Seacocks DZR

Johnny WAFI

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Hi

Where would you buy DZR seacocks from to ensure they are properly made and not some copy cat rubbish that will sink my boat?

I have already received helpful advice from Tranona, Kwik Decesion and John Alison along the lines of:
"If they are Blakes then just do the regular maintenance. If ball valves then they are likely to be bronze if original. If gate valves get rid of them and replace with DZR or composite."

Johnny
 

Tranona

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Most chandlers will clearly label them DZR (and prices will be higher than plain brass1). Valves will have CR cast in the body, but not all fittings like through hulls and hose tails will have markings because there is no suitable unmachined casting area left so you have to rely on the supplier labeling. most like ASAP do this very clearly.
 

Plum

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Hi

Where would you buy DZR seacocks from to ensure they are properly made and not some copy cat rubbish that will sink my boat?

I have already received helpful advice from Tranona, Kwik Decesion and John Alison along the lines of:
"If they are Blakes then just do the regular maintenance. If ball valves then they are likely to be bronze if original. If gate valves get rid of them and replace with DZR or composite."

Johnny
Another vote, based on long term experience, for ASAP when buying DZR fittings and ball valves. Hull Fittings, Valves and Strainers
 
Another shout out for ASAP. That's where the DZR bits on my current boat were bought from 8 yes ago.

Oh, and I would not support your statement "If ball valves then they are likely to be bronze if original". A great many boats have come out of factories fitted with bog standard brass ball valves as sea cocks, which is (or was?) fine according to the RCD, as they have a design life of 5 yrs.
 

Tranona

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Another shout out for ASAP. That's where the DZR bits on my current boat were bought from 8 yes ago.

Oh, and I would not support your statement "If ball valves then they are likely to be bronze if original". A great many boats have come out of factories fitted with bog standard brass ball valves as sea cocks, which is (or was?) fine according to the RCD, as they have a design life of 5 yrs.
I think the boat in question is a 1980s Sadler which would only have brass if they had been replaced.

It is not true that brass valves have a "design life" of 5 years. The RCD simply states that they must last a minimum of 5 years and they last far more than that. If they failed in that sort of time there would have been an epidemic of failures given the literally hundreds of thousands that are in use round the world as seacocks in boats. Even if there is dezincification it is rarely in the valve but in the threaded fittings and rarely results in the assembly failing and letting water in.

This is not a recommendation to fit plain brass but to make certain that the fittings and valve are corrosion resistant.
 

lustyd

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If they failed in that sort of time there would have been an epidemic of failures
Not all failures are catastrophic. Most seacocks fail by seizing long before they’re dangerous, and I’d suggest we have seen considerable numbers fail after not a lot of years.
I agree with your point that very few have sunk boats, but they’re still terrible and there’s no sensible reason to fit one.
 

Tranona

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Not all failures are catastrophic. Most seacocks fail by seizing long before they’re dangerous, and I’d suggest we have seen considerable numbers fail after not a lot of years.
I agree with your point that very few have sunk boats, but they’re still terrible and there’s no sensible reason to fit one.
Seizing is not necessarily failure and nothing to do with the type of metal used for the bodies or fittings, but more the type of ball and lining used. The main cause of seizing is build up of deposits on the outer side of the ball or opening. Composite valves seem to be able to cope with this better. The other failure point is often the spindle for the ball which may be steel and can rust. Seized or stiff valves can usually be freed.

The problem with this debate is that a complex subject is dominated by a simplistic "seacocks that only last 5 years" mantra and ignorance on the part of some so called "professionals" who don't understand the real nature of the problems.
 

PetiteFleur

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I fitted a TruDesign seacock when I replaced my Lavac hoses last year. Very easy to fit and operate, and a reasonable price. The previous ball Valve had become very hard to operate, a DZR one from memory. Very pleased and will replace others in the future with Trudesign if necessary.
 

ashtead

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Just reading this thread as a fellow boat owner seems to be replacing valves on his French DS as we approach 10 years since breaking from the egg etc so if the valves installed by a German manufacturer are becoming stiff is now the time to replace and if so do most do the lot or just say the domestic water ones ?
 

lustyd

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I did the lot, through hulls and cocks. It’s not a lot of additional work to just do them all for peace of mind and I think I only spent £500 for the full set or there abouts.
In theory you may not need to do through hulls if they’re decent metal but I found everything was well stuck together and needed a big Stilson to move anything. At that point any sealant was broken anyway so I’d have at least needed to re bed them all.
 

Tranona

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Just reading this thread as a fellow boat owner seems to be replacing valves on his French DS as we approach 10 years since breaking from the egg etc so if the valves installed by a German manufacturer are becoming stiff is now the time to replace and if so do most do the lot or just say the domestic water ones ?
The important ones are the underwater for the toilet - usually 3/4" intake and 1 1/2" outlet. The latter tends to be the one that seizes most easily. It is not the valves that are the problem but the threaded skin fittings and hose tails which are often brass and can dezincify. If you do decide to replace them then do the lot underwater - toilet, sink and shower drains. Easiest way is to cut off the outer flanges either with an angle grinder (carefully) around the opening or a cone borer. Then pull the whole assembly away from inside the boat. Replace with either Trudesign - but check they will fit the space as the bodies are bigger or DZR.
 

ashtead

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Yes it’s heads ones which seem to become stiffer each year (or I become weaker and less athletic to access) but the galley ones seem fine. I’m afraid I never touch the engine one during a season . On basis we come out at Gosport for anti fouling once it’s warmer might be time to get some quotes for new ones.
 

lustyd

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It is not the valves that are the problem
Original thread finished a while ago, we're now responding to #15. If the valves are stiff to operate then it's obviously the valves at fault. A boat of that age is unlikely to have bad through hulls but impossible to say without asking the manufacturer what they fitted.
 

Tranona

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Original thread finished a while ago, we're now responding to #15. If the valves are stiff to operate then it's obviously the valves at fault. A boat of that age is unlikely to have bad through hulls but impossible to say without asking the manufacturer what they fitted.
You are right - there maybe a problem with the valves, but that could well be cleared by cleaning the balls, particularly the outer edge. Perhaps I should have been clearer that it is unlikely to be a corrosion problem which is the usual concern with boats of this age.
 
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