Poling out cruising chute

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Inselaffe

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I posted again here to avoid hijacking the spinnaker v cruising chute thread

How do you do this, and how do you gybe it? This would be handy when I put up the cruising chute & then the wind shifts too far aft.

I have a small 22 footer, so chute is easily manageable, even alone.

Bbg already answered:
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Quote:

Yes, the tack has two lines attached: tack line and guy. Guy goes back through the pole and led like a normal guy. It takes a bit of coordination to ease off the tack line (you will need a long and adjustable one) while taking pressure on the guy, and vice versa.

Gybing an assymetric that is flown from a pole is really best done only with a well oiled race crew, but is a pleasure to watch when done well.
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End quote

not sure if I unerstan this properly: the tack line goes from tack to the bow, then back to cockpit or wherever & controls height of tack? & guy works like a normal spi guy? But if I have a spinaker pole with up and down haul, then why do I need the tack line?

I would love to learn how the gybing technique works, I must try!

Any more info?
 
A cruising chute is attached to the boat at the very front by a tack line. This often goes round the bow roller and back to cockpit. Some people (like me) don't bring it back. A spinnaker on the other hand is attached to the pole and not to the boat.

My cruising chute launches from a sock and only has one sheet that goes right round the outside of everything and back into the cockpit via a block near the back of the cockpit and then on to the winch or a cleat. To gybe mine I take the cruising easy way out of pulling the snuffer down, re-rigging the sheet on the other side and then re-launching. If you want to gybe without doing this then you need 2 sheets. Take the lazy sheet back round the front of the boat and down the windward side. To gybe you can let the sheet off and the chute flies forward and you take it up on the other sheet. This is all subject to it not wrapping and getting in a mess. Alright with a finely honed and experienced crew but for a cruiser who only uses a chute for a long long tack then snuffing and relaunching is less prone to problem particularly as usually done when short-handed.

Just re-read that and your question was about poling out. Just like poling out a jib - have the sheet running through the fitting on the end of the pole so that you can still adjust the sheet or let it go in an emergency.
 
The quote that you gave describes a way of bearing the tack of the cruising chute out to windward, using a guy and a pole just like with a symetrical spinnaker. (Actually, mine moves out to windward quite well using the guy without the pole. I adjust the guy and tack pennant to get it to fly with the tack up to windward. It does this sufficiently to allow setting it on a broader reach) This is useful when the reach is so broad that the cruising chute is starting to collapse due to blanketing by the mainsail.

The description that the second post gave refers to poling out the clew of the cruising chute to windward. You need a very long pole for that method. This is useful for the broader reach and for running.

The pole is not necessary when sailing on a reach which is less broad. This is how most cruising folk use the cruising chute and the tack pennant is adjusted to provide the required shape to the luff.
 
There are two ways to use a pole with a cruising chute.

The first is to keep the tack attached to the bow and just pole out the clew to windward, as you would polling out a genoa. That is easy but not particularly effective unless you have a long pole.

The alternative is to set the chute from the pole as you would a symmetric spinnaker. The pole needs to be set up with uphaul and downhaul. The you attach the guy to the tack of the spinnaker, and lead it through the jaws of the pole to the winch. the sheet is used as normal.

Now gybing can be fun. If you have a sock then it is easier (and probably quicker) to douse the chute on one tack and reset it on the other. If not then you will need at least two sheets, two guys and a tack line.

The process is to let the pole come forward to the forestay by easing the guy, then you use the tack line to tack the spinnaker to the bows while you swap the pole to the other side and attach it to the lazy guy.

Then you gybe the boat as you would normally when using the chute, pulling the clew of the sail round the outside using the sheet, then reset the pole.

Having written all that it occurs to be that it might be possible to make things a bit simpler by setting the pole downhaul/foreguy to the tack of the chute rather than its normal position of the middle of the pole, thereby removing the need for the tack line, but in my case it might rub on the pulpit when on a run.
 
I may be a bit thick but I thought that the whole point of a cruising chute was that you did not need a pole!? I have never used one and have never had a problem.

I don't have a snuffer and only use one sheet. OK, gyebing is sometimes a little ....... erm, colourful, linguistically speaking but we get there in the end.
 
There is no guy on a cruisy chute. Just a tack line and one or two sheets. The tack line comes from the tack, the sheet(s) from the clew. If you have the chute poled out the sheet will run through the outer pole-end fitting and the clew will be pretty hard up against the pole end, but put a meaty bowline in the sheet to stop the clew actually pulling into the end fitting.

Gybing a poled out chute would, frankly, be a bit of a nonsense, but if you wanted to on a small boat you would end-for-end the pole. So:

First, trip the sheet from the pole end.
Gybe the boat.
Run the sheet around the forestay and back to the new windward quarter (or use the other sheet if you have two rigged) and set the sail.
Unclip the pole from the mast, push it across the boat and clip the other end of the pole to the mast.
Now grab the sheet and clip into the (new) outer end of the pole.

The odds of doing this shorthanded and not ending up with a wrap around the forestay or some other forms of bugger's muddle are not good. Realistically it would be far better to snuff or lower the chute, gybe the boat, and relaunch it on the other gybe.

Mind you there's no law that says you can't fly a chute as a kite (ie tack at the pole, sheet from the clew). Quite how you'd gybe that would depend on whether you wanted an odd shaped sail after the gybe (pole at the clew, sheet at the tack) or whether you wanted to blow the chute around the forestay and reset.

Word of warning - when gybing a coloured sail of any sort it's quite easy to make a turn of the halyard around the forestay which will mess things up more than somewhat when reinstating the genny. Either gybe the sail back before dropping it, or drop it and then gybe the halyard back around the forestay afterwards.
 
In lighter winds I have two sheets , and allow the wind to blow the chute around the bows then tighten down again. If I was using a pole, I would have removed the pole first., gybed, and then inserted the pole.
In stronger winds I would snuff first.

Frequently done this when single handed, but you have space to do this on a decent boat
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Here's how you'd do it with an assymetric spinnaker on a race boat without a bowsprit. A cruising chute is a sort of assymetric spinnaker after all.

The tack is attached to the bow by a tack line. Two guys are attached to the tack (you generally connect the guys to the tack line which will have an appropriate shackle - that way you can spike it if necessary).

You attach the sheets to the clew (obviously). Whether you lead the lazy sheet inside or outside the sail usually depends upon the boat and the crew's preference, outside gybes are easier.

You don't even start to worry about the pole & guys until the A-sail is hoisted. If you then want to bring the tack to windward - better for sailing a bit deeper, then you attach the pole to the windward guy and bring on the guy whilst easing the tack line. The pole would be much lower than for a symmetric spinnaker.

You still need the tack line to help hold the pole down. The downhaul is unlikely to be powerful enough.

To gybe, the guy is eased as the tack line is brought on and then the pole is removed. There is not the urgency to tranfer the pole that you get with a symmetric spinnaker. Removing and attaching the pole are distinctly separate operations from the gybe itself.

You gybe.

When everything is settled down, the process can be repeated with the pole on the opposite tack.

it's a lot less hassle than it sounds above, except perhaps for the gybe where I've glossed over the detail of pulling the spinnaker all the way around the outside.
 
If I read your question one way rig your pole as for a spinnaker with up haul & down haul; the tack becomes a guy and is led aft so when the wind goes aft - or you go downwind more- you can pull the pole back on the guy to keep the sail filling for longer.

Gybing set up like this is a PITA so I would drop & re-hoist.

If I read your question the other way pole out the sheet as you would a genny
 
The tack line does not "become" the guy. On a race boat an assymetric kite would have five lines attached to it - two sheets to the clew, and two guys and one tack line to the tack.

BUT - on a cruising chute you would often only have two lines - one sheet and one tack line. Personally, I would not put five lines onto a cruising chute, even if I were going to pole it out. Two sheets - probably. Tack line - obviously. And I think I would use only a single guy, that I would only attach if I wanted to pole out the chute.

You would probably only want to pole out an a-sail on a cruising boat if you expected to be on the same gybe for quite a while. So hoist the chute and don't bother with the guy. If you want to put it the pole and guy on, you can do so at your leisure. If you need to gybe or drop, take the pole and guy off early, then do your normal gybe or drop.

I am actually surprised that more cruising skippers don't consider poling out the tack of a cruising chute, because (IMHO) it is not that much more difficult than flying the sail in the first place, and in some conditions it could give a significant increase in speed.
 
Blimey, this forum is quick, already almost off second page!

Thanks for the comments, lots to read and learn.

I was thinking of poling out the tack to keep it filling further off the wind

no racing Calypso, just like pulling strings & playing, you should know that.
 
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