Seaworthiness - Biggest factor skipper or the boat

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Sailfree

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Reading the other post on seaworthiness and knowing my experience limited to only AWB (I must admit I was impressed with the few trips I have done on my friends Rustler 36) but seeing some of the comments makes me realize that perhaps even more emphasis should be given to a competent skipper and a well prepared boat than spreadsheets showing ballast ratios and AVS's.

I remember reading Nicho's brilliant account of beating in a Jeanneau 45 in a F9 IIRC and lets not forget Stingo crossing the atlantic in a Benny when many advised don't do it.

Whats others opinion?
 
Survival - I'd put my money on a good seaman in a poor boat rather than a poor skipper in a good boat.

Racing - Good boat will win, handicaps excepted.
 
I would say that seaworthiness is a property of the boat, not the skipper, but safety is a combination of the ability of the skipper and the seaworthiness of the boat.

In my experience the problem with the less seaworthy boats is not that they are not themselves up to the task, but that they put the skipper and crew under more strain than is necessary. It is the tiredness of the skipper than usually leads to a lapse in concentration or a bad judgment.

I think a good skipper with a strong crew will be safe in pretty much any of the modern boats, but a less experienced skipper with a weaker crew will be safer in a more sea-kindly boat.
 
Survival - I'd put my money on a good seaman in a poor boat rather than a poor skipper in a good boat.

Racing - A fast boat will win, handicaps excepted.
 
It's not what you've got, it's how you use it that counts. My boat is definitely more seaworthy than me!!
Bedouin's point is succinctly put, in that a "kind" boat will allow you to make more mistakes and get away with them than a less forgiving vessel.
I suppose that could be interpreted that the boat is the biggest factor, because a seakindly, easily controlled boat will survive regardless of the competence of the skipper. In reality they are both factors and it all depends on how important these factors are and how bad the weather is. Seasickness is a deciding factor in many maritime tragedies.
 
I like this quote from a hundred years ago, by I think Maurice Griffiths:

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Seaworthiness is a relative term. One man in speaking of a good sea-boat means a capable week-end boat for semi-sheltered waters: another perhaps is thinking of a vessel in which he can make an ocean voyage in safety. Again, the term may be applied either to a safe vessel or to one which is easy in her motion.

In the discussions about seaworthiness of cruising yachts, which from time to time are carried on in the yachting papers, one man perhaps advocates a long keel, another prefers a cut-away forefoot, a third likes a light displacement and all ballast outside, while a forth pins his faith to inside ballast and plenty of it, and so on. Each in turn proves his contention by referring to yachts which have made long voyages or gained a great reputation. No agreement is ever reached, or ever can be reached, because the points under discussion are not the most essential. By far the most important factor in determining the seaworthiness of a yacht is the crew, next comes the gear, and last of all the form of the hull.

A small yacht, by making a long passage in open water, may perhaps gain many advocates for her particular type when her success may really have been due to her having a competent skipper. Similarly, many a good little boat has acquired a bad reputation merely because she has never been owned by a man who understood her.

[/ QUOTE ]
 
[ QUOTE ]
Must be 100pc down to the boat or I'd have been rotting on the bottom long ago!

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/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif Great line, but I don't believe you! Because poor skippers always claim to be the world's best!
 
A relevant factor for this forum is time, a light boat well sailed may well survive a storm, many have. On a long passage, or many long passages, the extra strength of construction and gear often seen as more 'seaworthy' may start to make a difference to cost, maintainance and the ability to keep moving. My defenition of a seaworthy boat is one that arrives in habour ready to go out again. This means no damage to repair and the crew not needing a rest (as opposed to wanting to go ashore).
 
In my opinion seaworthiness has nothing to do with the competence of the skipper and crew, it's all about the boat. Seamanship, or lack of it is what the skipper contributes to the situation.

A seaworthy boat will still be seaworthy regardless of the skipper.
 
Now, there, Searush, is a very interesting question.... nice one..

For my take.. you are splitting the choice.. there are many seaworth boats that would look after inexperienced crews.. and many bathtubs that would be ok in the hands of more experienced crews...

BUT...

The basic ability of the boat is paramount if you want to travel.. a good crew in a poor boat would suffer if offshore for a long time.. not necessarily a case of being dangerous.. just bloody uncomfortable and demanding a LOT of attention.

Its a hard call.. but you MUST (IMHO) separate the one from the other.. I think its down to boat.. with the accepted GOOD crew... a poor crew is a poor crew... period - a good boat is a good boat - all the time.
 
I think you are right, but also the crew factor can't be ignored (that's why I sail a lot single handed) /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif.
Maybe seaworthiness as a concept should be expanded to include happiness and confidence in Boat, Skipper and Crew.
In tough conditions the Skipper can't be out controlling things for prolong periods of time, so he has to have the confidence in the crew to delegate.
The crew have to have the confidence in the Skipper to put together a good game plan, and everyone has to have confidence in the boat to take the adverse conditions.
 
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