RYA Yachtmaster/Day Skipper

[archiemaxmac]

Hi All,

I'm currently deciding whether I should go for my Day Skipper or coastal Yacht Masters.

I've had a look at the criteria for both and I feel comfortable with the course content in the Yacht Masters.

I've had over 10 years plus of costal motor boat navigation around the west cost of Scotland, reading the weather/tides etc and got a good amount of sailing miles with my uncles 36ft yacht + a lot of dinghy racing expense !

If anyone has any thoughts on what I should do or what might be best please drop a message.

All the best.

 

[Sticky Fingers]

Yachtmaster requires much more theoretical knowledge, and much more prerequisite experience, than day skipper. Do you already have YM offshore theory? Take a look at the pre-reqs for YM Coastal practical before you consider whether to go for it, obviously if you’re comfortable and can demonstrate the necessary passagemaking experience and theoretical knowledge then you should do the YM. It’s a much more ‘valuable’ ie hard to achieve qualification.

Without knowing any more about you, my guess would be that as you’re asking this question then you’re nowhere near ready for YM. Apologies if I read that wrong.

 

[ylop]

Hi All,

I'm currently deciding whether I should go for my Day Skipper or coastal Yacht Masters.

I’d ask that question of the instructor, a decent company should be able to advise you (and won’t just steer you to do both for ££) - some would take you on a mixed course of DS/CS/CC people and determine in reality which you are at during the training.

I've had over 10 years plus of costal motor boat navigation around the west cost of Scotland, reading the weather/tides etc and got a good amount of sailing miles with my uncles 36ft yacht + a lot of dinghy racing expense !

How much experience do you have of night sailing and operating “watches”? Day Skipper and YM are as much about managing the boat and crew as they are about actual sailing ability.

 

[RunAgroundHard]

Do you meet the qualifying criteria and can demonstrate application of knowledge from any part of the syllabus of the shore based and practical courses.

If you can, then go for it.

 

[KompetentKrew]

I think Coastal Skipper is in the middle - same theory test / syllabus as YM Coastal but less strict? That's what I have - the instructor at my club told me I was probably ready for that when the Day Skipper was coming up.

In my experience there are lots of people on the crewing sites who basically only have crewing experience + a Day Skipper cert from a 1-week course. So from what you've written you're a bit beyond the level of the typical Day Skip.

 

[Dellquay13]

Hi All,

I'm currently deciding whether I should go for my Day Skipper or coastal Yacht Masters.

I've had a look at the criteria for both and I feel comfortable with the course content in the Yacht Masters.

I've had over 10 years plus of costal motor boat navigation around the west cost of Scotland, reading the weather/tides etc and got a good amount of sailing miles with my uncles 36ft yacht + a lot of dinghy racing expense !

If anyone has any thoughts on what I should do or what might be best please drop a message.

All the best.

Do you mean the YM Coastal Skipper 5day practical course (like the 5day DS but including night passages and secondary ports etc) or the YM Coastal formal assessment with its requirements for 800sea miles logged, vhf src, first aid etc?

 

[ylop]

I think Coastal Skipper is in the middle - sane theory test / syllabus as YM Coastal but less strict?

YM (coastal) is a new name (rebrand) for Coastal Skipper.

 

[KompetentKrew]

YM (coastal) is a new name (rebrand) for Coastal Skipper.

Excuse me, then. Piece of piss for OP in that case.

Just do the theory with www.skippersonline.net

 

[RunAgroundHard]

Coastal Skipper is a practical course where a completion certificate is awarded if the student addresses all the syllabus satisfactorily. Only accessed via an RYA recognised training centre that offers this course.

Yachtmaster Coastal is an MCA endorsed certificate of competency, awarded if the student passes the practical examination. Examiners are appointed by the RYA. The student has to organise their own boat and examiner via the RYA. Not performed or organised at a recognised training centre. The RTC may facilitate arrangements of the exam, and even offer non RYA preparation courses, but it is the candidate that is responsible.

The OP should obtain the log book RYA Yachtmaster Scheme Syllabus and Logbook which contains all the information that is needed to make a decision.

 

[KompetentKrew]

Coastal Skipper is a practical course where a completion certificate is awarded if the student addresses all the syllabus satisfactorily. Only accessed via an RYA recognised training centre that offers this course.

Yachtmaster Coastal is an MCA endorsed certificate of competency, awarded if the student passes the practical examination. Examiners are appointed by the RYA. The student has to organise their own boat and examiner via the RYA. Not performed or organised at a recognised training centre. The RTC may facilitate arrangements of the exam, and even offer non RYA preparation courses, but it is the candidate that is responsible.

The OP should obtain the log book RYA Yachtmaster Scheme Syllabus and Logbook which contains all the information that is needed to make a decision.

This is what I thought. Thank you @RunAgroundHard.

As I said, OP should have no problems with Coastal Skipper.

 

[Sticky Fingers]

YM (coastal) is a new name (rebrand) for Coastal Skipper.

No it’s not.

YM is an examined assessment. Coastal skipper is a course completion certificate.

 

[RunAgroundHard]

No it’s not.

YM is an examined assessment. Coastal skipper is a course completion certificate.

However, ylop is not not exactly wrong either because the examined YM Coastal used to be called just Coastal Skipper and there was confusion with the course completion certificate, also called Coastal Skipper, and the examined course. I am happy to be corrected on the previous examined CoC name, but that is my recollection and it and why the RYA moved to YM Coastal for the examined CoC, as well as brand management.

 

[ylop]

No it’s not.

YM is an examined assessment. Coastal skipper is a course completion certificate.

Yes I’ll admit the RYA/MCA have managed to confuse me with their rebrand. However YM(coastal) is not/should not be a level above Coastal Skipper - an experienced sailor with the right attitude who completes Coastal Skipper should be able pass YM(Coastal).

I suppose what it does mean is the OP has a second question - is he likely looking for training or a certificate? If it’s a certificate and he is experienced - could he just do YM(Coastal). I suspect without any prep course that might be difficult - much like an experienced driver passing their driving test without someone pointing out the behaviours they need to explicitly demonstrate (or avoid).

 

[Sailing steve]

I took and passed my YM Theory course 25 years ago.

At least 90% of the course content was way, way over the top of the level of knowledge you'll need to get a small boat safely from A to B IMO. If you want to test yourself purely academically at the highest level then sure go ahead with YM Theory but don't expect to ever actually be able to sail a course to plus or minus one degree or ever have any desperate need to calculate secondary port tidal heights to within a few mm for example, which is the level of precision expected of course participants.

Far better I'd say to spend your beer tokens on a practical course of some sort instead

 

[Sticky Fingers]

Yes I’ll admit the RYA/MCA have managed to confuse me with their rebrand. However YM(coastal) is not/should not be a level above Coastal Skipper - an experienced sailor with the right attitude who completes Coastal Skipper should be able pass YM(Coastal).

I suppose what it does mean is the OP has a second question - is he likely looking for training or a certificate? If it’s a certificate and he is experienced - could he just do YM(Coastal). I suspect without any prep course that might be difficult - much like an experienced driver passing their driving test without someone pointing out the behaviours they need to explicitly demonstrate (or avoid).

Yup, agree with that,

 

[Sticky Fingers]

I took and passed my YM Theory course 25 years ago.

At least 90% of the course content was way, way over the top of the level of knowledge you'll need to get a small boat safely from A to B IMO. If you want to test yourself purely academically at the highest level then sure go ahead with YM Theory but don't expect to ever actually be able to sail a course to plus or minus one degree or ever have any desperate need to calculate secondary port tidal heights to within a few mm for example, which is the level of precision expected of course participants.

Far better I'd say to spend your beer tokens on a practical course of some sort instead

That's maybe true, but the YM examiner will be looking for a level of theoretical knowledge at or around the YM Theory level, not at Day Skipper theory level nor what you might randomly happen to pick up. So if the OP wants to do an examined Yachtmaster Coastal as distinct from Coastal Skipper (using today's names and meanings), it's futile going for it if theory knowledge isn't up to the necessary level because he will likely fail.

 

[ylop]

I took and passed my YM Theory course 25 years ago.

At least 90% of the course content was way, way over the top of the level of knowledge you'll need to get a small boat safely from A to B IMO. If you want to test yourself purely academically at the highest level then sure go ahead with YM Theory but don't expect to ever actually be able to sail a course to plus or minus one degree or ever have any desperate need to calculate secondary port tidal heights to within a few mm for example, which is the level of precision expected of course participants.

Far better I'd say to spend your beer tokens on a practical course of some sort instead

Perhaps, BUT

- you surely weren’t calculating tidal heights to mm were you? Id expect that part of the learning was the effect of wind and atmospheric pressure on tidal height and therefore the confidence interval on your calculation/estimates?
- calculating/plotting a course to 1 deg of precision and being able to execute it to that accuracy are very different things. More important would be knowing how accurately you can execute it and what that “window of Error might mean you hit and how to mitigate that (with clearing lines, extra waypoints etc).
- there’s more to YM theory than chart work - col regs, lights, weather
- there’s lots of places you could get away with the short “navigation essentials” course and be able to make A-B passages - but to almost understand where the limitations of that are you need to have done something a bit more!
- it does feel as though YM has been a bit left behind by modern electronic aids, but if you are on a boat when everything fails, knowing there’s something to fall back on would be quite reassuring.

 

[Sticky Fingers]

...
- it does feel as though YM has been a bit left behind by modern electronic aids, but if you are on a boat when everything fails, knowing there’s something to fall back on would be quite reassuring.

I agree. I did mine some years ago and even then I was frustrated by the blind eye that was turned to any electronic support. The Digital First initiative might change this but it's going to take time.

 

[RunAgroundHard]

The shore based theory courses do focus on accuracy with, fixes, CTS and tidal heights precise calculations, for example. Answers are precise and transparent overlays were used to verify plot accuracy. The students are taught that practical navigation has errors and uncertainty.

 

[Sticky Fingers]

Exactly so.