So, Donald Crowhurst ..... Hero, Villain, madman ...... ?

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Nail on the head - to me Moitessier is the true "winner" of the race.

Crowhurst comes across as a tragic figure backed into a corner rather than a vilain.
Having read several of RKJs books - he's got a bit of "Colonel Blimp" image in my mind. But that may just be me.

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The more I read, learn and think about this story, the more I think you are right.
 
He was a dreamer who could talk the talk and in the end didn't like to admit that neither he nor the boat were up to it. He set off to save face and bankruptcy and in the end he became a victim of his own illusions. Very sad for his family.

Very noble of RKJ to give the prize money to his family - £5000 was a lot of money 40 years ago.
 
Much much more than £60,000 in todays values. I suspect £5000 in those days would have bought one if not more nice houses.

BTW I used to know one of the Crowhurst sons, a good guy who last I heard was a commercial diver.
 
I was looking forward to watching Deep Water, but unfortunatly fell asleep and missed almost all of it, how would I get to watch it again, I know that with the radio you can get show repeats on the internet, is it the same for programmes?
 
A harrowing watch.....seeing the guy before he set off, he had the look of a man going to the gallows!

And the last extracts from his log made for some seriously uncomfortable listening.
 
A victim.

To my mind the businessman and the journalist are the real villains. According to the programme DC knew has wasn't prepared and said so in private to his backers. However both his backers insisted that he had to make the deadline in their own self-interest.

I'm also uncomfortable when people start accusing DC as mad as it so easy to make this off-the-cuff comment whilst sitting at home leading normal lives and with a normal context from which to make rational decisions. Listening to how people like Nick Maloney/Mark Turner describe their singlehanding experiences leaves me in no doubt that you do need "special" qualities to behave like an ordinary person when the only company is the vast emptiness of the oceans. When I did a singlehanded x-channel earlier in the year I was amazed at the emotional high and lows I experienced in such a short trip - god knows what it might do to me when on my own for 100 days plus.

So even without the pressues of a catch 22 situation, singlehanding can take a toll on peoples minds. Add the two together and we really shouldn't be surprised that it can end in this way.
 
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Utter ,utter tosser !! Deprived his wife of a husband and children of a father because of stupidity.. Who but an idiot would sign such a contract that would bankrupt him if he failed in an unknown feat .Lots of sympathy for the family but absolutely none for him.

[/ QUOTE ] I think only his family have the right to say that. His widow hinted at anger, but DC only wronged his family. Bizarely his navagation and seamanship turned out to be bl00dy amazing for a weekend sailor.
 
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Bizarely his navagation and seamanship turned out to be bl00dy amazing for a weekend sailor.

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He can't be a madman - because he made a rational decision NOT to attempt the southern ocean
He can't be a villain - because he never attempt to win through cheating
He can't be a victim - because he could've staged an accident resulting in a forced retirement from the race

What he achieved was an amazing feat of navigation and endurance - especially for someone who was only a "weekend sailor" .. if at the end he had rational thought then he could've staged a mast failure (something not entirely life threatening) resulting in a forced retirement. Which ever way, in my mind he was a true English Gent to not "Win" through deception, it is just a huge shame he decided to finish his race the way he did, I can only assume that if communications had been better he may have got to talk to his wife and found another way out.
 
Crowhurst was indeed a victim of the circumstances constructed around him - but he was (at least in part) a knowing collaborator of those circumstances - he must have agreed to the financial terms under which he accepted the support for his effort, and went forwards under those terms, knowing the pressure that they would cause.

Mainly though, his personal problems seem to have stemmed from a character flaw whereby he initially accepted and undertook dishonesty as a way forwards ("Oh what a tangled web", etc), and that also seems to have been what ultimately gnawed away at his sanity to the extent that he took the actions that he appears to have taken. He should have (and could have) simply given up and taken his stripes...

It was for sure, a sad and tragic story of a very intelligent man who came to a very sticky end - but largely self-inflicted.

Moitessier is (IMHO) a fine sailor, and (for the large part) a fine human spirit (leaving aside for a moment the fact that he deserted his wife, etc..)

But I cannot think for a moment where this slight on RKJ (the Colonel Blimp comment) is coming from... Surely he has nothing to prove to anyone...
 
After reading the book I couldn't summon up too much sympathy for Crowhurst... there was speculation at the time that Tetley pushed his boat beyond the extreme believing Crowhurst was about to catch him.
Moittessier was remarkable... weeks away from home and he turned round to do the Southern Ocean again. He was either a true free spirit or touched... or both.
I got to know RKJ through a couple of business connections... he never came across as a Blimp to me and is the last person who would need to prove anything, then or now.
 
I could see exactly where Crowhurst was coming from. As a lad I too was inclined to take on a big project and make commitments on the assumption that everything would work out. The subsequent pressure to avoid embarrassment when things didn't work out was dire. I learned that lesson early in life and avoided getting myself into it in later life when there was more at stake than a red face.

My longest solo sail was only 11 days but I can confirm that the isolation and danger can produce a very different mental state to anything you can imagine from the comfort of home.

Certainly his character flaws created the situation but I don't think he deserves to be pilloried as mad or selfish.
 
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I was looking forward to watching Deep Water, but unfortunatly fell asleep and missed almost all of it, how would I get to watch it again, I know that with the radio you can get show repeats on the internet, is it the same for programmes?

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It's repeated on Saturday (10/11/07) at 22:00 on More 4
 
I think that I would like to know more about his state of mind and his personality before he left - ie would such a character, even if he had managed to make the passage, have been prone to psychological problems.

I missed the start and end of the film, and to me the part of him going over the edge could have been discussed more fully. From memory the book has more in it.

Going in the first place - it seems to me that our era is rather less adventurous than those days - we have much better knowledge/information and gear than they did and I take my hat off to people like him.

The 'hole and digging' reply I think is the key reply. Single handed sailing, with poor sleep, probably poor diet, exercise etc. in itself leads to poor decision making at times, and once he had started the lie his personality did not allow him to finish it. In effect the first lie caused his suicide.

I feel sorry for him and his family.
 
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