Repair of Scheiber Electronic Switching/Circuit Breakers?

[FullCircle]

have a Scheiber panel with electronic switching and circuit breaking in my Jeanneau.
I dropped a screwdriver across one on the on/off switch units yesterday and it went pop.

Jeanneau will sel me a new unit for £90 and 3-4 week wait.

Anybody know of a place where I can get it looked at and repaired. Look like standard components to me

View attachment 43446

 

[MoodySabre]

The circuit breakers are made by Tyco.

It might be worth giving this place a call http://www.alltronics.co.uk/ they'e in the industrial estate near St Laurences church.

 

[philip_stevens]

The components with PCD-112D1MH are Chinese, and a google looks as though they can only come from China in bulk.

Try an email?Pm to Halcyon of KDD PowerCentre http://www.kddpowercentre.co.uk in Cornwall. He may be able to assist you.

 

[nigelmercier]

The components with PCD-112D1MH are Chinese, and a google looks as though they can only come from China in bulk...

Not so: http://uk.farnell.com/te-connectivity/pcd-112d2mh/relay-pcb-spno-12vdc/dp/1023960?Ntt=PCD-112D2MH

And they are relays. How does this work, does one button do on and the other off?

 

[FullCircle]

Not so: http://uk.farnell.com/te-connectivity/pcd-112d2mh/relay-pcb-spno-12vdc/dp/1023960?Ntt=PCD-112D2MH

And they are relays. How does this work, does one button do on and the other off?

Yes Nigel, that is exactly how they work.

 

[pvb]

So any idea which bit went pop? Can't see that the switches themselves would be damaged. Nor the relays. Does anything look a bit singed?

 

[nigelmercier]

So any idea which bit went pop? Can't see that the switches themselves would be damaged. Nor the relays. Does anything look a bit singed?

What is on the other side of the PCB?

 

[FullCircle]

So any idea which bit went pop? Can't see that the switches themselves would be damaged. Nor the relays. Does anything look a bit singed?

Nothing singed, but it is the top of the three identical units. Sadly, the power feed to the lower 2 is fed from the one at the top.

As I said, I dropped a screwdriver on the back face, it made a bit of a wobbly noise and stopped. There are no components on the other side, just the track and the soldered legs.
I am guessing it is one of the major looking bits that has gone.

 

[theoldsalt]

Not so: http://uk.farnell.com/te-connectivity/pcd-112d2mh/relay-pcb-spno-12vdc/dp/1023960?Ntt=PCD-112D2MH

It does state "no longer manufactured"

 

[nigelmercier]

It does state "no longer manufactured"

So it does. That bit didn't load when I looked. There is a data sheet though, so should be easy to find a replacement.

However, the fault is not yet known, and I can't see how it does what it does, unless the logic is elsewhere.


[EDIT] D'OH! It obviously uses a NC push-button switch to switch off, see Chris's post #19 below...

 

[savageseadog]

Look like pretty standard bits to me. Are you sure there's still power to this? It sounds from what you say that you've popped a fuse somewhere before or are they all breakers?

 

[pvb]

Are they in fact breakers, ie current-limiting devices? If there's only a couple of switches and a relay, how does that work?

 

[nigelmercier]

Are they in fact breakers, ie current-limiting devices?

Unless there is current sensing circuitry in the main board, then no.

 

[pvb]

Unless there is current sensing circuitry in the main board, then no.

So if it's basically just a relay controlled by a couple of push button switches, what's the point of it? Why would they fit that rather than a simple switch? I'm confused by this - there are mentions of this panel on other forums, including mention of transistors, but I can't see any transistors on FC's photo, and he said there are no components on the other side of the board.

 

[nigelmercier]

So if it's basically just a relay controlled by a couple of push button switches, what's the point of it? Why would they fit that rather than a simple switch? I'm confused by this - there are mentions of this panel on other forums, including mention of transistors, but I can't see any transistors on FC's photo, and he said there are no components on the other side of the board.

There must be another board with the logic to control the relays: SR bistable and possibly current sensing.

[EDIT] Nope, it uses a NC push-button switch, see Chris's post #19 below...

 

[pvb]

There must be another board with the logic to control the relays: SR bistable and possibly current sensing.

There isn't. The "circuit breaker" board is fed from a simple fused supply. Look at the wiring diagram in Jeanneau owners manuals.

 

[nigelmercier]

The "circuit breaker" board is fed from a simple fused supply. Look at the wiring diagram in Jeanneau owners manuals.

In that case I'm baffled as to how it works. Don't have a Jeanneau owners manual.

[EDIT] IDIOT! I'm beginning to think I'm going mad, as I now remember making one of these some time ago. No idea why I didn't think of a NC push button, see later posts.

 

[FullCircle]

In that case I'm baffled as to how it works. Don't have a Jeanneau owners manual.

I do, but it's........ on the boat. Will check at the weekend.

 

[chriscallender]

In that case I'm baffled as to how it works. Don't have a Jeanneau owners manual.

One way it might work is that once the coil of the relay is energised by pressing a normally open switch and the switched 12v output comes on, this is fed back into the coil of the relay. Then the relay remains on until another (normally closed) push switch in the feedback to the coil interrupts the current to the coil. Hard to explain without a picture, but I mean the relay latches itself.

Only benefit I could see of that arrangement over a simple switch is that if will always revert back to off state. Maybe that makes sense for a boat, so if you switch off the main battery switch, then switch it back on again, all the circuits start up swicthed off. Sounds a kind of complicated way to switch a circuit on and off to me though .

If that is how it works and the faulty part is definitely on this board, then either the normally closed swicth got shorted and burnt out internally such that it is not normally closed any more. Then the coil can never be energised. Or else the switch side of the relay got fried. But my bet would be that there is a fuse somewhere else and the whole board isn't getting any juice (especially if none of the 3 circuits on it work).

 

[FullCircle]

One way it might work is that once the coil of the relay is energised by pressing a normally open switch and the switched 12v output comes on, this is fed back into the coil of the relay. Then the relay remains on until another (normally closed) push switch in the feedback to the coil interrupts the current to the coil. Hard to explain without a picture, but I mean the relay latches itself.

Only benefit I could see of that arrangement over a simple switch is that if will always revert back to off state. Maybe that makes sense for a boat, so if you switch off the main battery switch, then switch it back on again, all the circuits start up swicthed off. Sounds a kind of complicated way to switch a circuit on and off to me though .

If that is how it works and the faulty part is definitely on this board, then either the normally closed swicth got shorted and burnt out internally such that it is not normally closed any more. Then the coil can never be energised. Or else the switch side of the relay got fried. But my bet would be that there is a fuse somewhere else and the whole board isn't getting any juice (especially if none of the 3 circuits on it work).

Chris, that is the way it works, when the battery is switched back on, nothing is on. Also, these switches are resetting circuit breakers, rated at 15a. The top switch contains the power feed to the other 2 switches by cascade. There is no fuse anywhere else, and this is one of 6 identical boards in the whole panel. Just moving the too board plugs to the next one down proved that all circuits remained functional.