simon501
Well-Known Member
I'm looking for others experience as I may have to replace my anchor.
Thanks,
Simon
Thanks,
Simon
Sarca Anchor - Anybody used/bought one?
- Thread starter simon501
- Start date
cliff
Well-Known Member
Look around at other boats in your area - what do they use? Fastset?, CQR? what? I have looked at the Sarca type and feel they are gimmicky and over priced and thankfully not readily available over here. Might be popular in Oz but they are sailing in different waters to us.
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"Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity"
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kindredspirit
Well-Known Member
tugboat
Well-Known Member
That Bulwagga thing looks more like an April Fool spoof to me. It's not a very good pic, but I don't think I'd trust my pride and joy hanging on that in a bit of a blow!
GMac
Well-Known Member
SARCA = don't do it.
When they 1st came out a few people saw some potential problems and now a few years have ticked over these are popping up.
They set OK but that where any good things end. Poor holding. Very physically big for their weight and mighty Ugly.
And they arn't that popular down here just they seem to have a marketing budget the size of a small country.
When they 1st came out a few people saw some potential problems and now a few years have ticked over these are popping up.
They set OK but that where any good things end. Poor holding. Very physically big for their weight and mighty Ugly.
And they arn't that popular down here just they seem to have a marketing budget the size of a small country.
SlowlyButSurely
Well-Known Member
Why not replace it with one of the tried and trusted anchors eg. Bruce, CQR, Delta, Spade etc. Why go for something that's relatively unknown?
ccscott49
Well-Known Member
I dunno, it looks like, in the bigger sizes, quite good at burrowing??
webcraft
Well-Known Member
We have friends who have used one for a couple of seasons and they swear by it. It is a bit spade or delta like in shape but with a roll bar to help it set, and a cunning self-tripping facility so you never need to use a tripping line with it.
It IS a bit bulky and not very elegant however . . .
- Nick
It IS a bit bulky and not very elegant however . . .
- Nick
GMac
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
I dunno, it looks like, in the bigger sizes, quite good at burrowing??
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes they do burrow well until the shank is flush with the seabed then they stop and won't go down further. To get them fully below the seabed you'll have to dig a hole and put it in there.
If your happy anchoring in only the top foot or so of whatever is on the seabed go for one of these. If the bottom is nice and clean firmish stuff they are OK but only just.
FYI: on the cover of their broucher there are 4 boats with these anchors on them. 3 of these 4 boats have taken them off.
I dunno, it looks like, in the bigger sizes, quite good at burrowing??
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes they do burrow well until the shank is flush with the seabed then they stop and won't go down further. To get them fully below the seabed you'll have to dig a hole and put it in there.
If your happy anchoring in only the top foot or so of whatever is on the seabed go for one of these. If the bottom is nice and clean firmish stuff they are OK but only just.
FYI: on the cover of their broucher there are 4 boats with these anchors on them. 3 of these 4 boats have taken them off.
simon501
Well-Known Member
Thanks everyone, much appreciated. I think I'll paint my CQR with Hammerite!
Simon
Simon
duncan
Well-Known Member
sharpen it first - maybe a good shot blasting too?
craigsmith
Well-Known Member
The "other new-generation type" listed on our test page is a SARCA.
A SARCA is basically a plow (convex fluke) with a complex shank arrangement that requires a roll-bar to keep it right-side-up on account of the full length slot in the shank. It has no tip-weight and its design requires it to be resting flat on the surface for it to set.
The full-length slot is designed to allow you to retrieve the anchor once fouled on something. Whether this really works or not is debatable.
It may be a good solution for a small boat (runabout) for fishing etc, and this is where they are proving popular in Australia and New Zealand. However, not in our opinion a practical anchor for larger boats.
However, since you are clearly looking at anchor types other than the traditional ones, you should consider:
- Spade or Oceane
- Bulwagga
- Buegel / WASI
- Rocna
/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
You are on the right track, just don't get distracted
A SARCA is basically a plow (convex fluke) with a complex shank arrangement that requires a roll-bar to keep it right-side-up on account of the full length slot in the shank. It has no tip-weight and its design requires it to be resting flat on the surface for it to set.
The full-length slot is designed to allow you to retrieve the anchor once fouled on something. Whether this really works or not is debatable.
It may be a good solution for a small boat (runabout) for fishing etc, and this is where they are proving popular in Australia and New Zealand. However, not in our opinion a practical anchor for larger boats.
However, since you are clearly looking at anchor types other than the traditional ones, you should consider:
- Spade or Oceane
- Bulwagga
- Buegel / WASI
- Rocna
/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
You are on the right track, just don't get distracted
pmyatt
Well-Known Member
I have no experience of the Sarca but having seen several Wasi anchors in Turkey amd thinking of replacing my Delta with one - anyone any thoughts.
craigsmith
Well-Known Member
Yes.
The WASI is AKA the Buegel (developed by a German sometime ago), and is the "American version". No difference in design except the WASI is only available in stainless steel, which reduces strength slightly and makes it very expensive. Unless you want a shiny anchor for looks alone, you would be best to find a galvanized Buegel instead. There are many cheap knock-offs available, especially in the Mediterranean, but I would advise you avoid these and find an original. Poor quality steels, bad welding, and design short-cuts such as using a solid roll-bar (which messes up the dynamics of the anchor) abound.
Our testing shows the Buegel design to be quite acceptable. You can view the results on our website. Loosely speaking, it ranks above the old style anchors (plow and claw), but below the more sophisticated "new generation" anchors (Spade, Rocna, etc).
The Buegel design is very simple. It is relatively effective. It is cheap to make and therefore should be cheap to buy. These factors generate pros and cons.
<ul type="square">[*]The flat blade generates greater holding power per than any equivalent size plow (CQR) or claw (Bruce). It does not however give performance as good as a concave blade
[*]The roll-bar eliminates the need for dedicated tip-weight. This means more efficient use of steel when compared to a plow, for example. However the total lack of tip-weight and directional skids on the blade does limit the setting ability of this anchor
[*]The pointed tip means good penetration on tough seabed surfaces, such as weed. This is primarily responsible for its success and popularity in the Med. However it is not quite as sharp as it could be, and the smaller size Buegels particularly still have trouble cutting through grass and kelp etc
[*]The shank is basically straight, with no real vertical shape to it. This means good strength and easy construction, but limits the anchor's practicality; it can be difficult to store on your bow
[/list]With the Rocna, we have addressed all of the caveats listed above, while retaining the fundamental concept that we liked (the roll-bar). This makes an anchor that is both better and more expensive.
In conclusion then:
<ul type="square">[*]Avoid the WASI and try to find a Buegel original if you do not want stainless
[*]Yes the Buegel works very well and you will be pleased if you are used to a plow or claw
[*]There exist better anchors again
[/list]Let us know what you go with, and report back on your results.
The WASI is AKA the Buegel (developed by a German sometime ago), and is the "American version". No difference in design except the WASI is only available in stainless steel, which reduces strength slightly and makes it very expensive. Unless you want a shiny anchor for looks alone, you would be best to find a galvanized Buegel instead. There are many cheap knock-offs available, especially in the Mediterranean, but I would advise you avoid these and find an original. Poor quality steels, bad welding, and design short-cuts such as using a solid roll-bar (which messes up the dynamics of the anchor) abound.
Our testing shows the Buegel design to be quite acceptable. You can view the results on our website. Loosely speaking, it ranks above the old style anchors (plow and claw), but below the more sophisticated "new generation" anchors (Spade, Rocna, etc).
The Buegel design is very simple. It is relatively effective. It is cheap to make and therefore should be cheap to buy. These factors generate pros and cons.
<ul type="square">[*]The flat blade generates greater holding power per than any equivalent size plow (CQR) or claw (Bruce). It does not however give performance as good as a concave blade
[*]The roll-bar eliminates the need for dedicated tip-weight. This means more efficient use of steel when compared to a plow, for example. However the total lack of tip-weight and directional skids on the blade does limit the setting ability of this anchor
[*]The pointed tip means good penetration on tough seabed surfaces, such as weed. This is primarily responsible for its success and popularity in the Med. However it is not quite as sharp as it could be, and the smaller size Buegels particularly still have trouble cutting through grass and kelp etc
[*]The shank is basically straight, with no real vertical shape to it. This means good strength and easy construction, but limits the anchor's practicality; it can be difficult to store on your bow
[/list]With the Rocna, we have addressed all of the caveats listed above, while retaining the fundamental concept that we liked (the roll-bar). This makes an anchor that is both better and more expensive.
In conclusion then:
<ul type="square">[*]Avoid the WASI and try to find a Buegel original if you do not want stainless
[*]Yes the Buegel works very well and you will be pleased if you are used to a plow or claw
[*]There exist better anchors again
[/list]Let us know what you go with, and report back on your results.
pmyatt
Well-Known Member
Like the Rocna - good site. Very interested in the comment that a stainless steel anchor would be slightly less strong. Forever Freedom is a Freedom 38 and weighs in at about 11 1/2 tons in light cruising mode. I was considering a 25 kg stainless Wasi/Buegel attached to 10 mm stainless chain. Reasons for chosing stainless are that it is almost rust free and the chain does not "cone" in the chain locker in the same way that galvanised chain does. If the strength of stainless is an issue I shall have to have another think. In Germany a galvanised Buegel is about 280 euros and a stainless Wasi about 660 euros.
craigsmith
Well-Known Member
Thank you for your comment re our product/site.
Stainless will be less strong if the design is identical and you are comparing it to the right steels. For example, we use Australian BISALLOY-80 high tensile steel for the shank on the Rocna, which is an extremely strong load bearing steel, almost a "spring" steel. You cannot match this in stainless.
But, if you are comparing regular mild steel, then you can equal the strength by using the right stainless.
A 25Kg is about right, that is what we would recommend if you were buying a Rocna. You might get away with a 20.
Yes, stainless almost rust free. Here's a quote from GMac, who made an appearance above: "Rust, not really unless you buy it from Anzor or other chinese importers. They tend to leave too many dashboards in when recycling the steel. Good stainless does not 'rust' as such but can 'stain' especially when left in dark wet lockers. The stainless gets a 'lite rust' sort of colour happening on it. Something to do with oxidisation on the outer layer sort of thing I'm told."
You should not have problems with galvanized steel rusting until the zinc starts to disappear. Re-galvanizing once every five years or so is the name of the game.
Lastly, I urge you to seriously consider the issues I listed above with the Buegel design. The Buegel is a good cheap option, especially for those cruising the Mediterranean, but since it seems you are happy to make the investment, you should look more closely at more sophisticated designs - namely Spade and Rocna. A Rocna 20 is NZ$675, a 25 NZ$775 (approx €390 and €445 respectively) - Spade prices from their website.
Stainless will be less strong if the design is identical and you are comparing it to the right steels. For example, we use Australian BISALLOY-80 high tensile steel for the shank on the Rocna, which is an extremely strong load bearing steel, almost a "spring" steel. You cannot match this in stainless.
But, if you are comparing regular mild steel, then you can equal the strength by using the right stainless.
A 25Kg is about right, that is what we would recommend if you were buying a Rocna. You might get away with a 20.
Yes, stainless almost rust free. Here's a quote from GMac, who made an appearance above: "Rust, not really unless you buy it from Anzor or other chinese importers. They tend to leave too many dashboards in when recycling the steel. Good stainless does not 'rust' as such but can 'stain' especially when left in dark wet lockers. The stainless gets a 'lite rust' sort of colour happening on it. Something to do with oxidisation on the outer layer sort of thing I'm told."
You should not have problems with galvanized steel rusting until the zinc starts to disappear. Re-galvanizing once every five years or so is the name of the game.
Lastly, I urge you to seriously consider the issues I listed above with the Buegel design. The Buegel is a good cheap option, especially for those cruising the Mediterranean, but since it seems you are happy to make the investment, you should look more closely at more sophisticated designs - namely Spade and Rocna. A Rocna 20 is NZ$675, a 25 NZ$775 (approx €390 and €445 respectively) - Spade prices from their website.
pmyatt
Well-Known Member
Not knowing anything about this sort of engineering I just read the brochures! The Wasi anchor is made from AISI 316 Ti Stainless Steel (quote), and the chain is 316 SS Chain-DIn 766 (quote) - is that good?
craigsmith
Well-Known Member
Purely in terms of strength, not that good. It's about equivalent with mild steel.
Tensile Strength, Yield, SS 316Ti: 248 MPa
Tensile Strength, Yield, BISALLOY-80: 680 MPa
For bending aound an axis (simple model of how a shank might fail under extreme loading), the MPa measure is a direct multiplier factor in the equation, so the resulting torque that the steel is capable of sustaining is directly affected.
Tensile Strength, Yield, SS 316Ti: 248 MPa
Tensile Strength, Yield, BISALLOY-80: 680 MPa
For bending aound an axis (simple model of how a shank might fail under extreme loading), the MPa measure is a direct multiplier factor in the equation, so the resulting torque that the steel is capable of sustaining is directly affected.
hylass
Well-Known Member
The SARCA anchor has been tested recently by the French magazine "Voiles Magazine"
see the comments:
results: No holding at all... /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
see the comments:
results: No holding at all... /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif