Smoking Volvo

TwinRudders

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I have a Volvo Penta 2002 18hp.
Have had to replace alternator and starter motor this year..but more worryingly she is smoking more...

Black smoke. I spoke to an engineer who just said that's normal for a diesel that age. (1989) Well that may be. But what does it mean? Piston rings?

I've just spent over £400 with this same company "doing the valves"; as they said my engine had low compression - the reason why it was reluctant to start. Actually made absolutely no difference at all. Am still waiting for the compression test after the £400 job. Funny that...

This engine is starting to get in the way of enjoying the sailing..anyone know the cost of a new one - or suggest a company to do a decent overhaul.

Thanks,

Jono
 

aluijten

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What also could be the cause is the injectors or the fuel pump. Both parts will lead to excessive smoking. If the fuel injectors have never been overhauled, my guess it that that is a logical thing to investigate first.
Piston ring would more likely lead to blue smoke of burned oil (and bad compression obviously)

Arno
 

branko

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Arno is in right.Probably one of your injectors stop to spray fuel and sending liquid fuel in cilinder! You can check it on table in service and change it !
 

TwinRudders

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OK - excuse my ignorance on this.
So you think I should take injectors out - and take them to a Volvo dealer to be checked? Is this reasonably easy to do?

Thanks for your help.

Jono
 

aluijten

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Should not be too much of an hassle, but be careful not to damage the feed lines, the whole thing might be a bit corroded (use WD-40 or so). When replacing use a torque wrench to avoid putting too much strain on the injectors. Ask the supplier for the correct torque value and other tips on re-assembling.

Arno
 

Stemar

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AFAIK, the injectors are fitted in copper sleeves. If these move, you may have to take the head off - or worse as I ubderstand they can let water into the cylinders. Drain the engine down before you do it.

Other things to check before you attack the injectors - a blocked exhaust - particularly the elbow, blocked air intake, and, if it came on suddenly, do you have a line round the prop that's resisting rotation without actually blocking it. It could even be a badly fouled prop or bottom.
 

geoff

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just a thought on your smoke....I have a volvo 2001 and last time out ran the engine whilst leaving the emergency stop slightly out...result smoke and oil on the surface aft...might just save you a few bob!!!
 

andy_wilson

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Black smoke means...

.. overloaded engine or insufficient oxygen for the fuel charge.

I'm sorry, but your engineer sounds like a right tool, his diagnosis is not accurate, black smoke is not a function of age AT ALL. Blue smoke is a sign of wear.

Working on the simplest to check first.

1. Is the air cleaner ... clean? rinse well with diesel and soak with engine oil / drain off.

2. Is the gearbox OK, filled with the correct oil, does the shaft turn OK by hand when in neutral or is resistance excessive?

3. Is the bottom clean and the prop clear of fouling?

4. Have you fiddled with the adjusting screws on the injection pump?

5. Harder to check for, and tools start to be required, but look for exhaust failure due to de-lamination which can cause restricted breathing.

Also, excessive sound-proofing can cause this, but that's difficult in a sail-boat as the bilges tend to provide plenty of air, unless yours is fully moulded out (or should that be moulded in?). Have you changed anything?

High oil consumption (piston rings or valve stems) smells fairly clean but smokes mild blue. Injector problems like weak springs, poor calibration or poor spray pattern tend to smoke badly blue and the exhaust stinks rancid of unburnt diesel.

Are you using the correct cold start proceedure on this engine?
1. Ingnition on.
2. Throttle 3/4 to full (in neutral).
3. Raise fully and lower stop control to set cold start device (which overfuels the engine).
4. Churn for 5 seconds or so.
5. Repeat (usually).

Remember an engine that takes some starting has good oil pressure by the time it fires!!

Once you have fixed it, do what the MOT boys do to clean her innards out. 1/2 fill the fine fuel filter with a good diesel treatment, put the rest in the tank, bleed, start her up and take her for a run and give her a good blast at 3/4 to full throttle.
 

Kyle2

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I have recently had the valves and valve seats on my Volvo MD1B re-ground at a local vehicle engine specialist for £15. OK, this is only one cylinder, but your quote of £400 seems a bit steep! They may have included new valves and guides in that, but I don't think they would know that these are needed until they had examined the cylinder heads.
 

ashanta

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I would agree with Stemar, Dont't start trying to take the injectors out unless you know what your doing and look at every other possibilty before doing so.
regards.

Peter.
 

TwinRudders

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Re: Black smoke means...

Thanks for your reply - really useful.

But I am new to diesel engines - but am quickly learning! (I did speak to a Volvo dealer this afternoon and he also thought the engineer I used was a **** also!)

I will check air filter, gearbox oil, bottom just been cleaned, prop is new and the right config for the engine/gearbox ratio.

Do you mean - try changing the adjusting screws on the injector pump? Is this reasonably obvious?

I've changed nothing as far as the bilges are concerned.

I bought the boat a year ago - I did speak to the previous owner about the engine and had a good look and listen and sea trial. The owner had done a fair bit of work - and I have receipts for the following from KEYPART: From 2002-2003

Piston Kit OD 0.5mm x 2 £345 = vat
Shim (soft) 0.20mm)
Gasket - govenor housing
Hex Drive Conversion £213.20
Head Gasket 2002 £36.06
Valve Stem Oil Seal £2.41
Timing case gasket
Plus from Lines Motor Works:
Rebore - 2 cyls to .5mm

Now from my limited experience would it be fair to assume that current smoking hopefully is not due to piston/ring wear? Just thinking - knowing the engineers I used the air intake is probably still half blocked from their so called winterization. When I came to start the engine the engineers were supposed to have got everything ready...need I say nothing had been done. I do find myself getting very angry about their attitude. I suspect they may have taken me for a bit of a ride as far as the vales are concerned. I have no proof as to what they actually did. It has made me determined to get stuck in and do these jobs myself...and do them properly.

Their invoice for work carried out to do the valves was:

Compression test: cyl 1 300psi cyl 2 200 psi (Volvo dealer said this was not possible to do tbhis test accurately?!)

Remove head/remove valves/ Grind valves into seats. Clean cyl head and refit valves with new valve seals. Tested injectors - ok. Refit and run up.

This weekend I will inspect fuel filters, oil, air intake and see what I find.

Any advice greatly received.

Thanks,

Jono
 

DJE

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Re: Black smoke means...

I have the same engine, same age. Mine was getting really hard to start about 18 months ago and had poor compression. I took the head off and the exhaust valve seats were badly pitted. Got these re-cut, valves ground in, and vacuum tested by a local firm for about £70. Starting now takes 5 seconds or less of cranking. I have also had the injectors serviced once by a local fuel injection company. Can't remember the exact price but about £30 for the pair. I generally get the injectors serviced every 2 or 3 years.
NB don't try and remove the injectors without using the special injector puller tool from Volvo. The injectors pass through copper sleeves in the head and if you disturb the sleeves you can get water in the cylinders. Replacing the sleeves is a serious job requiring removal of the head and the use of special tools. The puller reacts on the end of the sleeve and not the head so there is no danger of moving the sleeve. I can lend you a puller if you like just for the joy of depriving Volvo of the sale of a new one.
I never touch the fuel pump apart from the idle speed adjustment. Too complicated for me.
Mine smokes a bit when cold but is OK when it is warmed up.
 

andy_wilson

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DON\'T TOUCH THE INJECTOR PUMP!

This needs special callibration, fiddling is likely to contribute to problems...

It appears that it was removed during the work you itemise. When this pump is refitted, it needs to be shimmed correctly, using brand new soft shims next to the block and exactly the same shims to position it's spacing on re-fitting (or re-measure accurately and set up from scratch). This is critical to setting the amount of lift on the pump actuator!

Air filter.

It's not uncommon for an oily rag to be stuffed down the inlet on winterisation.

New Prop.

On the basis that something has changed, bound to be suspect!!! Only when you are sure all else is well can you get data from other users to see if the prop. realy is the right one for the job. Too coarse a prop. will cause black smoke at high throttle, too fine won't achieve full speed at full revs.

With all well I would guess hull speed (around 6 kts) at 2,500 to 2,800 cruising revs, 6.5 kts flat out at 3,200 rpm. But check other owners of boats like yours.

Andy
 

TwinRudders

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Re: DON\'T TOUCH THE INJECTOR PUMP!

OK thanks.

Regading the prop - I've only made one trip so far. I've noticed the smoking when tied up - running the engine in neutral.

J
 
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