Saltram Saga 40,Advice needed.

[upcountry]

Thinking of biting the hard tack,and going heavey,and may have found the right boat. saga 40 but can find very little information on this design.
Anyone have any experience with this boat, good or bad. What design or build faults were there? if any.How does she handle under sail,and being a double ender,will she go astern under power predictably.?Any vices? Is 35hp big enough to push 13 ton? The list seems endless.
The builders, Skentleburys,Plymouth. stopped production early 90s after a fire so are no longer a source of information.
Hope someone can help. Many thanks in advance.

 

[Lizzie_B]

I would check with the YBW copyshop as there have been at least 2 articles in the last year or so reviewing the boat. Also a couple of years ago one of the regular 'Blue Water Letter' writers was actually circumnavigating in one. I seem to remember it being described as one of the definitive Blue Water boats. The fact that it stayed in production for so long is also another good indicator of its suitability for the task it was designed for. Good yacht guide describes them as 'handsome heavyweight cruisers, dedicated to serious passage making but with a useful turn of speed'

 

[Salty John]

No first hand experience but this is a boat I've heard a lot of good things about, and she looks great. Will she back down predictably? You must be joking! It's nothing to do with her being double ended - it's that she is a full bodied, heavy displacement boat and they just don't do astern. If you want agility under power you need a fin-keeled, spade-ruddered modern boat. But offshore in a blow I imagine the Saga is a joy. I reckon 1 HP per foot of waterline length is about right for a cruising boat so she is probably OK, but borderline.

 

[Mirelle]

Friend had an early one. After an Atlantic circuit, etc., he decided she was too big, and bought a 35, which he's still got. Nothing wrong with the 40; he just found the gear heavy.

 

[upcountry]

Thanks for that guys, I guess you have just reinforced what i already knew Its nice to have some confirmation. Ithink whats probably bothering me , is can i manage to sail this boat on my own. Am i being too optimistic?
Not too concerned once out at sea, but marinas, and mooring in general are giving me some concern. She is a big 40ft and 13+ ton after all.
I wouldnt call myself experienced, but i am reasonably confident in my own abilities. What do you guys think? am i biting off more than i can chew.?

 

[tugboat]

I see no reason why, with care, you shouldn't be able to handle her on your own. It's all a matter of practice, learning her handling characteristics and idiosychrasies and gaining confidence. The extra displacement could be an advantage berthing in a cross wind, but if you get things wrong or the engine packs up at a crucial moment 13 tons could do a lot of damage. If you already singlehand, you'll know about rigging fenders/check lines in advance - you'll just need to adapt your methods to the new boat. Maybe get a pal to be on board the first few times to standby while you practice.

 

[elenya]

HI We have a saga 40 and find it great. Yes it is a big boat for 40' but that gives lots of room inside. In a blow it is fantastic and stears and rides very well. great on any self steering gear. If you want to short tack up a river it is not the boat for you. as you may know it has a low aspect ratio rig so long boom and short mast. We find this great with the abillity to loose a big chunk of sail in the first reef. We have had full sail up in 40knots in the Hauraki Gulf and got a good fun reach in, not to be done normalybut we wanted to know what she would do. Handling in a marina is not fun as she is heavy and slow to turn. also with full rudder the prop wash misses the rudder. If you are going cruising then this is a good boat. As for going to windward it may not be as close winded as some others but we can sail on in conditions ather boats dare not push to windward at anything but a crawl.

As always its a personal choice. I love my friends Jeanneu around the harbour and on light days and the Saga for distances and windy days.

enjoy your cruising

 

[upcountry]

Elenya. Hi jim, Many thanks for your reply, As allways this forum seems to come up trumps, never ceases to amaze me. Good point about the prop wash , something i hadnt considered,but looking at the rudder configeration, it should have been obvious. If i could pick your brains some more,I notice ELENYA has a 42hp , do you find that adequate? Do you, can you, handle her on your own?
What wind strenth does she need to get moving? Is she heavy on the helm?
Is there any need for some form of strengthening under the mast [compression p
ost] Will an electric autopilot such as a simrad TP30 be man enough for the job?
Any other info you think is relevent would be much appreciated. Point of no return near ,purchase imminent. Hope you can find the time to reply. once again thanks for your help.

 

[elenya]

Hi Sorry for the delay but I only look at the forum every couple of weeks normaly.

42 hp is adequate, i think we get more like 30 hp looking at the engines curves for power. more would always be nice but we can motor into about 40' with this, not in the open sea but up to 2' fetch. I have handled her on my own but prefer a hand. a bow thruster would help this but it is still a long way to run to put lines on the run back.
she sails well in all wind strengths and will sail at about 4 knots true wind speed, about 2 knots boat speed reaching. That was without the genneacker.
Our mast has a 6"x 6" compression post of teak and a 3/4" structural bulkhead seems ok with only the smallest signs of settling over the years (1984 boat).
we often sail with the tiller lashed and this works very well. we have 'windpilot pacific' and autohelm 2000 both great.

I can recommend the boat 100%. try handlig it in the marina yourself first. slow and steady til tyou are happy before you buy. there is a good 2nd hand market so they are easy to sell and hold good price.

will post more if i get a chance

regards

 

[upcountry]

That will do for me Jim,Broker will now be very happy. Would love to hear more if you get the time.......


regards..

 

[Paragon]

Phil, FWIW I've just been through the same concerns etc as you are/have been going through with a Young Sun 43 which is 13+tons and a double ender, not that far apart from the Saltram. I did a test sail to find out and came to the following conclusions, under power no problem, mooring to bouy or anchor no problem. A marina would be more of a challenge and would depend on space between runs and local conditions but then with this size boat I'd probably try and avoid marinas.

Reversing is fine if you appreciate that you need way on to turn, the turn will not be pronounced and to do either you need some sea room. Prop wash can also be used to your advantage in turning, reversing and coming alongside.

If you singlehand a lot, like me, you'll already be in the right mind set of thinking ahead and being prepared well before lines are needed and you'd have them handy amid ships anyway, which is probably not that much different to your current boat.

After the trial sail I was very happy both with the boat and with my ability to handle her, one item I did think useful was the ability to drop the anchor from the cockpit in a controlled way (and likewise raise it) as the windless had duplicated controls there, something you may want to consider.

Anyway, enjoy, hope this helps.

Regards

John

 

[kiaraboat]

Hi, only discovered this forum today. We have been cruising a Saga 40 in the Pacific and Indian Oceans for the last ten years and I read with interest the replies to your query. Generaly I would agree, however the 1HP per foot waterline length is painfully inadequate. We replaced the old BMC 50HP with an Isuzu C240 at 56HP max and the difference has been outstanding. Like most boats, the weight of the helm is down to balance, get the sails trimmed right and she will steer herself in a straight line, but get her out of balance and the loads on the tiller will take the helsman off his feet. We reduce this problem by employing a trim tab afixed to the aft edge of the rudder controled and adjusted by an Autohelm 1000. The loads are such that the smallest and cheapest autohelm will steer a good course in all sea states, we, my wife and I, never hand steer, three Autohelms have brought us over 20000 miles effortlessly. Also, if you plan to singlehand, which I used to do, it is like having a crew member without the hastle. I envy the guy who gets good light airs performance, we don't, anything less than 10kts and we motor, our cruising planning figure is 120 miles per day and our record is 168 so she is no flyer but she gets you there safely and comfortably

 

[IKARUS]

Since one year I'm proud owner of a Saltram Saga 40. My experience with this boat is limited - we sailed her from the Netherlands to the Baltic Sea in summer last year. She performs quite good also in light winds because of her tall rig (mast is appr. 2m higher than standard) and her exellent set of sails made ba de Vries. Comming to the not so nice things - her behavour under engine especially backwards needs sometimes strong nerves. So I prefer to drop the ancor whenever possible than to enter one of these narrow modern marinas in windy conditions. Generally: gread quality, excellent craftmanship!

 

[upcountry]

Thanks for all your help and advice which i have read with great interest. A special thanks to those of you who own and sail SAGAS,who have taken the time to reply, Its fantastic to be able to tap into a resource such as this. Unfortunatly i have spent too much time on this forum, and not enough with the broker. Boat [which i now know is definitly the one for me] has gone to another lucky s-d. Im gutted!
So back to the small ads. The search continues.

 

[Whitty]

Hi been reading your post for a couple of days and it appears I'm a little late in replying as the saga you were wanting has gone. Just to let you know I am the proud owner of a Saga 40 Ketch and have been for the last 15 years. In answer to one of your queeries 'will she go astern under power'? The answer is yes, no problem as I fitted a bow thruster, expensive but worth it, as now she goes exactly where I want her to whatever the wind is doing.

Superb boat, keep on looking.

 

[upcountry]

Thanks for that Greybeard, I now feel even worse.!!!!!!