Old Teak Decks

[MASH]

I'd like some views on refurbing a 25yr old teal deck. it seems well attached but the years of scrubbing have naturally taken a couple ofmm off the thickness leaving the caulking standing proud and some of the plugs too. Other plugs are thin enough to be coming away as disks. The deck is still pretty thick, 5mm perhaps.

Can anything be done to refresh it And more importantly to prolong its life? Im thinking of

Getting it flat agin -but how? What would a belt sander do with caulking? Having done that is it feasible to remove the screws, reborn their seats a bit lower and replace with new plugs? It's a big job, but worth it? Replacement must be a 10 - 12K job.

Or walk away?

 

[pvb]

Walk away is probably the sensible option. You don't say how big the boat is, but for an average 30-something ft boat, replacement is likely to cost nearer to £25K.

My decks had a similar problem, the caulking was 2 or 3mm proud. I removed most of the excess caulking with a scalpel-like craft knife, which took ages! Then I used a lightweight belt sander very carefully, keeping it moving around. If the teak is very badly worn, there may be areas where it's preferable to compromise and just remove the worst of the ridging rather than trying to sand it totally smooth. It's possible to get special low-profile screws which allow a little more space for glueing plugs back in.

If you do go ahead and buy it, don't ever scrub the deck! Treat it with Boracol (ideally) or Patio Magic (second choice) and this will keep it clean without abrading it. Avoid chemical cleaners too, despite what people say; these treatments are fine if there's lots of teak left, otherwise best avoided.

 

[Tradewinds]

Well I'm going to be a bit more positive.

My teak deck was worn down & ridged after 19 years hard use. That was back in 1998/99. I was in Spain then.

I spent the Spanish winter removing the plugs, removing screws, deepening the holes & re-screwing where possible (if not, I sealed the screw hole with epoxy). Re-plugging. Re-caulked where necessary.

I then sanded with an orbital sander using 80 grit. By the end the decks looked very good (if somewhat thinner than when new).

The decks still looked cosmetically good 10 or so years later but in places the teak had worn very thin (but not through & no planks were lifting).

Initially, I coated them with Starbrite Tropical Teak sealer (Natural) which actually looked OK - a new sanded look. But back in the UK I just left them natural and gave them a brush down with Patio Magic.

So yes - you can re-furbish and get quite a few more years out of old decks - but at some point you will have to make a decision on the next step.

I've almost finished re-decking in new teak mostly following the Chandler's (Lynn Rival) method - a loooooooooong process but well within the capacity of someone with good woodworking skills. My teak area is about the same as Lynn Rival & I reckon it will have cost around £5-6k - it's the ancillary items which knock the costs up.

For the teak deck knockers regarding GRP boats: I say - each to their own, I love them and have happily lived with them in tropical climes

 

[Stork_III]

I'd like some views on refurbing a 25yr old teal deck. it seems well attached but the years of scrubbing have naturally taken a couple ofmm off the thickness leaving the caulking standing proud and some of the plugs too. Other plugs are thin enough to be coming away as disks. The deck is still pretty thick, 5mm perhaps.

Can anything be done to refresh it And more importantly to prolong its life? Im thinking of

Getting it flat agin -but how? What would a belt sander do with caulking? Having done that is it feasible to remove the screws, reborn their seats a bit lower and replace with new plugs? It's a big job, but worth it? Replacement must be a 10 - 12K job.

Or walk away?

Hallberg Rassy sell reduced height head screws for extending life of teak decks. http://www.hr-parts.com/contents/en-us/p1229.html

 

[BabaYaga]

Easiest and safest method for removing excess caulking is IMO to use a razor type blade like this:

http://www.hobbytools.com.au/david-combi-blades-pkt-10/

You wrap it in tape both ends, just leaving 6mm or so centrally on the edges. Let the tape overshoot the sides, to provide you with "handles". Hold it slightly bent between thumb and index both hands and cut along the seam.

 

[xeitosaphil]

I'd like some views on refurbing a 25yr old teal deck. it seems well attached but the years of scrubbing have naturally taken a couple ofmm off the thickness leaving the caulking standing proud and some of the plugs too. Other plugs are thin enough to be coming away as disks. The deck is still pretty thick, 5mm perhaps.

Can anything be done to refresh it And more importantly to prolong its life? Im thinking of

Getting it flat agin -but how? What would a belt sander do with caulking? Having done that is it feasible to remove the screws, reborn their seats a bit lower and replace with new plugs? It's a big job, but worth it? Replacement must be a 10 - 12K job.

Or walk away?

Can't help thinking that if the deck is only 5mm thick, that by the time you have counter bored for a new plug there is no depth left for a fixing?

To remove all the grain plugs would be a difficult job in itself without damaging the hole sides, and to refit plugs if you can get the right size would also be hit and miss to make anything of a job of it.
When fitting a new deck the holes are machined as close as possible to the exact size of the grain plug that is going to fit in it. Having done loads of this grain plugging and using flat parallel sided plugs you really need about 3mm Minimum depth to have a decent amount of plug in the hole even when glued in. I expect your discs that have come out are only about 1.0mm thick or less.

You say that the caulking and also some grain plugs are proud – are you talking about recently?

As you must know, wintertime and with all the water we have had the decks will have expanded causing the caulk to be compressed. If you remove it in these conditions you could find when in summer and the decks have contracted that the caulk has insufficient mass to remain within its workable expansion rates and will pull away from the groove sides allowing water in?
A belt sander is a wonderful thing in the right hands, but if your plugs are relatively thin you could end up sanding right through to the screws.

IMHO I would leave well alone – you could end up with a mountain of work and a finished job that looks far from pleasurable. The odd plugs that have come out you could always play with to see if you could do as you suggest, and see how you get on?

 

[Tradewinds]

I don't think you necessarily have to worry about the screw fixings at this point in time - unless you have a lot of loose planks of course. My old decks were epoxied down and held with screws at the plank ends. If decks were laid on a bed of Sikaflex (say) 20 years ago and the planks had stayed firmly in place I don't see any reason to worry about removing screws that we used initially to hold the decking in position while the adhesive cured. Take them out, seal & then plug the hole.

It was bloody hard work to remove my old planking - it was well and truly glued down - the screws were superfluous.

All IMO of course!

 

[Talulah]

I've recently been replacing a large number of missing teak plugs.
I discard the old screw and do not replace them. Instead I drill down to make the plug hole deeper and fill the screw hole with 5 minute epoxy.
The plugs in the cockpit are 10mm. The ones on deck are 8mm.
As others have said the teak is sitting on a bed of Silkaflex and is adequately stuck down.
If deepening the hole then it's best to use a Forstner bit but I use a standard drill bit in a cordless drill with the torque at minimum. Without the torque at minimum you risk the drill digging much deeper than you want.
I use an orbital sander with 80 or 40 grit to sand down the proud plugs.

 

[MASH]

Thanks everyone, it isn't my boat (yet) so intrusive investigation is not possible at present. The decking was originally about 14-15mm thick as best I can measure it from a close up photo. - what spec (thickness) planking might have been used on a 1988 UK built boat? Did teak then come in standard thicknesses or would it have been machined to suit by the yard?

Wear is up to a max of 3mm as far as I can see. How deep do the plugs usually go from the surface - is there a standard? Would 2-3mm wear usually start to make the plugs a bit thin?

Does sanding the deck risk making the grooves for the caulking too shallow to take fresh caulking, and would it be advisable/feasible to rake out the old caulking and replace it? The job is beginning to look massive - its a 36footer, esp if it means routing out the grooves too. I bet removing old caulking is a sod of a job..?

 

[Rossynant]

Wear is up to a max of 3mm as far as I can see. How deep do the plugs usually go from the surface - is there a standard? Would 2-3mm wear usually start to make the plugs a bit thin?

Does sanding the deck risk making the grooves for the caulking too shallow to take fresh caulking, and would it be advisable/feasible to rake out the old caulking and replace it? The job is beginning to look massive - its a 36footer, esp if it means routing out the grooves too. I bet removing old caulking is a sod of a job..?

No idea if there is any standard for plugs - standard for real teak deck is 1" minimum, so you can bore down a 10 mm no probs. On an imitation... hmm... I'd suspect 5 mm.
Only thing sensible is to actually measure how much is left. Deepening the holes may be possible. Problem is with caulking. Normal way of caulking is to make groves for it half the deck depth; or less Done replacing caulking on worn down deck - some groves were less than 5 mm deep and caulking tore out from them during the season. They must be deeper.

If caulking is sound and keeps in grove - it can be sanded down, this is normal way of dealing with it. Or should be, I'd not speculate on material in question. I've sanded Sikaflex, for instance. Sanding may lift old caulk which is no longer sticking there...

Lets be honest - immitation teak deck is dispensable item, used once. You just make sure if this is still sound or not. If not - should be taken off and may still be relayed, this time glued on epoxy, no screws; personally I would not bother.

If sound - can be washed and cleaned, getting wood nice and fresh with proper colour and such without further sanding, and oiled or protected similar way, so no more sanding down will be necessary. Plugs that are no longer there (or will fall of) may be repaired by epoxy putty with matching colour, or mixed with wood dust etc, so won't look that bad and glued down to screw heads. And so on.

PS On one boat specs there was "peroba, cosmetic layer, 12 mm"... What type boat in question?

 

[BabaYaga]

The decking was originally about 14-15mm thick as best I can measure it from a close up photo.
Wear is up to a max of 3mm as far as I can see. How deep do the plugs usually go from the surface - is there a standard? Would 2-3mm wear usually start to make the plugs a bit thin?
Does sanding the deck risk making the grooves for the caulking too shallow to take fresh caulking, and would it be advisable/feasible to rake out the old caulking and replace it? The job is beginning to look massive - its a 36footer, esp if it means routing out the grooves too. I bet removing old caulking is a sod of a job..?

It makes a huge difference for remaining life expectancy if the teak is 14 minus 3 = 11mm thick or 5mm (as per first post) IMO.
Depth of the plug depends on depth of the hole, most likely made manually as the deck was laid, so will vary.
On a teak deck of that age plugs will fall out more or less, if it becomes yours you must find a way to deal with it. Measure the exact dimension, supply yourself with spares plugs, glue etc.
The most crucial question, as I see it, is the quality of the bedding. If you can be convinced that this good (=low risk of water penetrating into the deck core) and provided the remaining thickness is 10mm or so – then recaulking etc might might be an option. If not, better to remove the teak and put on a new deck on (or refurbish in some other way).
I took off a 25 years old teak deck originally 12mm thick a few years ago, mostly because it was laid down without proper bedding (just some silicone string in various spots). Some major work had to be done to the deck core. Despite belt sanding twice, some scrubbing and general wear over 25 years the teak planks were nowhere thinner than 9,5mm, mostly 10,5 to 11mm.
Put new teak on – bedded down in good quality PU-bedding. Will see me out, I hope.