Please advise best nav. equipment?

mikemcgregor

mikemcgregor

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Just back from viewing the new Cranchi Pelican 32 in Spain. Looking to buy it in May and have got good price for it.
I could save even more by not having the factory fitted options of VHF/DSC and Raymarine GPS/plotter C80 and fitting some nav equipment myself. Can the forumites suggest suitable set ups? I will be using the boat in the coastal area of Empuriabrava with the odd trip out tuna fishing (25 to 35 miles offshore) So may need some sort of radar. As I will be fishing as well I will need a fishfinder. Is it best to have a stand alone fish finder or have it on a split screen system?..Any ideas will be welcomed
Cheers
 
In my own personal opinion it is best to have standalone units for everything.
If you opt for a combined system if the power to it fails or the screen fails or firmware locks up then you have a serious problem and safety issue.
So I would look at a separate sounder..definitely.
The sounder is the one bit of kit you "must" have for safety.
You dont have to be wedded to Raymarine gear.
Take a look at the Lowrance range of plotters, much cheaper and now highly regarded.
Probably not ideal on a sports boat, but there are great savings to be made if you go the PC plotter route.

Steve.
 
i'd never rely on a PC plotter, most unreliable and the water proof really robust ones are very expensive. The integrated units are very good and you could always get a hand held sounder for eventual power failures. Is lock up of equipment other than PC common, I have never experienced any instrument problems,
 
As I said, on a sports boat, probably not ideal, but on a boat such as mine 10knts max, totally enclosed lower helm..there is no problem.
A PC running perhaps Maxsea or Offshore navigator on Win2k is pretty bullet proof, provided you use it as a stand alone unit, dont throw loads of other crap on it and dont connect it to the internet other than to trusted sites for things like grib files.
Whereas integrated units look good and neat and at first may seem ideal..what happens if there is a power failure to it...No Radar, No Plotter, No Sounder, No GPS etc. Apart from intrinsic failures of the units themselves, which is rare but as with any electronic equipment "can" happen for a variety of reasons, quite often from something simple like water ingress to the cabling either power or seatalk/nmea behind the helm.
If you have separates, and if you lose one you always have the others to use, and if you have wired these on separate circuits, power failure will not become an issue either. Each one then becomes a navigation instrument in its own right.
Ships always have backup systems, even though they may have an IBS...it is required by law.
In my own personal view the rush to ever more integration on a vessel is a safety issue which is best avoided.
Sure you can carry a portable GPS/Plotter, portable sounder, etc, but these are all an additional cost over and above the already very expensive integrated equipment.


Steve.
 
You knew I would have to respond to that Steve!

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what happens if there is a power failure to it...No Radar, No Plotter, No Sounder, No GPS etc.

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The same happens with a PC - you lose it all. there is no difference.

In practice many have a hand held GPS backup, charts etc.

[ QUOTE ]
If you have separates, and if you lose one you always have the others to use, and if you have wired these on separate circuits, power failure will not become an issue either. Each one then becomes a navigation instrument in its own right.


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But a power failure would probably effect them all - do you have a seperate screen etc for each system? Very few have that.

I have had GPS go on the blink but still had radar and depth etc.

I have radar on the blink and still had GPS etc.

[ QUOTE ]
In my own personal view the rush to ever more integration on a vessel is a safety issue which is best avoided.
Sure you can carry a portable GPS/Plotter, portable sounder, etc, but these are all an additional cost over and above the already very expensive integrated equipment.


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So is a totally separate system for each and every instrument.

If you have power failure then a battery operated hand held offers a real alternative. If you do not have that you may have nothing.

If you rely on a PC, especially one that is not solid state marinised you are using an instrument not even designed for the task and if that goes down you lose it all.

I am still baffled by your logic on this. The separates solution with them all talking to each other offers more security by far than a PC solution.
 
I think you have missed my point Paul.
By integrated, I mean Single screen systems with no other way of displaying the data other than that single screen...not a system that you had on Drumbeat, where you had individual diplays for depth speed etc. only your radar and plotter was combined and you also had a backup GPS and charts.
On some of the latest systems it is possible to connect just the transducers GPS, Sounder, log, engine instruments etc to a single point of display.
I am not advocating the use of a PC on a sportsboat, just pointing out that it can be a cheaper way of doing it.
A PC is really just a Display instrument, it still has to take data from either a seatalk or NMEA bus or both.
In essence there is little difference in the wiring plan, if you think of the PC as just replacing your Raymarine master unit.
The difference is that if my PC goes up the swanee I still have the Radar, Garmin Plotter, Sounder,AIS all with individual screens to fall back on....so the PC is really just a covenience rather than a navigation system in its own right.
In my case it performs the same job as your Raymarine C series unit.

Steve.
 
I'm not sure about the equipment, i've got a z34 but its all factory fitted. Nver been a problem really.

I do want to ask you about the Pelican 32 though. I saw the the nex z32 at LIBS, seemed a good boat, but how does the Pelican differ? In the literture they seem very similar, is there a massively different feel, as its supposed to be a "fisher line"? You've obviously opetd for it, so just wondering what made you go for it?
Thanks
 
Simrad CXE multifunction.
Chart, Radar & Sounder all in one.
for loads of reasons.

If you are worried about failure, carry a handheld GPS and a bunch of batteries.

in my experience, most equipment failures are down to either bad installation, power failure or operator error! Rather than equipment failure.

Kev
 
Furuno GP7000(f) is fantastic. In fact all Furuno stuff is great once you get into the way they work. The Furuno 1620 (something like that anyway) 2.2kw radar is amazingly good for the money, Cactus have them on special offer at the moment.

IMHO Raymarine stuff is a little plasticky and gimmicky, Simrad CX 34 and similar Simrad stuff is good but I don't think the screens are as good as Furuno, also slightly more plasticky than Furuno but not as bad as Raymarine.

**Awaits floods of people rubbishing Furuno**
 
[ QUOTE ]
Furuno GP7000(f) is fantastic. In fact all Furuno stuff is great once you get into the way they work. The Furuno 1620 (something like that anyway) 2.2kw radar is amazingly good for the money, Cactus have them on special offer at the moment.

IMHO Raymarine stuff is a little plasticky and gimmicky, Simrad CX 34 and similar Simrad stuff is good but I don't think the screens are as good as Furuno, also slightly more plasticky than Furuno but not as bad as Raymarine.

**Awaits floods of people rubbishing Furuno**

[/ QUOTE ]

Not from me , I love my Furuno DGPS , put's me on wrecks everytime
 
I wouldn't get one of those then. I like to avoid wrecks if possible as they could make a nastly hole in my bottom!

(Did I really say that?)
 
Mike, best of luck with your purchase, great looking boat. I've got the Raymarine radar/chartplotter R70 fitted new to my boat in 2002. Like the Sealine you will be a bit stuck for space for two separate units so the single unit is very convenient. They are also very reliable so the argument of "all eggs in one basket" is not very compelling in my view. Hopefully we can catch up for a beer ot two in Empuriabrava this year.
take care
David
 
I must confess to a certain self interest, but the following Raymarine kit will give you the flexibility of not needing to fit everything at once; C80 display, Ray120 GPS x/ducer, DSM module with a P319 transducer with a 2kw /18" scanner now or added later as you wish. The 240E is a VHF possibility or a 54E as a buget option. Hope this helps
 
Steve
On my last boat I had two screens one a radar and one a plotter just that both talked to each other.

The trouble is that what you are proposing is a lot mor expensive and is nothing to do with PC or not. It must be safter to have totally seperate unit preferbaly that talk to each other.

A single PC as the screen is of course worse than a combined unit screen. The PC as you say is just a screen and it is an extra screen at that. If the primay intrument has gobe down eg radar then so to has the signla to the PC as well - so the PC issues is not to do with any element of security. :-)
 
JohnnyB The pelican is in most respects the same as the Zafiro32 (not sure of the spelling). Down below its exactly the same. The only major difference is the console behind the helm seat has a locker for all the fishing tackle as well as a live bait container in which fresh sea water can be circulated. There is a similar container on Stbd side under the cocpit floor for larger fish. There is also a hose pipe permanently fitted for wash down the cockpit after fishing. The main reason I/we opted for the pelican is shmbo wanted wider walkways around the boat as well as a bit more comfort when we go cruising. The midships cabin is quite spacious.
 
David Thanks for the best wishes. Are you gonna be there in March? It would be good If I could have a quick peek at your set up. We are there from 1 March til 15th.
Must have that beer. BTW I did send you a PM re I gave your boat a qiuck looksee last week and all is well with it.
Cheers
 
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