Old Teak Deck ?What Alternative

[hamish]

Hi All

teak desks replace with an alternative or what?

In the May issue of Yachting Monthly there is an article under Survey, Survey Survey in which 3 boats on the 2nd hand market are discussed. Two of these a Oyster 39 (1979) and a Hallberg Rassy 42 (1981) have very poor teak desks. So much so that replacement costs of 25K plus are mentioned.

Much that we may all love new teak desks, is their any other alternative to have your desk replaced? Is this cost 25% in case of the Oyster worth it. ? Boat is on offer at 79.5K. These are not new boats and the new owner is looking for long term liveaboard usage.Would it be Ok to remove all the teak and replace with, to start this theme, Treadmaster?

Would not effect the sailing of these boats and your long term ownership.

best regards and a happy Easter

Hamish

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[jonjo]

I do not think *fitting* a new teak deck costs £25k, more like £15k on yachts of this size. Look at new boat option prices for an idea of what it costs to fit a teak deck in a factory at the right point in production.

The article mentions the extra labour involved in removing the old deck, deck fittings and plugging leaks. Then add haul out and shed storage.

I know of a company in Thrapston (North Hants) that supplies made up teak deck panels to luxury power boat manufacturers. Unlike cheaper kit decks that are laid on ply this alternative is bonded to a synthetic mat that in turn is easier for the d.i.y.er to bond to a grp deck. Making up the templates is still a big job.

Personally I would slap down treadmaster and go sailing, but it would no longer be a genuine HR!

The Surveyx3 series tends to emphasise what a bad financial deal buying an old boat is. Each month I note the pro surveyor trying to guide the purchaser to newest yacht of the bunch.

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[Bob]

Try this agent for FLEXITEEK http://www.cruiser.co.za/fairsail.asp - a low cost, low maintanence alternative. Looks like teak, beautiful, and does not stain.

Good luck

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[Talbot]

Best have a word with TwisterKen, he is the resident expert on how to make a long (!) and careful replacement of teak decks/forums/images/icons/smile.gif

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[pvb]

Resurrecting teak...

Surveyors will often say that a deck needs replacing. But it's often possible to make a substantial improvement to a worn teak deck with very careful sanding. If the deck was screwed down, you can buy new low-profile screws and replacement teak plugs. Once it looks half-decent, it can be kept that way with very gentle cleaning.

Treadmaster is a great alternative, but it will reduce the boat's residual value if most examples of the marque have teak as standard.

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[ranga]

I agree that the figure would be closer to 15k. I had a new teak deck fitted onto my nic 45 a couple years back down in Plymouth and the figure was around that amount - excellent job too.

I did consider replacing it with something cheaper, but it would not have done the boat justice.

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[Twister_Ken]

Wise after the event

What I've discovered is that the real cost of replacing a teak deck is not buying and laying the new teak which can be costed in terms of materials and manpower fairly easily. The less-quantifiable costs are stripping the deck furniture, which might require some disassembly below decks, removing the old teak*, and then reinstating the deck furniture after completion. It's relatively easy to say "remove anchor winch", but when you get around to it if you find one bolt that's frozen and some damaged gelcoat under the winch suddenly the cost for removing that item is doubled, or trebled. Note that this work needs to be done whether you are considering replacing teak with teak, with a teak-a-like plastic, with Treadmaster, or just plain old deck paint. Indeed, for Treadmaster and paint considerably more 'making good ' work needs to be done compared to teak-to-teak.

On the up-side, much of this work is 'semi-skilled' and the owner can undertake quite a lot of it him or herself. Bear in mind though that what takes you a month of weekends might take a brace of shipwrights a couple of days, so don't forget to cost in any increased storage charges if you are doing the job yourself.

*Removing old deck. You need to know how the old deck is fixed. In my case it appeared to be screwed in place. It was, but it was also bedded on extremely grippy mastic, so the time taken to remove the deck was about 3x the estimate. I know of another boat where the teak was bedded onto epoxy, so after the deck had been removed the entire deck area had to be planed to put a flat surface on the old epoxy.

Teak decks are nice to look at, nice to sail with, but they don't have an infinite life and they can be a money pit when eventually they need replacing.

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[alec]

Re: Wise after the event

Ken,

I do hope that this post is not interpreted to be aggressive in any way, as it is a genuine request for information.

Ethically, we are told that by buying teak we contribute not only to human suffering but also taking away the future of these very same people.

I would very interested to hear your views on this subject.


Regards,


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[Twister_Ken]

Ethical teak.

Teak is also grown in sustainable plantations.

I have asked that the teak for my deck comes from such sources for exactly the concerns you expressed.



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[DeeGee]

Re: Ethical teak.

A Tradewind 35 had a sad teak deck with the sikaflex shrunk to nothingness and standing proud in many places, but the teak itself had not lifted at all.

The remedy was a jig attached to a router, which routed out all the old sikaflex, then new sikaflex was applied. The deck received a final sanding and looked brand-new.

I thought teak decks were never screwed down? always bonded, and the teak decking has a rebate so all the pieces come together with teak-bottomed groove?

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[heerenleed]

Ethical teak? No good for laid decks....

We have gone through the same process. The old teak decks were severely mistreated with pressurized water, and byond salvage (some places had only 1mm left) We have informed ourselves and in the process we found out that "ethical" teak is grown too fast and works too much for a stable installation on deck..

We chose Marinedeck, a cork-and-artificial resin product. We found the job not byond our skills and the new decks look fine.

Greatest advantage: once you fill all the screw holes of the old deck, your deck remains waterproof, instead of drilling thousand holes in it again.

We shall put the full story on our web site soon.

cheers



<hr width=100% size=1>Peter a/b SV Heerenleed, Steenbergen, Netherlands

 

[robmurray]

Re: Resurrecting teak...

I have been trying to work out how worn my teak deck is and likely life. It seems to have worn at worst 1mm out of the 10 originally in 11 years but I have a few screw heads now showing. So if I replace these screws as you suggest sounds like I will get many more years?

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[Twister_Ken]

Re: Resurrecting teak...

Check first whether you need to replace the screws. It may be enough just to remove them and make good the hole. In my case the screws were really either the belt or the braces, with the mastic doing the real work. A few screws less wouldn't have made the deck insecure. That may be the case for you too.

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[Twister_Ken]

Screwing

I thought teak decks were never screwed down? always bonded,
Mileage varies on this. It depends on the individual boatbuilder and how they chose to do it.

I have three pop cans full of removed screws to prove that Hartley Marine of Hoo, Kent, used screws in 1980!

The trouble with screws is that you put loads of holes in the deck. Not a clever idea if you have balsa cored decks. It only takes one leak to cause major problems. The trouble with bonding down is that you can create a nightmare for someone else when (not if) the deck needs to be replaced.

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[alec]

Re: Ethical teak.

About six months ago I conducted exhaustive enquiry’s trying to find teak grown in a sustainable way.

No doubt you have succeeded where I have failed.

I would be grateful if you could let me know the name and address of your supplier.


Regards,


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[BrianReynolds]

Re: Ethical teak.

Hi I am interested in how you fill the gaps between the teak planking with sikaflex. I have a few areas where the sikaflex has come out. But the gap is only about 2mm diameter and will be hard to "Fill". How do you do it? Thanks
Brian

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[DeeGee]

Re: Ethical teak.

As I mentioned above, the rejuvenation I know of routed out the old sikaflex - using a router bit exactly the right size and a jig which used the next-door groove to 'distance-off' the routing action (first groove needs one-off jigging). This may sound complicated but it isn't actualy v difficult.

As to the filling of the gaps, masking tape plays a bit of a role as does care. Never try to remove excess skf whilst it is still sticky. Best trick is to experiment in the garage - skf is funny stuff. Maybe someone else can expand on this better than I. I didn't actually have to do the job myself!!

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[alec]

Re: Ethical teak.

Ken,

Still waiting for the name and address of that sustainable teak supplier you used.

Would like to make a few bits before the season gets going.

Regards,

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[BrendanS]

Re: Ethical teak.

Why such a bee in your bonnet? Do you buy Nestle products? Do you wear leather shoes? Drive a car, use electricity, have a boat? They all have faults due to social or environmental impact. Most go with their own personal conscience, and the level of devotedness to PC constraints varies.


From you previous posts, I don't believe your questions are really around you finding a supplier of teak from renewable sources, more making a point that you don't believe anyone should buy teak from sources which cannot prove they are renewable? Maybe I'm wrong, but you seem to want to foist you opinions on everyone?



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[Twister_Ken]

Re: Ethical teak.

No idea who the supplier is. I've just asked the yard to make sure the teak comes from a sustainable source.

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