Princess cut 450 jobs

Sign of the times?. Does anyone think that builders need to move away from the philosphy of ever increasing size (in both length and engine size) which are not helpful for the image of motorboating or the use of resources?. Do we need some innovation as in the car industry (which combines luxury/performance) into a smaller package. If you read the advertising literature produced by many builders the focus seems to be on 'entertaining', i.e. tied up in a marina having drinkies?, surely if this is your requirement you would think such people are better off with a seaside apartment rather than a boat (er you are supposed to go places in it folks!)
 
The spokesman last night on TV said that the "small" boats were the problem and they were focusing on the larger boats. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
 
I don't think size per se is the issue. The move to small cars instead of large ones is as much driven by congestion issues as anything else, which is not relevant to boating. IMHO, the 2 issues which most motorboat buyers think about are purchase price and fuel efficiency. There will always be a section of the market for whom money is not an issue but the fact is, for most motorboat buyers, their income is going to be reduced over the next few years and taxes are likely to be higher. Times have been good for the motorboat builders over the last 15yrs so above inflation annual price rises have been swallowed by the market. That isn't going to be the case in the future so builders either have to downsize so much that they can continue to sell at higher prices to fewer customers or they have to find ways to make their boats cheaper in order to keep their companies growing
The second issue is fuel efficiency. Most owners can well afford to put fuel in their gas guzzling boats because fuel is actually not the major part of the cost of running a boat for a typical 100hr/year pleasure usage. Motorboating barely registers on the list of contributors to CO2 emissions so I don't think owners worry too much about this but IMHO, whilst fuel prices are relatively low at the moment, in the future, prices are only going one way and that is upwards. Therefore, motorboat builders have to find ways to increase fuel efficiency. So far we've had small incremental improvements like EDC engines, refinements in hull design, IPS, Zeus etc but what's going to be needed is a step change. That could come in many different ways, possibly a radical hull design moving away from an inefficient monohull to a multihull design, maybe a planing hull that is also comfortable at displacement speeds, maybe a hybrid propulsion system or a more efficient drive system to replace inefficient props. Whatever, any company that comes out with a reasonably priced 40 foot flybridge boat that offers the space, comfort and style of current boats but does 2mpg instead of 1mpg is going to be on to a winner
 
Hello Deleted User, I agree that technically motor boating does not contribute much to global warming but as responsible people I believe we have a moral rduty to reduce our Co2 footprint, an added benefit is to keep the legislators at bay, they will look for any excuse to clobber us. In terms of size, there is congestion, you can find moorings for sub 50 foot boats far easier, there is a 'waiting list' at most marinas for boats larger than this. Hard times MAY have some benefit in driving out technical solutions which 'deliver the goods' in terms of price efficiency etc. Joe Soap is not particularly happy at present with seeing profligate spending behaviour by people, regardless of how that money has been accquired, I believe that people are exercising caution on 'in your face' showing of wealth, which has steered them away from 'motorboat in extremis', witness a downturn in sales of larger models from the principal builders. If the industry has been used to upping the price every year by 15% or so then this only proves it has become flabby and complacent, a dose of realism may do it some good!. The concern should be how do we keep boating at a reasonable cost, how do we show concern for our environment, and how do we achieve technical innovation(through refinement of the production line process as an example) , you might say the ultimate three card trick!.
 
I think you will find that Princess will focus on the larger boats as I understand that it is a difficult 'sell' os the far off delv dates on the big 'ns. So up 'till now the small line extra to need staff moved to the 70ft + jobs.

Clearly a downsize for the future is now needed there too.

Bad news for Plymouth as P are a major player in Devon employment.
 
"Whatever, any company that comes out with a reasonably priced 40 foot flybridge boat that offers the space, comfort and style of current boats but does 2mpg instead of 1mpg is going to be on to a winner "

Is this too much of a step change? Imagine the ends of the "hydro blades" folding back along the center section before entering a marina.

They claim 7X fuel efficiency and great stability. The future IMHO.

SandIsland-RvOfSea.jpg
 
There's a big assumption in your statement in that not all people are MMGW believers. I'm an informed sceptic on this issue and so are many on this forum so expecting motor boaters to feel a moral duty to reduce CO2 emissions is unrealistic, particularly as you have already agreed that motorboating contributes very little to overall emissions. As for Joe Soap, I expect most motor boaters don't really give a fig what other people think about them. It's just another way of disposing of your income. Some people might blow their money on fags, booze, 50inch plasma TV sets and 5 holidays a year in Shagaluf but I prefer to spend my money on a boat
The present slump in boat sales is not caused by awareness of MMGW or what Joe Soap thinks but only by lack of cash and credit. Make boats cheaper and more efficient and they will sell
 
I agree some of what you say but not the profligate spending bit. I dont think there is a general mood in the country agianst folks spending, (as there is against ex bank CEOs getting big pensions, say), or am I being a bit out-of-tune? As mike says, a boat is just one way of spending your money, and others spend it on all sorts of other stuff.

But shouldn't Joe Soap want folks with money to spend it? That would help the economy surely? I got a new boat recently and among the other factors to take into account were do you put money in bank, who (currently) wont lend it to finance the economy, or do you buy a product made in UK that takes 5 man years to build? The Joe Soap employed for 5 years ought to prefer that the money is spent

I'm not suggesting that buying a boat was an entirely altruistic act, btw /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
Absolutely Mike

I believe that Mount Etna puts out 90% of the world's CO2 on its own. Man's contribution is peanuts and there's also not evidence that CO2 emmisions contribute to global warming either.

The whole thing is a political argument to get us to pay more taxes.
 
Get ready to duck, That's just the sort of statement to get webcraft wound up /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
[ QUOTE ]
Absolutely Mike

I believe that Mount Etna puts out 90% of the world's CO2 on its own. Man's contribution is peanuts and there's also not evidence that CO2 emmisions contribute to global warming either.

The whole thing is a political argument to get us to pay more taxes.

[/ QUOTE ]

so spot on
last Summer I was speaking with an intelligent chap who gave an easy example on the panic taxes on global warning, u can do it by the way: he filled me a glass of water and put 2 cubes of ice to make it full,
let it melt and the water level practicially stays the same, this is what will happen if GW is real

while many here still speak for speed and fuel, I think the real problem which will slow boating in the future is berthing and maintenance costs, the fuel efficient part is important but not as much as people think or make off
yes new boat numbers are down but most if is really for tightening credit then any other case, the rest is just talk

another realism is that we are pony of the politics, u dont want to contribute to global warning really stay with wat u have and dont consume anything really...
who makes more damage to the enviroment the man who has a 20 year old diesel car, or the one who buys the latest MPG model every year. Think about this.....
 
Hang on a minute, are you saying I am a contribution for a man or am I responsible for the CO2 emmissions. Please no jokes about being full of wind!

I prefer the post that stated they could buy a boat for peanuts and then there was the one of a person working for peanuts - I am still waiting for that, I was hoping it was going to be in time for the anti foulling to be done.
 
[ QUOTE ]

who makes more damage to the enviroment the man who has a 20 year old diesel car, or the one who buys the latest MPG model every year. Think about this.....

[/ QUOTE ]

Yup, the guy who buys the new cars does more damage, cos the CO2 from making* the car is more than it makes itself in several years of its life...!

*Remeber this includes digging the iron ore, building the ships needed to transport the cars to customers, building the factories to make the cars, lots of things
 
-------------------------------------------
so spot on
last Summer I was speaking with an intelligent chap who gave an easy example on the panic taxes on global warning, u can do it by the way: he filled me a glass of water and put 2 cubes of ice to make it full,
let it melt and the water level practicially stays the same, this is what will happen if GW is real
---------------------------------------------


The water(cubes) was already in the glass before the measuring began. btw i have no idea how many cubes
are on land around the world.
 
[ QUOTE ]
-------------------------------------------
so spot on
last Summer I was speaking with an intelligent chap who gave an easy example on the panic taxes on global warning, u can do it by the way: he filled me a glass of water and put 2 cubes of ice to make it full,
let it melt and the water level practicially stays the same, this is what will happen if GW is real
---------------------------------------------


The water(cubes) was already in the glass before the measuring began. btw i have no idea how many cubes
are on land around the world.

[/ QUOTE ]

yes but the worry is about the melting icebergs in the North and South Poles
BTW North Pole does melt all in Summer and it is not happening the first time right now, there is also much theories that the 0.7 degrees of increase in temperature in the 19th century can be associated to much more things outside human behaviour, as someone say already the Etna might do more a decade of human damage in a month, apart the other forces exsserzied by the sun and so on
yes we should have alternative to oil, but fooling people about it is stupid, then the funny thing is that the same culprits who tax it wants us to continue and use more then ever as if noting happen
if it is so bad just block the lines, thats what a doctor will tell u when alchohol is not good for u.....
 
[ QUOTE ]
I don't think size per se is the issue. The move to small cars instead of large ones is as much driven by congestion issues as anything else, which is not relevant to boating. IMHO, the 2 issues which most motorboat buyers think about are purchase price and fuel efficiency. There will always be a section of the market for whom money is not an issue but the fact is, for most motorboat buyers, their income is going to be reduced over the next few years and taxes are likely to be higher. Times have been good for the motorboat builders over the last 15yrs so above inflation annual price rises have been swallowed by the market. That isn't going to be the case in the future so builders either have to downsize so much that they can continue to sell at higher prices to fewer customers or they have to find ways to make their boats cheaper in order to keep their companies growing
The second issue is fuel efficiency. Most owners can well afford to put fuel in their gas guzzling boats because fuel is actually not the major part of the cost of running a boat for a typical 100hr/year pleasure usage. Motorboating barely registers on the list of contributors to CO2 emissions so I don't think owners worry too much about this but IMHO, whilst fuel prices are relatively low at the moment, in the future, prices are only going one way and that is upwards. Therefore, motorboat builders have to find ways to increase fuel efficiency. So far we've had small incremental improvements like EDC engines, refinements in hull design, IPS, Zeus etc but what's going to be needed is a step change. That could come in many different ways, possibly a radical hull design moving away from an inefficient monohull to a multihull design, maybe a planing hull that is also comfortable at displacement speeds, maybe a hybrid propulsion system or a more efficient drive system to replace inefficient props. Whatever, any company that comes out with a reasonably priced 40 foot flybridge boat that offers the space, comfort and style of current boats but does 2mpg instead of 1mpg is going to be on to a winner

[/ QUOTE ]

may be these answer some of your efficiceny questions for MPG, interesting and they look good too
pity for the double berth fees in most marinas for a cat...
 
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