Part 1 Registar or Part 3 (SSR)? Which is best?

[ceeagr]

I have now bought the Bavaria 40 Ocean I asked about on here a couple of weeks ago and am looking at registration. I seem to have the choice of Part 1 (Full) or Part 3 (Small Ship Registrar). I'm not intending to take out a mortage.

All sugestions welcome?

 

[DoctorD]

In my view there is absotlutely no point paying for Part 1 if you do not have to (as you imply if you had a marine rmortgage you would have to take piut Part 1 registration). SSR is much cheaper and perfectly adequate.

For foreign travel SSR and proof of ownership/VAT paid (e.g. bill of sale) are perfectly adequate (certainly in europe) if anyone asks for ships papers.

 

[tony_brighton]

Part 3 SSR would seem to do the trick - I'd guess its what the majority on the BB have. Its not essential to have Part 1 even if you are having a mortgage especially if bought from new.
The fundamental difference is that Part 1 proves country of registration AND legal ownership; Part 3 only proves country of registration. Most people with Part 3 rely on a Bill Of Sale for proof of ownership.

The advantage for Part 1 is when selling there is no doubt as to ownership and this can set a buyers mind at rest. The flip side is that it costs more.

 

[Piers]

Even without a mortgage, there is still one very good reason for registering on Part 1 and not SSR. You will have legal ownership of the boat's name - noone else will be able to register the identical name.

Piers du Pré
MBM Cruising Club enthusiast
www.dupre.co.uk

 

[Guest]

This is a thorny one that has recently been well aired in the OCC magazine (and they do sail foreign).

Part 1. is undoubtedly best if doing much foreign mileage.

There are still many places that worry about the SSR, and there are mnay known cases of bother with it, though all that I know of have been resolves by the Brit Consul. In European ports that have much tourism, there is usually no problem with SSR. It is not always the case in the less-freequented parts.

Problems with SSR lie with the sloppy way in which the RYA once issued it. Because many continental countries charge wealth tax on boats, certain foreigners have bought up wrecked British boats on the SSR and have adopted the name for their own boat. This is a well-known racket and at one time, SSR certs (both real and false) were being traded in the South of France and the Italian Riviera.

If only the part 1 was a decent size piece of paper, but that is going to change according to Peter Heath of the MCA.

The big problem with Part 1 is the cost of survey. You need to find a measurer who is close to being broke. We got Hosanna measured for one third the normal. It can be done.

William Cooper

 

[zefender]

Although Part 1 does indeed avoid duplication of names for other boats who are registered it is by no means a guarantee of name uniqueness since so many are registered SSR or don't bother with registration at all.

I bought a new Bavaria last year (40 aft) and opted for the SSR.
There is also a view that it is a little easier to sell a boat with Part 1 though.

Enjoy the boat --don't worry about the detail..

 

[Guest]

Personally I would (and did) go for Part 1 and ignore Part 3.

As already mentioned Part 1 proves legal ownership whereas Part 3 doesn't prove anything. Part 3 is simply a bit of paper provided for the purposes of trying to keep foreign authorities quiet.

A boat is an expensive thing. Would you hand over the money for a house without bothering to register it in your name? If you're crazy and the answer is yes, then go for Part 3 registration. If, like the sane part of the population, you wouldn't hand over money for a house unless you had employed a solicitor and the house had been transferred into your name, then go for Part 1.

 

[zefender]

Re: Well yes, but

If the boat was bought brand new and there's all sorts of paperwork to prove it, then I'm not sure the house comparison is valid. Second hand, I'm a bit closer to your view.

 

[romany123]

Re: Well yes, but

It would be interesting to know what % of boats have part one as against SSR.
Im also part one

Dave

 

[lezgar]

Your new boat cost more £100000.

Are you worry spending some hundred in Part 1 that is the real register?

 

[Guest]

Re: Well yes, but

Well, yes, perhaps, although, receiving the boat new from the builder is by far the easiest time to get Part 1 registration. Later it may be impossible to prove the chain of title eg. if (as was the case with my boat) the builder didn't supply a formal completion certificate. Luckily in my case the builder was still in business and could supply me with one.

Actually, getting Part 1 registration is a doddle PROVIDED that you can PROVE the chain of ownership. The Registry however is very fussy about the documents proving ownership. In fact, in my case they would not accept documents that were legally valid and insisted on redoing the documentation in a way that was legally flawed in a very important way and would not have given me full ownership! (Being a solicitor I worry about that sort of thing). In the end I had to get two sets of transfer documents one legally flawed set to keep the Regisrtry happy and one clean set to have up my sleeve in case there was an argument over the flaw in the future!

When you come to sell the boat, even if you bought it from new, the Part 1 registration should be a selling point (if the buyer has any sense).

 

[ceeagr]

OK so how do I get a Certificate of Survey (considering its a brand new boat)?

 

[Guest]

Call the RYA and ask them to suggest someone who is authorised to give the certificate in your area. It's not actually a survey, it's a tonnage measurement for the purposes of Part 1 registration. Only selected surveyors are authorised to give them.

The measurement is not an onerous process. I seem to remember it cost somewhere around the £100 mark, but maybe my memory is failing. Can't have been much more than that or I would have remembered!

The other main things you will need (apart from being able to prove ownership in a way that is acceptable to the Registry) is that you must have the port of registry prominently painted on the boat (generally the transom), and, once you've been allocated a registration number, you will have to have it and the registered tonnage carved on a bulkhead. I had a nice wooden plaque made up which looks the bees' knees.

The other bit is thinking up a name that is unique and hasn't already been registered. It is possible therefore that you may have to change your boat's name if it's already been allocated. Very often you can get round it by including your home port in the official name (eg. "Titanic of Lymington" if the name "Titanic" is already allocated).

 

[Piers]

The lack of uniqueness is agreed. But the only way to ensure you have priority of use of the name is to go Part 1.

For example, if you ever want to change boat and make use of a mortgage whilst keeping the name (eg My Name), you won't be able to if someone else has already registered the name on part 1. Instead, you'll have to use something like My Name of Southampton.

Something similar happened to me. My boat is called "Play d'eau" which I put on SSR. Two years ago, I saw another Play d'eau, but this one had registered on Part 1.

Later this year, I hope to change my boat (although without a mortgage), yet I want to use Part 1. But the only way to re-use the name Play d'eau would be to register using something like Play d'eau of Southampton or similar. In my view, this spoils the name.

Piers du Pré
MBM Cruising Club enthusiast
www.dupre.co.uk

 

[zefender]

Well, there's always "Play d'eau deux"

 

[Piers]

Eau N'eau....

Piers du Pré
MBM Cruising Club enthusiast
www.dupre.co.uk

 

[romany123]

Piers
How about calling it "temps de bain" same sort of think

Dave

 

[romany123]

Thing ...even

Dave