Problems

[sailaboutvic]

Problems and more problems that's boats for you .
We was having dinner on a US friends boat last night with other couple and talk turned into boat problem we had this season ,
I thought We had more then our share this year , with the on going windlass breaker tipping although it's only trip twice this year in six months of constant anchoring ,
the course computer packing up and the other day the engine stopped without a reason or should I say without finding what the reason was .
Fingers cross it was just say , for F@@@ sake Vic I need a break .

But then I started listening to the problems they had over the season , and thought our problem where nothing compared to theirs .
Our full cost of repairs €500 , theirs rans into thousands .
With a list of repairs still to do , crack mast, engine over haul, all sorts of electronic problems
Cooker replacements,ongoing fridges problems water leaks ,rigging,
Maybe things aren't as bad after all .


Finger cross our is just down to copper coating the hull , replacing the odd sea cock and stripping the propellor replacing bearing and the normal winter service of equipment

 

[John 32i]

Hi Vic, yes there is always something with boats! We started the season with a cracked exhaust elbow - not major but lost a few days sailing over Easter - been pretty lucky since until last week the wind indicator stopped working- turns out the sheets have chafed through the wires at the bottom of the mast, temporary repair done with a soldering iron but need to run new wires really. Hey ho could be worse :encouragement:

 

[Lucy52]

Tell me.

I got rid if the Deep sea Seal and replaced it with a Radice Volvo seal. When I drew the prop shaft back and found slight pitting in line with the cutlass lands, grrr. Then found the engine raw water inlet has a plated brass sea cock, double grr. I can grind the skin fitting off but to hold the angle on the new one and do it up I will have to disconnect the house bank and disassemble the battery box.

The old yard hand said, You will never finish a boat, the boat will finish you.”

PBO forum for shaft pitting.

 

[Poignard]

[...]

The old yard hand said, You will never finish a boat, the boat will finish you.”

[...].

How true

 

[Graham376]

Talking to a guy at social gathering last evening who had a very simple fault turn expensive. Heading south from Cascais single handed, found his engine panel was completely dead so, he tried to sail back but couldn't make headway against wind which had gone to north and increased. Called CG who organised a tow which for 5 hours tow boat time with 2 crew cost over €4,000! Turned out the battery to engine cable had fractured where it couldn't be seen.

 

[capnsensible]

I reckon since May 1998 when we bought our liveaboard yacht, we've spent nearly as much refitting as the boat cost in the first place!

My school boat, now sold, probably around 40%.

Wish I hadnt read this thead!

 

[johnalison]

There was one occasion out of the twenty years we have owned the boat from new when we were within a mile of our home marina after three months away and my wife said what I had been thinking. "Nothing has gone wrong in three months. Isn't that amazing?". With still a mile to go I was sorely tempted to throw my lady-Jonah overboard.

 

[vyv_cox]

The cost of renewing components that are specifically 'yacht' is astounding. Last season we had a few problems furling the genoa. It looked like the bearings in the top swivel were rather worn, so I enquired about a replacement. £500!! For an inner and outer bush, two bearings and seals. In other branches of engineering the cost is probably not even three figures.

 

[Graham376]

Expensive couple of years for us, last year new outboard £1,600, this year new panels + 100/30 MPPT + 4 T105s, around £1,200.

 

[sailaboutvic]

Expensive couple of years for us, last year new outboard £1,600, this year new panels + 100/30 MPPT + 4 T105s, around £1,200.

New dinghy and outboard is our next buy but not till next year , unless a bargain falls on my lap .

 

[Yngmar]

It also greatly depends on how much you can (or want to) do yourself. We've met people with minor rudder problems that turned into a €20k expense orgy with three haulouts in three different countries because they had received a bad bodge fix in one place, a bad repair (that was supposed to be the proper repair but wasn't) and then finally a proper repair of their steering system (bearings and a couple other things). Talking to them left me with absolutely no doubt that in all three places the yards had (correctly) sensed they had little technical knowledge, were rather hands off and perhaps also a bit too intimidated by it all to argue over prices in non-native languages, so they got stung with excessive costs for all three jobs (oh big problems sir, had to get in specialist, order more parts, take another week in the yard, etc.), and bad work on the first two to boot.

Having done a similar job on our own boat, the costs were just the haulout (which was done for other reasons too) and the parts, in total under €1k. Helps doing it only once too.

Same for applying Coppercoat, where the paint costs maybe twice as much as conventional antifouling, but the preparation and application cost is staggering (and then the professionals sometimes mess it up and it ends up not working).

Anything involving new instruments, autopilot, etc. is however annoyingly costly and even the absolute stingy sailor that I am, I haven't yet found a good solution for this, other than building my own Even NASA marine is on the expensive side for what's in those little ABS boxes, and the Raymarine/Navico/Garmin prices are simply outrageous.

 

[sailaboutvic]

It also greatly depends on how much you can (or want to) do yourself. We've met people with minor rudder problems that turned into a €20k expense orgy with three haulouts in three different countries because they had received a bad bodge fix in one place, a bad repair (that was supposed to be the proper repair but wasn't) and then finally a proper repair of their steering system (bearings and a couple other things). Talking to them left me with absolutely no doubt that in all three places the yards had (correctly) sensed they had little technical knowledge, were rather hands off and perhaps also a bit too intimidated by it all to argue over prices in non-native languages, so they got stung with excessive costs for all three jobs (oh big problems sir, had to get in specialist, order more parts, take another week in the yard, etc.), and bad work on the first two to boot.

Having done a similar job on our own boat, the costs were just the haulout (which was done for other reasons too) and the parts, in total under €1k. Helps doing it only once too.

Same for applying Coppercoat, where the paint costs maybe twice as much as conventional antifouling, but the preparation and application cost is staggering (and then the professionals sometimes mess it up and it ends up not working).

Anything involving new instruments, autopilot, etc. is however annoyingly costly and even the absolute stingy sailor that I am, I haven't yet found a good solution for this, other than building my own Even NASA marine is on the expensive side for what's in those little ABS boxes, and the Raymarine/Navico/Garmin prices are simply outrageous.

Electronic!! Couldn't agree more , when my Course computer packed , I didn't think it be such a big expense , a quick search on Raymarine site came up with a refurbished ACU 400 with 2 year warranty, £650 ok quite a bit of money but not as bad as buying a new system , then I found out I needed a new core sensor another 500 plus , didn't stop there , although they say I can use my old st60 controller with the AUC400 what not said is you can't set up the AUC with out a P70 controller another 500plus and on it goes sea talk to sea takNG another 160 Extra back bone Cables all this plus Vat ,before you know it you very close to a new system.
Lucy for us we found a S3G at a good price .
Copper coat , well this is some thing we done before , and plain to do our self again only this time we have no intention of removing the old AF , so we letting the yard do this under my supervision.
If you want CC to say on it's all in the preparation that hull got to be 100% clean and this is where many go wrong .

 

[DownWest]

Talking to a guy at social gathering last evening who had a very simple fault turn expensive. Heading south from Cascais single handed, found his engine panel was completely dead so, he tried to sail back but couldn't make headway against wind which had gone to north and increased. Called CG who organised a tow which for 5 hours tow boat time with 2 crew cost over €4,000! Turned out the battery to engine cable had fractured where it couldn't be seen.

Ah.. he phoned me when it wouldn't start and I gave him a quick guide to jump starting it by flashing the starter terminals. Prob was, the starter was out of reach. He did manage when tied up, but couldn't get to it under way. The cable that fractured was from the alternator to the block, as the alt was not earthed through the casing. For reasons best known to the lecky who fitted it, it earthed the panel too.

 

[grumpygit]

We all get or have had problems from time to time, but we just have to bite the bullet. If you are not practical and can't maintain and service your own boat the costs can be horrendous.

Sailing equates to. . . . . Never has there been a more expensive way to travel for free!!

 

[Graham376]

If you are not practical and can't maintain and service your own boat the costs can be horrendous.

Very true but increasingly a sign of the times. For many of us older folks who grew up in the post war period, the only way to afford a car or bike was to do our own servicing and maintenance. These days, more folks are used to paying for them to be serviced so don't have to learn how they work.

I actually came across a guy heading for the ARC who didn't know where his engine oil dip-stick was. Seemed a bit put out when I joked about "I'm talking to him".

 

[Malish]

Very true but increasingly a sign of the times. For many of us older folks who grew up in the post war period, the only way to afford a car or bike was to do our own servicing and maintenance. These days, more folks are used to paying for them to be serviced so don't have to learn how they work.

I actually came across a guy heading for the ARC who didn't know where his engine oil dip-stick was. Seemed a bit put out when I joked about "I'm talking to him".

extend the post war periond into the 1980s ;-)

 

[NotBirdseye]

Very true but increasingly a sign of the times. For many of us older folks who grew up in the post war period, the only way to afford a car or bike was to do our own servicing and maintenance. These days, more folks are used to paying for them to be serviced so don't have to learn how they work.

I actually came across a guy heading for the ARC who didn't know where his engine oil dip-stick was. Seemed a bit put out when I joked about "I'm talking to him".

Servicing a modern car requires a diagnostics kit and sure you can buy cheap ones, unfortunately they're not very good. You can in theory, service all the mechanical bits not a problem, but the electrics thanks to the integrated software is a bit of a nightmare for most people. It feels like a manufacturing conspiracy sometimes. I've known trained mechanics (from said post-war generation) to give up and retire as the vehicles became more complicated. It's easier, cheaper and more reliable to get someone to service said car.

With that said, if there were a place I could take my car for DIY servicing with a trained mechanic for guidance... I'd be all over that. (I suspect a lot of new boat owners would love something similar).

 

[rogerthebodger]

We should all know that sailing/boating is like standing in a shower fully clothed ripping up pound notes.

I ge asked how much did it cost to build Distandshaws. My answer is I don't want to know.

 

[geem]

It also greatly depends on how much you can (or want to) do yourself. We've met people with minor rudder problems that turned into a €20k expense orgy with three haulouts in three different countries because they had received a bad bodge fix in one place, a bad repair (that was supposed to be the proper repair but wasn't) and then finally a proper repair of their steering system (bearings and a couple other things). Talking to them left me with absolutely no doubt that in all three places the yards had (correctly) sensed they had little technical knowledge, were rather hands off and perhaps also a bit too intimidated by it all to argue over prices in non-native languages, so they got stung with excessive costs for all three jobs (oh big problems sir, had to get in specialist, order more parts, take another week in the yard, etc.), and bad work on the first two to boot.

Having done a similar job on our own boat, the costs were just the haulout (which was done for other reasons too) and the parts, in total under €1k. Helps doing it only once too.

Same for applying Coppercoat, where the paint costs maybe twice as much as conventional antifouling, but the preparation and application cost is staggering (and then the professionals sometimes mess it up and it ends up not working).

Anything involving new instruments, autopilot, etc. is however annoyingly costly and even the absolute stingy sailor that I am, I haven't yet found a good solution for this, other than building my own Even NASA marine is on the expensive side for what's in those little ABS boxes, and the Raymarine/Navico/Garmin prices are simply outrageous.

I think giving some of the yards we know about the status of ‘professional’ is inappropriate. With regard to Coppercoat we had an example. The instructions say thin with isopropyl alcohol of at least 90% purity. We were doing our own Coppercoat in a well respected yard that is actually an official Coppercoat applicator. We ask the yard manager where we could get the appropriate alcohol. He says its hard to find so we just use the 70% purity! We found 96% isopropyl alcohol in a local chemist. What effect this has on Coppercoat I dont know but if the instruction say use at least 90% and the ‘professionals’ dont, I think we will stick to diy. Coppercoat is working very well by the way

 

[NotBirdseye]

I think giving some of the yards we know about the status of ‘professional’ is inappropriate. With regard to Coppercoat we had an example. The instructions say thin with isopropyl alcohol of at least 90% purity. We were doing our own Coppercoat in a well respected yard that is actually an official Coppercoat applicator. We ask the yard manager where we could get the appropriate alcohol. He says its hard to find so we just use the 70% purity! We found 96% isopropyl alcohol in a local chemist. What effect this has on Coppercoat I dont know but if the instruction say use at least 90% and the ‘professionals’ dont, I think we will stick to diy. Coppercoat is working very well by the way

That's worrying, also try Amazon if you need it in bulk! Sometimes it has slightly different names, some actually use it for hair cleaning :|. 90%+ is very easy to find.