Portishead to Swansea

[tatali0n]

Hi all.

Dad and I have to deliver our Westerly Griffon from Portishead to Swansea for a bit of work to be done on her (and because we fancy an excuse to sail to Swansea). We're intending to do this next weekend, weather permitting.

The morning high water Avonmouth is 0705 Saturday 4th and 0758 Sunday 5th. Anybody got any tips on planning / making the passage?

We're intending to leave Saturday morning, overnight somewhere along the way, then sail the second leg to Swansea Sunday morning. I had thought of stopping in Barry on the way (further down, no fuss with locks) but Dad's expressed a clear preference for a pontoon and a pub, so Cardiff / Penarth seems the likely stopover and we'll just have to allow the extra time to navigate the Barrage.

Getting to Cardiff is something I suspect I could now do with my eyes shut. From Cardiff to Swansea is something I've not done yet, so would welcome any advice?

 

[alant]

Hi all.

Dad and I have to deliver our Westerly Griffon from Portishead to Swansea for a bit of work to be done on her (and because we fancy an excuse to sail to Swansea). We're intending to do this next weekend, weather permitting.

The morning high water Avonmouth is 0705 Saturday 4th and 0758 Sunday 5th. Anybody got any tips on planning / making the passage?

We're intending to leave Saturday morning, overnight somewhere along the way, then sail the second leg to Swansea Sunday morning. I had thought of stopping in Barry on the way (further down, no fuss with locks) but Dad's expressed a clear preference for a pontoon and a pub, so Cardiff / Penarth seems the likely stopover and we'll just have to allow the extra time to navigate the Barrage.

Getting to Cardiff is something I suspect I could now do with my eyes shut. From Cardiff to Swansea is something I've not done yet, so would welcome any advice?

Check the tidal atlas & pick the departure time based on favourable flow, rather than simply the time of HW.

 

[Lioness]

Hi all.

Dad and I have to deliver our Westerly Griffon from Portishead to Swansea for a bit of work to be done on her (and because we fancy an excuse to sail to Swansea). We're intending to do this next weekend, weather permitting.

The morning high water Avonmouth is 0705 Saturday 4th and 0758 Sunday 5th. Anybody got any tips on planning / making the passage?

We're intending to leave Saturday morning, overnight somewhere along the way, then sail the second leg to Swansea Sunday morning. I had thought of stopping in Barry on the way (further down, no fuss with locks) but Dad's expressed a clear preference for a pontoon and a pub, so Cardiff / Penarth seems the likely stopover and we'll just have to allow the extra time to navigate the Barrage.

Getting to Cardiff is something I suspect I could now do with my eyes shut. From Cardiff to Swansea is something I've not done yet, so would welcome any advice?

I did this very trip for the first time about three weeks ago. You'll know that the tidal stream will take you down to Flat Holm after HW but once you turn the corner (around flatholm) to head west the ebbing tide is actually sweeping you away from Swansea so you are then actually punching against the stream if you're going on the same tide. The other thing I really noticed was how the wave patterned changed from the channels famous short sharp type to more rolling ocean swell and you'll notice the chocolate soup water colour gradually change as you travel further west as well, though I never saw true blue water.

You will need to check HW times for Swansea as its standard port is Milford Haven (not Avonmouth like Cardiff and Portishead) to work out a favourable tidal stream for the trip from Cardiff to Swansea. The main navigation issue when you pass Barry is whether to go the inshore or offshore route around tasker rock/sandbank between Barry and Porthcawl? I went the offshore route and there were plenty of navigation marks charted to plan a route and fix position whilst underway.

Hope this helps a little and that you have a great trip too.

 

[bitbaltic]

Getting to Cardiff is something I suspect I could now do with my eyes shut. From Cardiff to Swansea is something I've not done yet, so would welcome any advice?

We took our boat up to Swansea (from Penarth) yesterday (26.05) as we want to have her in Swansea/Milford for the summer. Did it in a near-calm so the following reflects motoring, not sailing. Here is a rough of the route plan.



We planned the passage on making 5kn through the water in order to make full use of the tide and take the inshore route via a) the Nash Passage and b) inside Scarweather via Kenfig patches. The pilot book recommends entering the Nash Passage above half tide so the 5kn STW was essential in the first part of the passage to make that gate, and also to clear Kenfig patches whilst there was still plenty of water around.

We locked out from Cardiff barrage at 0830, HW-2 and punched the last of the flood. We had about a knot of foul tide coming round Rannie but it quickly slackened off and the sea state was calm enough. The SOG was quite changeable around Barry- lots of tide lines in the water and we started to pick up a fair tide which varied by up to a knot as we crossed different tide lines. By the time we were passing Rhoose we were less than 1Nm offshore and the tide had turned giving us up to 4kn lift at times- this is far more than the tidal diamonds further out in the channel suggest so I would recommend staying in close if possible. If the weather is a bit fresher perhaps not so close as I imagine it would get very rough there. We gave the Power Station caisson at Aberthaw a good offing and then made for the Nash Passage, arriving there about 1200 (Half tide Porthcawl being 1300)- we had expected to arrive at 1230 but the tidal lift had given us extra time. The Nash Passage was no problem at all- I hand steered just to make sure the boat pointed properly in 2kn of tide and we passed close to but down-tide of the cardinal buoy with plenty of water under us.

We left the Tusker red can to Starboard and made for a waypoint off Porthcawl to avoid any overfalls off the point and line us up for the Kenfig cardinal and pass between the bank at Kenfig patches and the coast at Sker Point. We still had about 6m of water at Porthcawl at this time and the 9m depth made me think the charted depths are correct- so should not be a problem to come through here for a boat of modest draft.

After that you are less tidally constrained so you STW is less essential. If you think you might be pushed to make Swansea before LW, you can just hold back and time your arrival for just after low. For us we felt we'd made good enough time to get there before LW and the Tawe Lock was supposed to operate throughout the low- it wasn't a 'lock closure' day, so we pushed on at 5kn STW. It was an uneventful motor straight for the inner fairway buoy at Swansea, passing close by the outer buoys of the Port Talbot approach channel. It is quite a long motor across Swansea bay and it was windless yesterday. The sea is a nice green-blue instead of brown! We reached the inner fairway buoy around 1430- an hour and a half before low tide but the depths were shallow- 3m from the waterline- so instead of following our plan to cross the contours and enter the dredged approach channel at the inner fairway buoy (which lies close to the 0m contour) we turned west about 1/2Nm short of it, and drove parallel to the depth contours to until we entered the dredged fairway.

Tawe Lock was still operating (on demand) but the water was dropping all the time and we got the last lock in at 1500, which was LW-1. As mentioned it wasn't a published 'lock closure' day but they DID close it over LW once they had less than 1.5m in the channel- I think it was shut for about 40-60 mins after we got in. But we did get to see the approaches at low water- beware there is a big drying bank of mud up against the west pier wall as you turn to port to line up for Tawe lock, which was home to a flock of seagulls and seemed much bigger than the drying area shown there on our charts. We draw 1.2m and didn't touch but the minimum depths we read as we came round the corner towards the orange holding buoys in front of the lock was 1.4m. I can't see that the holding buoys are any more use if waiting for a lock-in at low tide than just taking the ground, as they looked like they were ewither sitting on mud or very close to it yesterday. The whole fairway didn't seem to have depths much exceeding LAT yesterday so if I had a deeper draft boat I probably wouldn't have entered the fairway at all until the ide was rising. But I guess you have bilge keels and will be fine and next weekend will be more neapy anyway.

We are in the marina on M pontoon (next to the loos!!) so if you do come down next weekend come give us a shout!

Cheers

 

[tatali0n]

Thanks guys, that's all exceptionally helpful

 

[bitbaltic]

I did this very trip for the first time about three weeks ago. You'll know that the tidal stream will take you down to Flat Holm after HW but once you turn the corner (around flatholm) to head west the ebbing tide is actually sweeping you away from Swansea so you are then actually punching against the stream if you're going on the same tide. The other thing I really noticed was how the wave patterned changed from the channels famous short sharp type to more rolling ocean swell and you'll notice the chocolate soup water colour gradually change as you travel further west as well, though I never saw true blue water.

You will need to check HW times for Swansea as its standard port is Milford Haven (not Avonmouth like Cardiff and Portishead) to work out a favourable tidal stream for the trip from Cardiff to Swansea. The main navigation issue when you pass Barry is whether to go the inshore or offshore route around tasker rock/sandbank between Barry and Porthcawl? I went the offshore route and there were plenty of navigation marks charted to plan a route and fix position whilst underway.

Hope this helps a little and that you have a great trip too.

I don't get why you'd go round (south of?) Flatholm? You don't need to make further southing than that of Breaksea Point whether you go inside or outside from Nash, surely?

 

[King Penguin]

I did this exact passage on Sat 14/5.......I left portishead at 12.00, HW Avonmouth was at 14.00, so I punched the tide for two hours until it turned.

When I got past Lavernham Point, I hugged the North side of the Bristol Channel as the stream runs stronger there, then slipped through the Nash channel, went outside Tuskar Red Buoy and then inside Kenfig Patches. It was easy eyeball nav and I locked into Swansea Barrage at 21.00. As I entered the breakwater, depth was alarmingly low but by staying towards the east side, got through (my boat draws 1.7m).
The whole passage was 57 miles.

I have a useful quite detailed tidal atlas of the area that I made for one of my Day Skipper students a year or so ago by plotting all the tidal diamonds from the Admiralty Bristol Channel chart pack. It's on-line and you can download it free of charge. The link is http://www.penguinsailing.com/localguides.html

It is free to download and i ask if you find it useful to consider making a donation to the running of the website, but it's not compulsory as I know how 'tight' us yachties can be

Anyway, good luck with your passage........
David

 

[tatali0n]

Well, we did it. Although I confess I cheated and motor-sailed.

We locked out of Cardiff Barrage at 0500 and punched up to Raine, making it earlier than expected with next to no adverse tide as we crept along the Penarth shore. Things were very swirly as we turned right at Raine, and then met the full last couple of hours of the flood on the nose. Wind directly behind, the genoa filled nicely and Raine gradually, gradually disappeared behind us.

The tide had eased considerably as we passed Sully Island, had stalled by the time we passed Barry and then turned with us so we positively flew past Breaksea Point, even though the wind had started to fail.

We reached the Nash Passage by 0945 in a dead calm, but once we were inside, the wind built nicely off the port bow so I hauled both the sails up and motor-sailed across the bay to Swansea, ploughing along at hull-speed the whole way.

By the time we cleared Porthcawl, the sailing conditions were lovely and the sun was beginning to come out, but it was starting to look like we were in with a chance to get in before the lock shut at 1145, so we kept the pace up by continuing to motor-sail. It felt like heresy, but we had a long train-ride back waiting for us once we were in, so the chance of stealing three hours lead on the journey home was the decider.

The last lock in was 1130; we called up the lock master as we were approaching the outer harbour walls, and he confirmed he had a meter and a half over the sill but warned us to hurry. We had a tense moment in the river as the keels hit the mud just before the holding buoys, but we just about ground through, and snuck in through the lock gates at 1129.

She's getting hauled out for some work this week, then put back in and we're keeping her down there till September. Really looking forward to exploring the area Oxwitch Bay, Tenby, over to Ilfracombe, Lundy, etc. Dad's had his heart set on getting to Padstow ever since we got the boat, so maybe we'll even make it over to there. Only really need to be sure we're back in Portishead in time for the Holms Race in September

 

[bitbaltic]

Great stuff.

Our plan is similar- we are intending to stay up west until the Holms Race as well, although Milford and the various destinations in the Haven are our target rather than the English coast.

In two weekends we've probably had better family sailing than in five previous seasons east of Nash Point....