Rocna and sticky mud.

[NormanS]

Lots of food for thought.
Generally we try to get the anchor right first time. Having a very slow manual windlass encourages that!
So we aim to have it touch the bottom whimsy we are not moving, and then if the conditions are light I will feed the chain out through the hawse hole hand over hand to match the died that we are drifting back. In stronger conditions I'll use the brake on the windlass instead. I don't like to let us build up too much speed, since once I apply the brake there's a big load on the windlass.
Having veered a minimum 3:1, I'll then take a few turns around the samson post and gently take up the strain in astern, before applying around 2000rpm for a couple of minutes.
Next, I'll tie on the snubber and then veer additional chain until the load is on the snubber and the chain has a big bight of slack.

Any thoughts on my technique would be appreciated. It works 99% of the time, but in the last few weeks we've had horrible squalls touching 50kts and as I am explained above the Rocna has finally proven itself to be less than bulletproof.

I would develop a system that doesn't involve anyone's hands coming in contact with the chain. For instance, I have a slotted chain stopper on a short strop, which removes the need to take turns round a post, and also the need to lift the chain off the gypsy. The chain is pressed down into the slot with the sole of my shoe.
A huge contribution to technique is to use a fishfinder to ensure that the anchor goes onto a clear bit of ground. That's a couple of suggestions.

 

[NormanS]

I have always felt that the amount of mud that comes to the surface on the anchor, has little to do with the design of the anchor, and everything to do with the type of mud, and to an extent, the depth of water.
I carry three different types of anchors, and in this respect, they all behave much the same.
If anchored in sand, I don't even bother to connect the deck-wash hose, as I know it won't be needed. That's the nature of sand.
In good sticky mud, I expect to have to wash both chain and anchor.
Soft sloppy mud, where most or all the mud falls off, I tend not to trust as an anchorage for extreme conditions.

 

[doug748]

Have to agree the six months most days we been using our Manson in very muddy sea bed our too mostly come up covered in mud but saying that we not so far had a problem with it resetting .
We might do in the future who knows .
Also the mud isn't caked on the bottom but on top and considering it been buried in thick sticky mud I'm not really that suprise.
A few weeks ago I see a SS Spade hauled up it too had mud stuck to it .

Indeed, some mud is probably unctuous enough to stick to anything, Though some designs seem to be more prone than others, it's the big ball thing, as mentioned by asteven, that may well cause reset problems.

On another tack. I don't think that pulling on the anchor with maximum reverse revs is particularly needed to set an anchor properly. Many distinguished sailors don't do this and some can't, being engineless.
What backing up on the anchor at high revs is doing is testing the set of the anchor and the bed it has settled on, which is much better than finding out the hard way. Hence Kelpie has set his anchor fine but has been let down only by the anchor or the chance nature of the seabed. I believe he would not improve his by doing different - thought he could well have exposed a problem with the holding in advance.

I have an Epsilon and a Rocna and both have brought up heavy clods of clay/mud (as described by Poignard) out of the bottom of the River Tamar. I just can't believe that "shedding" anchors like the Spade or Excel would come up much cleaner.
.

 

[Roberto]

[/QUOTE]
In stronger conditions I'll use the brake on the windlass instead. I don't like to let us build up too much speed, since once I apply the brake there's a big load on the windlass.
[/QUOTE]
I always use the clutch of the windlass to let it out, with wind/tide the boat immediately starts going back and possibly positions beam to wind, that's where I quickly attach a chain hook with a short strop and let it take the strain of the chain getting straighter as the anchor sets and the boat comes to a sudden stop. On some occasions, the amount of stretching, shrieking and suffering of the strop seems to indicate that had I left the windlass take the strain it would all have ended in the water with a piece of the bow. Once done,I attach the proper long snubber.
The strop is very useful again when weighing anchor with some chop and the bow ging up and down, especially if the anchor is buried the strop will handle a lot better the boat movement than the windlass.

+1 to always wear gloves and shoes and limit as much as possible any contact with the chain, it's good to find again 10+10 fingers at the end of the anchoring

 

[sailaboutvic]

Lots of food for thought.
Generally we try to get the anchor right first time. Having a very slow manual windlass encourages that!
So we aim to have it touch the bottom whimsy we are not moving, and then if the conditions are light I will feed the chain out through the hawse hole hand over hand to match the died that we are drifting back. In stronger conditions I'll use the brake on the windlass instead. I don't like to let us build up too much speed, since once I apply the brake there's a big load on the windlass.
Having veered a minimum 3:1, I'll then take a few turns around the samson post and gently take up the strain in astern, before applying around 2000rpm for a couple of minutes.
Next, I'll tie on the snubber and then veer additional chain until the load is on the snubber and the chain has a big bight of slack.

Any thoughts on my technique would be appreciated. It works 99% of the time, but in the last few weeks we've had horrible squalls touching 50kts and as I am explained above the Rocna has finally proven itself to be less than bulletproof.

OK if you don't mind me saying , there one problem I can see , your 3:1 scope.
I would drop a min of 5:1 especially in the type of winds your talking about .
I give that a good go before given up on the Ronca .
TBH I know there lots of talk on these forum about what anchor and what does what in what ,
But there not that much difference I feel in most NG anchors and my view is most of the time , it's user fault why an anchor drag rather then the anchor it self .
There a very old saying you probably heard chain in the locker does no good .
Just to add , when your working out depth, I take it you also taken in account water to bow distance in that cal ?
It could easily be another 1.5 to 2 mts

 

[sailaboutvic]

In stronger conditions I'll use the brake on the windlass instead. I don't like to let us build up too much speed, since once I apply the brake there's a big load on the windlass.
[/QUOTE]
I always use the clutch of the windlass to let it out, with wind/tide the boat immediately starts going back and possibly positions beam to wind, that's where I quickly attach a chain hook with a short strop and let it take the strain of the chain getting straighter as the anchor sets and the boat comes to a sudden stop. On some occasions, the amount of stretching, shrieking and suffering of the strop seems to indicate that had I left the windlass take the strain it would all have ended in the water with a piece of the bow. Once done,I attach the proper long snubber.
The strop is very useful again when weighing anchor with some chop and the bow ging up and down, especially if the anchor is buried the strop will handle a lot better the boat movement than the windlass.

+1 to always wear gloves and shoes and limit as much as possible any contact with the chain, it's good to find again 10+10 fingers at the end of the anchoring
[/QUOTE]
Roberto I have to comend you on wearing shoes and glove ,
I have to say we not worn gloves when anchoring in god know how many years probably since we had electric windlass as for shoes it only now since we been back in northern Europe .
The aim also Been to keep hand and feet away from the windlass and chain and that been brainwash in anyone I had on my boats .
But well done you .

 

[Roberto]

It dates back to Alain Colas (racer during the same years as Tabarly and company): after a lot of ocean races, he anchored its boat (can't remember which one but surely quite big) in calm conditions, the chain wrapped around his leg and he lost one foot. Sort of stamped in the permanent memory.

Roberto I have to comend you on wearing shoes and glove ,

 

[Bouba]

It dates back to Alain Colas (racer during the same years as Tabarly and company): after a lot of ocean races, he anchored its boat (can't remember which one but surely quite big) in calm conditions, the chain wrapped around his leg and he lost one foot. Sort of stamped in the permanent memory.

Safety is a big concern for us...the wife is up front with the anchor...I’m at the helm with the winch controls...when she is ready to remove the safety line from the shackle, she looks at me... I then raise both hands and show them to her so that she knows that I won’t accidentally activate the winch...she then steps back away from the bow and I lower the anchor using the winch...this way the winch motor is exercised and if it doesn’t work then there’s no point in putting the Rocna on the sea floor

 

[sailaboutvic]

My policy as always been one person deal with the anchor , even if we have visitor and someone goes forward with her I call them back .
It give me the shakes when I see two people on the bow one with the control the other messing with the anchor or chain , it's an accident waiting to happen .

 

[Kelpie]

It's funny, I don't get quite the same feeling of dread about the chain.
Maybe because in my old job I used to use heavy plant? I've stood beside a 3t capstan as it snapped a brand new piece of 18mm seasteel. That was pretty scary.
Whilst feeding the chain out by hand, you get a pretty good feel for the forces involved. I think basic self preservation kicks in when it becomes too much to handle.

Lacking an electric windlass, we make a lot of use of the engine when anchoring. So we have good coordination between helm and bow. If the chain is anything other than straight up and down there's no point even touching it.

 

[vyv_cox]

Lacking an electric windlass, we make a lot of use of the engine when anchoring. So we have good coordination between helm and bow. If the chain is anything other than straight up and down there's no point even touching it.

I did this only yesterday when the key between the motor and gearbox in my windlass fell into the anchor locker! Lifting 10 metres of chain and a 16 kg anchor is quite hard work.

 

[Kelpie]

I did this only yesterday when the key between the motor and gearbox in my windlass fell into the anchor locker! Lifting 10 metres of chain and a 16 kg anchor is quite hard work.

It is! We've got 10mm and a 25kg anchor.
It certainly encourages choosing your spot carefully, and avoiding the deep end of any anchorage...

 

[Neeves]

For the dangers of Windlass

https://www.news.com.au/national/ns...r/news-story/f999c5d9540376dfceedc1d8709cfee7

Jonathan

 

[vyv_cox]

For the dangers of Windlass

https://www.news.com.au/national/ns...r/news-story/f999c5d9540376dfceedc1d8709cfee7

Jonathan

Having trapped a finger in our windlass myself, strangely almost exactly where I am now but about 12 years ago, I know it was entirely my fault, although we were in a trying situation. I did just what he seems to have done, pressed the wrong foot switch.

 

[Kelpie]

See also, electric sheet winches...