
Mike
I see you are located in Italy, I live in Uk but boat is in Sardinia.

 

[angelsson]

Hi Alan,
The Forespar website, www.forespar.com is a veritable mine of info re whisker poles. Thanks again,
Mike