Slocum's 'Spray'

[Poignard]

I am re-reading Joshua Slocum's 'Saiing Alone Around the World'. He claimed that 'Spray' would sail herself on any point of sailing.

Does anyone here have a true 'Spray' replica and, if so, can they say if Slocum was telling the truth.

 

[Nicholas123]

Can't imagine a bloke like that lying,you'll be doubting next that he had the pilot of the Pinta there to help him out!

 

[Poignard]

Can't imagine a bloke like that lying,you'll be doubting next that he had the pilot of the Pinta there to help him out!

Maybe I should also have asked if any Spray replica owners had ever been visited by the 'Pilot of the Pinta'!

Come to think of it, if his boat would always steer herself, why did the Pilot of the Pinta need to steer?

 

[RobBrown]

Parsifal

There was an article in the November YM, the Cruising Log, about a intended RTW sailor, Tristram Greensmith who has built a reputed "authentic replica" of Spray, a boat called Usquaebach who he says sails herself without a self-steering device, as per the original Spray.

 

[sighmoon]

A great book, and I don't doubt him at all (at least not that part) - if the boat couldn't steer herself, then the whole enterprise must be a fraud.

Some modern boats can steer themselves on any point of sail if the sails are trimmed right. Larger waves can still knock mine off course, but I imagine with the Spray's greater weight and longer keel, it's less of a problem.

 

[alant]

I am re-reading Joshua Slocum's 'Saiing Alone Around the World'. He claimed that 'Spray' would sail herself on any point of sailing.

Does anyone here have a true 'Spray' replica and, if so, can they say if Slocum was telling the truth.

There was one for sale in Cowes some years ago - nice all over varnish.

Didn't look that handy.

 

[Dougie_the_Mate]

There is a replica called 'Spray of Wight' - I think - which was used by Yachting T.V. for the Classic Malts cruise and subsequent videos on pilotage in certain Scottish Lochs. I think the video of her entering Loch Tarbert in Jura - not West Loch Tarbert as the programme claims - is still available online. It is a really good piece of video well worth watching.

 

[Sybaris]

Sir Robin Knox-Johnston did the same with Suhaili when the wind vane broke in the south sea during the Sunday Times Golden Globe Race in 1968 if I remember correctly.

Per

 

[xxyyzz]

It's a bit vague which rig gave this performance in the book, he converts to a yawl rig in Tasmania (I think?)

 

[Seajet]

I was under the impression there's a lot of doubt about the real Sprays' lines, so replicas are at best 'interpretations' ?

 

[Rum_Pirate]

I am re-reading Joshua Slocum's 'Saiing Alone Around the World'. He claimed that 'Spray' would sail herself on any point of sailing.

Does anyone here have a true 'Spray' replica and, if so, can they say if Slocum was telling the truth.

On page 60 of the November 2011 issue of Yachting Monthly, Tristam Greensmith has built a replica and is recruiting crew to follow Slocum's route around the world.

Dare say you could get some first hand info there.

Darn it. Posted and then read whole thread. Firsted by post # 4. Oops.

 

[PEEJAYSEA]

Tristam Greensmith

Tristam Greensmith

check out - www.saltypost.com

 

[sighmoon]

I was under the impression there's a lot of doubt about the real Sprays' lines, so replicas are at best 'interpretations' ?

They're in the book, drawn by Mr Slocum, I believe.

Anyway, our boat is very different to the Spray, but I managed a very relaxed solo sail with no autopilot or windvane, this summer:

 

[jwilson]

I was under the impression there's a lot of doubt about the real Sprays' lines, so replicas are at best 'interpretations' ?

And I have always wondered whether the original had a centreboard - it would have been absolutely normal where she came from, so normal that no-one might have mentioned it. It would certainly have made offwind self-steering much easier.

I don't think anyone has ever achieved the same legendary 'self-steering on any course' with any of the modern "replicas". Of course Slocum was a genuine square-rig captain, accustomed to steering more with the sails than the rudder, but there are still a few good boat-handlers about.

 

[Yacht Yogi]

Sailing hands-off

It should be possible for a boat to sail herself along if the keel and rudder are suitably balanced about the sail-plan. The keel and rudder work like half of an aeroplane and an aeroplane can be trimmed to be stable such that when disturbed in attitude or speed it will return to its original position. This is called static longitudinal stability. In the case of a boat the force on the sails takes the place of an aircraft's weight, the keel becomes the wings and the rudder the tailplane. However modern boats seem to round-up into wind if you let go of the tiller so in aeroplane terms they must be tail-heavy and therefore unstable. If you did that in an aeroplane the resulting stall would result in some unplanned excitement. In a boat she just luffs-up head to wind (or in the case of my boat, tacks herself and goes charging off in the opposite direction!).

 

[jwilson]

It should be possible for a boat to sail herself along if the keel and rudder are suitably balanced about the sail-plan. The keel and rudder work like half of an aeroplane and an aeroplane can be trimmed to be stable such that when disturbed in attitude or speed it will return to its original position. This is called static longitudinal stability. In the case of a boat the force on the sails takes the place of an aircraft's weight, the keel becomes the wings and the rudder the tailplane. However modern boats seem to round-up into wind if you let go of the tiller so in aeroplane terms they must be tail-heavy and therefore unstable. If you did that in an aeroplane the resulting stall would result in some unplanned excitement. In a boat she just luffs-up head to wind (or in the case of my boat, tacks herself and goes charging off in the opposite direction!).

In absolutely constant wind and flattish water almost any yacht can be trimmed to sail itself on most points of sailing (dead downwind the most difficult though) as long as you do not shift weight around. The problem is that wind is never constant, waves shift the hull around, and crew move about - in fact you can steer many smaller boats very effectively just by moving crew weight around. Slocum claimed Spray would steer herself in any direction, and no-one has ever really replicated this.

Aircraft are mostly designed to be inherently stable - stabilising tailplanes well aft, dihedral on the wings, etc. A few are designed to be inherently unstable in order to achieve extreme manoevrability - eg Eurofighter would reportedly be virtually unflyable without electronics keeping it under control.

 

[HunterWanderer]

200 miles

I sailed over 200 miles with the wheel locked from la coruna back to Uk and wind increased from 10 to 20 kts + gusts and a reasonable swell. Boat averaging 6 kts and 60 deg to wind. Started with full sail and reduced to 2nd reef and reduced genoa. Back to Autopilot after passing Quessant and wind from astern.
Boat is a relatively modern (1983) Hunter 34.
Will also hold course from 45 deg apparent to about 120 deg.
Really great sailing

 

[armchairsailor]

Would an inherent stiffness in the steering mechanism have been a factor for Captain Slocum perhaps?

I sailed on a Vancouver (my first long keel experience) and was astounded by the grunt needed to tack compared to a bilge keel and skeg configuration. OK, that wasn't a stiff bearing or anything, but it certainly was easier to set her on a course than other more "modern" designs.

 

[sighmoon]

Would an inherent stiffness in the steering mechanism have been a factor for Captain Slocum perhaps?

I sailed on a Vancouver (my first long keel experience) and was astounded by the grunt needed to tack compared to a bilge keel and skeg configuration. OK, that wasn't a stiff bearing or anything, but it certainly was easier to set her on a course than other more "modern" designs.

In the above video, I used the wheel brake. With the rudder unlashed, the slightest yaw is amplified, because the rudder turns to follow the boat round.

Slocum claimed Spray would steer herself in any direction, and no-one has ever really replicated this.

I believe Slocum 100%. In the book, he claims that it was the Spray's ability to self steer that gave him the idea. Given that he made it round, alone, how could he have managed it, if the boat wouldn't steer herself?

 

[Slow_boat]

When I was a kid I sailed on gaffers similar in configuration to 'Spray' and it was a given that you would balance the sails and tie off the helm with a bit of line or a pegboard for long periods. Modern boats are of different configuration so don't track so well, get knocked off course easier, are more obsessed with speed and maybe we've got so used to modern self steering/wheel steering and other gadgets we no longer bother quite so much about sail balance or hull trim.

My own boat is a twin keel Sadler but balance the sails and she will quite happily steer herself.