PBO March 2012: Multi-point turn

[nigelmercier]

PBO March 2012 devotes over a page to the topic of making a multi-point turn, using forward and reverse (pages 39 and 41). At first the text and pictures suggest that the wheel should be reversed during this manoeuvre, but later says "it's not always worth reversing the wheel in a tight turn...".

Since the motion of the boat is rarely backwards during this manoeuvre, at least not enough to gain steerage, I would suggest that it is never worth reversing the wheel, except where the above condition applies.

 

[JayBee]

It's certainly never worth reversing the wheel (or tiller, in my case), whether my long keeler has sternway or not.

I do it anyway, for the benefit of marina onlookers, who often seem bemused by my multi-point turns in tight marina spaces.

On one occasion in Brittany a French girl who had been watching me for some time, trying to persuade the reluctant boat to turn through the wind, could keep silent no longer. "Where EXACTLY do you want to go!?" she asked in perfect English.

Too tedious to explain, "out" was the only suitable response.

 

[ksutton]

Doing it slowly with very little throttle is the answer, but side winds usually put pay to that plan.

 

[Bobc]

Was taught this years ago, well worth learning how to do it on your own boat.

Don't reverse the wheel/tiller.

Use the rudder and propwalk in forwards to give the stern a good kick round, and then you're really using reverse to keep any forward motion in check.

Works beautifully, but work out which way your prop walks and go that way.

 

[VicS]

Works beautifully, but work out which way your prop walks and go that way.

With a RH prop you can turn to stb'd .

with a LH prop to port.

As you say works well and with almost no backwards or forward movement.

 

[JayBee]

With a RH prop you can turn to stb'd .

with a LH prop to port.

As you say works well and with almost no backwards or forward movement.

Got a fixed 3 blade RH prop. Absolutely NO discernible prop walk (or transverse thrust, as we say in the trade) at all. The prop rotates in a small aperture between the sternpost/transom hung rudder.

 

[Bobc]

Here's a very good example of how effective it can be.

Note that he doesn't move the wheel, just keeps it ful to stbd.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_xM0s-NkFs

 

[pcatterall]

On one occasion in Brittany a French girl who had been watching me for some time, trying to persuade the reluctant boat to turn through the wind, could keep silent no longer. "Where EXACTLY do you want to go!?" she asked in perfect English.

Yes, almost exactly this a couple of days ago. I should have just got accross to the up wind side of the 'lane' warped the bow round and chugged out. We effectivly did this anyway but only after a good deal of swearing. I always seem to underestimate just how little wind will prevent the bow coming round until we get a good way on. No significant propwalk either!!

 

[prv]

Here's a very good example of how effective it can be.

Note that he doesn't move the wheel, just keeps it ful to stbd.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_xM0s-NkFs

Neatly done - but he does have a bowthruster to help

Pete

 

[JayBee]

Here's a very good example of how effective it can be.

Note that he doesn't move the wheel, just keeps it ful to stbd.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_xM0s-NkFs[/QUOTE

Not saying it doesn't work, it has worked for me many, many times - just not on my present boat.

Oh, and if you look closely at your video again, towards the end, you will see the wash from his bow thruster on the port side, as he straightens up to come alongside the other boat.

 

[Bobc]

I always seem to underestimate just how little wind will prevent the bow coming round until we get a good way on. No significant propwalk either!!

Couldn't agree more. I have to say that I'm a great fan of going backwards whener possible in difficult situations. Much easier when the prop is pulling instead of pushing.

 

[prv]

Couldn't agree more. I have to say that I'm a great fan of going backwards whener possible in difficult situations. Much easier when the prop is pulling instead of pushing.

As long as you have a boat that steers astern, that is

That being the case, I do agree it feels more stable to have the boat "hanging from" the prop rather than "balancing on" it.

Pete

 

[Bodach na mara]

With a RH prop you can turn to stb'd .

with a LH prop to port.

As you say works well and with almost no backwards or forward movement.

That is what I find Vic. Prop-walk has little effect in forward as the prop-wash over the rudder is much stronger. In astern with my LH prop, the stern is pulled to starboard (prop rotating clockwise) and there is little flow over the rudder to counteract it.

After going sideways down a channel in Ardrossan marina trying to turn to starboard (towards the open end of the channel) with the wind from starboard, I ended up alongside the walkway at the end, I now rarely attempt to turn to starboard. Only when I forget or feel confident. Doing a 270 degree turn to port looks odd but does work. I do not reverse the helm but I use quite a lot of power when in gear.

 

[SAWDOC]

Doing it slowly with very little throttle is the answer, but side winds usually put pay to that plan.

I disagree - you must get throttle on to get a flow on water past your rudder or she just wont respond. Also without any significant way on, you will be blown about by wind on the beam . The tricky bit tis to keep the burst of throttle short enough to achieve the turn without too much forward motion in a tight space.

 

[Elemental]

you must get throttle on to get a flow on water past your rudder or she just wont respond. Also without any significant way on, you will be blown about by wind on the beam . The tricky bit tis to keep the burst of throttle short enough to achieve the turn without too much forward motion in a tight space.

Agreed. Short bursts of full power to 'kick' the stern around without gaining too much way. The other common error (IMHO) is to be too quick on the throttle. Once the boat has gained some angular momentum in your direction of turn, it pays to select neutral and wait... With practice you can judge the arc of the bow or stern and allow the turn to take place with minimal intervention. As always, practice makes perfect...

 

[sailorman]

Agreed. Short bursts of full power to 'kick' the stern around without gaining too much way. The other common error (IMHO) is to be too quick on the throttle. Once the boat has gained some angular momentum in your direction of turn, it pays to select neutral and wait... With practice you can judge the arc of the bow or stern and allow the turn to take place with minimal intervention. As always, practice makes perfect...

much easier with a multi pot engine
my old YSE 12 in my Co32,NOW that was interesting at times

 

[Twister_Ken]

much easier with a multi pot engine
my old YSE 12 in my Co32,NOW that was interesting at times

And my old Bukh; took a while to wind-up the giant flywheel, and even longer for it to slow down again. Dunno why Top Gear frets about turbo lag!

 

[Seajet]

It's all very well saying 'you should / should not do this / that, but this all depends on the particular boat, engine & prop installation, not to mention wind - and what sails are stowed where with any windage incurred, say a stowed jib on the foredeck ( yes some of us still do ) , current, etc.

There ain't no golden one size fits all rule, only guidelines.

 

[Poignard]

And my old Bukh; took a while to wind-up the giant flywheel, and even longer for it to slow down again. Dunno why Top Gear frets about turbo lag!

Ah yes.

Twister + Bukh + cross wind blowing towards the dead end = lots of cursing when reversing out of a marina berth.

 

[SAWDOC]

It's all very well saying 'you should / should not do this / that, but this all depends on the particular boat, engine & prop installation, not to mention wind - and what sails are stowed where with any windage incurred, say a stowed jib on the foredeck ( yes some of us still do ) , current, etc.

There ain't no golden one size fits all rule, only guidelines.

Ah come on - we were getting nicely warmed up there for a while!