Pilot gas alarm solenoid

purplerobbie

purplerobbie

Well-Known Member
Joined
20 Jan 2007
Messages
1,441
Location
ked Away
Visit site
I going to fit a Pilot gas alarm which comes with a cut off solenoid but i'm not sure the best way to do it.

I have quite a standard set up at the moment Camping Gaz bottle in a locker that drains overboard.
From the regulator on the bottle there is a flexible hose that attaches to copper pipe after about 2 ft.

What i was thinking of doing is fitting hose tails on the solenoid and just cutting the rubber hose and fitting it in there.

Would that be acceptable?

Rob
 
I'm not an expert but I would have thought that the hose into the solenoid is acceptable but it would be better to have a rigid pipe from the solenoid to a secure bulkhead fitting at the point where it passes into the boat.

My set up is different from yours in that I have Calor Gas, a bulkhead mounted regulator and a bubbler as well as the solenoid (connected to the alarm). I fitted all the bits onto a ply board and then attached this to the locker - see picture below. In the picture I still needed to secure the bottle and remove the VHF speaker.

Even though I have fitted all these devices, I still manually close the bottle valve as soon as I have finished cooking.

I had a problem a couple of years ago when the water tank leaked into the bilges, soaked the sensors (adding a thin smear of diesel/oil) and damaged them. Because the alarm kept going off, I couldn't turn the gas on. :(

IMG_1731-1.jpg
 
It would be acceptable to me but I am not so sure that it would be to a Gassafe installer.

I'd certainly go along with Dipper's suggestion to terminate the hose at the solenoid ... after all it has to terminate somewhere ... and then run the copper pipe from the solenoid onwards.

Does the solenoid have to go in the locker or not? That seems to be the normal place but I dont see why it has to ... the locker need only enclose the HP parts of the system AFAIK. If the solenoid is out side the locker I would definitely make copper pipe connections to it rather than take the hose outside the locker ... but again I am not actually aware of any ruling that the hose must be contained within the locker.


Dipper's system looks pretty good except that the cable does not seem to enter the locker via a gas tight gland.
Hopefully the gas pipe leaves via a bulkhead fitting or gas tight gland.
Hopefully too the bottle is secured!
 
VicS said:
Dipper's system looks pretty good except that the cable does not seem to enter the locker via a gas tight gland.
Hopefully the gas pipe leaves via a bulkhead fitting or gas tight gland.
Hopefully too the bottle is secured!
Click to expand...

The picture shows work in progress but yours are valid comments. I have sealed the cable exit with sealant (not a gland) so not best practice but it is above the level of the bottle. The Boat Safety Scheme only requires the locker to be gas tight to the height of the regulator and valve which is why the wire exit is as high as possible.

The gas pipe does go into a proper bulkhead fitting where it passes into the boat and the bottle has been temporarily secured but I am going to make a proper frame for it this winter and also a frame to secure the spare bottle.
 
I second the comments about not being able to turn the gas on if the alarm sensor fails. My gas alarm got a couple of drips of water on it and packed up. Had it been connected to the solenoid it would have left me without gas. You need a way of either bypassing the solenoid or activating it manually if that happens. Mine is operated by a switch close to the cooker to which I have added an LED warning light. It is always turned off when the cooker isn't in use. (apart from gas safety, there is a current draw which could flatten you batteries isf it's always on).

"Best practice" is to have two sensors, one in the bilge and another in the gas locker. The only time we had a genuine alarm was in the locker when the cylinder connector hadn't been fully tightened. The solenoid valve should be the first thing downstream from the regulator so it can cut off any leaking pipework. You should also have a bubbler (leak detector) and a Gaslow valve.

Test for leaks by turning all your rings on, unlit and pressing down the bubbler - that checks both the pipework and the flame-failure devices.

The Gaslow valve shuts off the system in the event of a broken pipe or other sudden loss of pressure in the LP system.

One other thing - when using flexible pipe, use only date-stamped gas pipe and replace at the recommended intervals.
 
I have the one with two sensors but i was going to put one in a recess under the cooker and one in the bilge. Would this be frowned upon by the surveyor when i get it surveyed?

My thought was the first place gas will collect is in the recess under the cooker and then the bilge.

I will terminate one end of the copper in the solenoid and other side can be the rubber hose. It is a good idea. And it will reduce joins.
Thank you

Rob
 
purplerobbie said:
I have the one with two sensors but i was going to put one in a recess under the cooker and one in the bilge. Would this be frowned upon by the surveyor when i get it surveyed?

My thought was the first place gas will collect is in the recess under the cooker and then the bilge.Rob
Click to expand...

That's exactly what I've done. I suppose putting one in the gas locker is quite a good idea but that means an extra hole and I don't think the cable is long enough to reach.

Don't put it too low in the bilge. That's why mine got wet. Raise it off the bottom by an inch or so which should be perfectly OK as far as sensing gas is concerned.
 
Dipper said:
That's exactly what I've done. I suppose putting one in the gas locker is quite a good idea but that means an extra hole and I don't think the cable is long enough to reach.

Don't put it too low in the bilge. That's why mine got wet. Raise it off the bottom by an inch or so which should be perfectly OK as far as sensing gas is concerned.
Click to expand...

I had my entire gas system inspected and corrected by a gas safe installer ("Gas Check Marine")in 2008 and after discussion of the whole system he did not put a sensor in the gas locker but one under the cooker and the other attached to the floor bearer in the bilge, I think about 5 cm above the bottom of the bilge. I like having the solenoid switch I must say and have had it in my last two yachts.
 
"Do it yourself" installation is not encouraged. The installation of a gas system on the private vessel is not covered by the Gas Safety (Installations and Use) Regulations 1998. However, you have to take "responsible care for the health and safety of yourself and other persons who may be affected by your acts or omissions at work" under the Heath and Safety at Work Act 1974.

Get a gas Pro to do it for you, LPG is one of the most dangerous things you have on your boat!
 
snowleopard said:
I second the comments about not being able to turn the gas on if the alarm sensor fails. My gas alarm got a couple of drips of water on it and packed up. Had it been connected to the solenoid it would have left me without gas. You need a way of either bypassing the solenoid or activating it manually if that happens. Mine is operated by a switch close to the cooker to which I have added an LED warning light. It is always turned off when the cooker isn't in use. (apart from gas safety, there is a current draw which could flatten you batteries isf it's always on).

"Best practice" is to have two sensors, one in the bilge and another in the gas locker. The only time we had a genuine alarm was in the locker when the cylinder connector hadn't been fully tightened. The solenoid valve should be the first thing downstream from the regulator so it can cut off any leaking pipework. You should also have a bubbler (leak detector) and a Gaslow valve.

Test for leaks by turning all your rings on, unlit and pressing down the bubbler - that checks both the pipework and the flame-failure devices.

The Gaslow valve shuts off the system in the event of a broken pipe or other sudden loss of pressure in the LP system.

One other thing - when using flexible pipe, use only date-stamped gas pipe and replace at the recommended intervals.
Click to expand...

When I fitted my system I installed the solenoid inside an IP68 rated electrical juction box adjacent to the gas locker using bulkhead fittings where the copper gas pipe entered and left it. I then installed a baypass line and cock connected to the copper pipework either side of the junction box. The bubbler is installed downstream of this. The junction box has a bag of silica gel inside to keep the atmosphere inside dry. In this way if the solenoid fails to operate due to faulty sensors, lack of power or faulty solenoid I can still use the cooker.
I also always turn the gas off at the bottle when not in use.
 
1955patric said:
I installed the solenoid inside an IP68 rated electrical juction box adjacent to the gas locker using bulkhead fittings where the copper gas pipe entered and left it. ....The junction box has a bag of silica gel inside to keep the atmosphere inside dry.
Click to expand...

Very good idea. My solenoid stopped working after 7 years. The solenoid box was bulging with rust.
 
hightech said:
"Do it yourself" installation is not encouraged. The installation of a gas system on the private vessel is not covered by the Gas Safety (Installations and Use) Regulations 1998. However, you have to take "responsible care for the health and safety of yourself and other persons who may be affected by your acts or omissions at work" under the Heath and Safety at Work Act 1974.

Get a gas Pro to do it for you, LPG is one of the most dangerous things you have on your boat!
Click to expand...
Mmmmm don't think that the HSWA (1974) is applicable to someone working on their own boat, or for that matter to boats and ships in general though do stand to be corrected......
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

Top