Oceanis 320 Opinions

[Stemar]

Having just retired, a friend is looking to buy his first boat. He isn't looking to go round the world, and she'll be based on the east coast, possibly in the Walton area.

He's likely to be single handing much of the time but would like to draw his wife into sailing, though she's unlikely to be more than an intelligent autopilot when she comes.

He's looked at a couple of Oceanis 320 and he's asked my opinion of them.

Having never set foot on one, from a quick trawl around the net, they look to me as though they'd tick all the wifely boxes of comfort alongside and space, but I'm wondering what they'd be like to sail, especially when the weather kicks up. There's one that only draws 3'9", which strickes me as worryingly shallow 'cos I'm under the impression that it's still a fin. The broad stern gives loads of room for an aft cabin, but I fear the rudder would lose its grip when the boat heels

Is this a fair assessment? All serious comments, good or bad, appreciated.

 

[Tranona]

The shallow fin probably has a wing or bulb on the bottom to maintain stability. Ultimate performance may suffer because of the inefficient foil. The hull shape is almost universal now, and I doubt that somebody new to sailing would find anything amiss with it. He is hardly likely to deliberately go out when it "kicks up" and will learn to sail it within its performance envelop.

Are you insinuating that a "manly" person does not appreciate a light bright well designed interior that you can stand up in, a loo you can actually use, a galley big enough to do more than heat up a tin of Frey Bentos and separate sleeping cabins so that you don't have to crash out on the saloon settee?

I am sure that your friend will be more than happy with a 320 - after all he probably does not have the hang ups of an "old style" sailor.

 

[Elemental]

I expect you'll get all sorts of replies. My take on this (and many other AWB boats of the same generation) is as follows.

They're not the greatest sailing boats ever made (too fat). Nor do they have fantastic stability curves. Their rigs are often conservative, because they don't sail well when heeled (see first point). They often have shallow fins which may mean they don't always make great progress to windward in a seaway.

However, they are great holiday platforms. They are large internally, which means they're comfortable in harbours. They're (on the whole) well made, 25 years on and often still look like new internally. They sail well enough - often much faster than more traditional designs/builds, especially in lighter air's and offwind directions. Their conservative rigs are usually easy to handle. They look good to some observers. The shallow fin means an east coast sailor can get into more places at lower states of tide.

I have a Ben. 351. It's like a tardis, swallowing a whole family plus associated stuff + fishing gear + winsurfer, liferaft dinghy and outboard with ease.

One day, I'll swap it for something more performant. Till then it's been fine in F8+.

If your friend would like his wife to come aboard and start to learn to enjoy sailing I'd think the 320 is a good candidate boat.

 

[cmedsailor]

As far as I know (and actually seen around the boatyard), the 320,390,430 etc series, did not have fin keels but something like a semi long keel. That means larger in size but no so deep. So I guess they still have the acceptable ballast ratio of a normal AWB but will probably not point very well. You could claim that due to their, consequently, shallower rudder you will loose grip when heeling but don't expect sailing angles above 20 degrees for any AWB even with deep fin keel; even my 1.80m deep keel version Oceanis 361 despite not loosing grip up to 25 degrees it doesn't feel confortable above 20 degrees of heeling.

 

[Stemar]

Are you insinuating that a "manly" person does not appreciate a light bright well designed interior that you can stand up in, a loo you can actually use, a galley big enough to do more than heat up a tin of Frey Bentos and separate sleeping cabins so that you don't have to crash out on the saloon settee?

Not at all. I appreciate them as much as anyone, but I'd rather not have them at the cost of a boat that rounds up uncontrollably in a gust and has wide open spaces below with nothing to hang on to. I've sailed on boats that have both "qualities". The first was, shall we say, disconcerting, as we were trying to keep out of the way of a container ship at the time; the second involved an evening in A&E and several weeks of pain. I will confess that the weather in both cases was far more suitable for sitting by a warm fire than sailing. Maybe the sea's trying to tell me something

That isn't to say I think the 320 has either fault, I simply don't know, which is why I'm asking for other people's thoughts. I do know such boats suit a lot of people or BenJenBav etc wouldn't make 'em. All that space makes me very jealous - and a shallow draft - great, especially for the east coast, but what to you pay for them?

If the only problem is that you might need to turn the engine on to give a hand when things turn nasty, I'm sure my friend would live with that. I do with Jissel, and I haven't even got the space, but I haven't got his budget, either.

 

[Victoria Sponge]

We have a lift keel 323, which we sail on the East Coast. I love it for all the usual SWMBO reasons; it's roomy, comfortable, and has nice heads. That said I have no trouble sailing her. We were out in the high winds the other weekend and I was helming, she sailed really well.

 

[Tranona]

Maybe the sea's trying to tell me something

"Its not the boats, but thems wot sail in them....."

Seriously, the amount of time spent in bad weather is minimal in these days of better forecasting and it does not seem to make sense to accept the limitations of a boat that might be a bit better (but still uncomfortable) in those conditions. When I made the switch from old heavy long keeler to AWB it was a revelation. So much more user friendly and SWMBO started enjoying it!

 

[Stemar]

"Its not the boats, but thems wot sail in them....."

You are, of course quite right. There's a part of me that wants to sail off into the sunset in a heavy long keeler and perhaps that showed in my comments but, being realistic, I'm not willing to give up my present life with my family to do it, neither am I likely to have the money, so I'll stick with a more reasonable dream of taking Jissel round the UK when I retire.

Seriously, the amount of time spent in bad weather is minimal in these days of better forecasting and it does not seem to make sense to accept the limitations of a boat that might be a bit better (but still uncomfortable) in those conditions.

Again, you're right and, as the owner of a Snapdragon 24, I'm hardly in a position to criticise someone who buys a boat of less than scintillating performance and that needs a bit of iron genny to help her to windward. I could get jealous of the comfort and space, though.


Thanks for your help everyone. It sounds as though a 320 could suit my friend.

 

[doug748]

The shallow fin probably has a wing or bulb on the bottom to maintain stability. Ultimate performance may suffer because of the inefficient foil. The hull shape is almost universal now, and I doubt that somebody new to sailing would find anything amiss with it. He is hardly likely to deliberately go out when it "kicks up" and will learn to sail it within its performance envelop.

Are you insinuating that a "manly" person does not appreciate a light bright well designed interior that you can stand up in, a loo you can actually use, a galley big enough to do more than heat up a tin of Frey Bentos and separate sleeping cabins so that you don't have to crash out on the saloon settee?

I am sure that your friend will be more than happy with a 320 - after all he probably does not have the hang ups of an "old style" sailor.

I know nothing about the boat either.

 

[Tranona]

I know nothing about the boat either.

Neither did the OP but he had come to some very firm conclusions! Maybe like me, not the best person to advise his friend other than in the general terms that I have (confirmed by owners of similar boats).

 

[BAtoo]

I believe i'm correct on this......

The Oceanis 320 hull is essentially the same as the Figaro1/Bene First 310/First 31.7. The deck moulding varies in all of these, as does the freeboard on the hull. On the Oceanis its the highest freeboard and a most voluminous topsides.

Couple this with a "de-tuned" rig (smaller) and "optimised" (shallower) keel and the sailing difference is obvious.... the Oceanis may struggle to sail well but the accommodation will be great...

 

[bluedragon]

I have actually chartered a 320 for two weeks, but it was in 1994 in Turkey! So the memory is a bit vague. I also had a 323 on charter a few years later in France. Neither in high winds or big seas I might add. For fair weather sailing, both did the job fine. They are never going to sail as well as the more racy designs, so what does the friend want to do? If it's club racing = wrong boat, if it's pottering around the East Coast and good accommodation is important, then possibly a good choice.

 

[Puggy]

hi Stemar,

I looked after a fleet of 320s when i worked at Sunsail in Turkey back at the end of the last ice age. Excellent boats that were popular and always booked. Robust and easy to fix. The shoal draft did make for lots of leeway and you are correct that the rudder will break out if pushed hard. You just have to reef early, and our Jeanneau 35s in the fleet would outsail them on almost every point. However, most people didnt care and loved the comfort and spaciousness, and they were a good looking boat in their day.

Rgds Piers

 

[bluedragon]

Hey, must have been one of your clients! Were you Marmaris Marina? They were OK boats weren't they.

 

[Lucky Duck]

I believe i'm correct on this......

The Oceanis 320 hull is essentially the same as the Figaro1/Bene First 310/First 31.7. The deck moulding varies in all of these, as does the freeboard on the hull. On the Oceanis its the highest freeboard and a most voluminous topsides.

It was the Oceanis 311 that shared the same basic hull design with the First 31.7, the 320 is quite different in many respects.

 

[Tranona]

This highly successful Philippe Briand design appeared in 1987. She had all the hallmarks of the early boats - high volume hull and broad transom, cutaway forefoot wrap over window, and spacious if simple accommodation. She had a long, quite shallow keel and spade rudder. Below decks the large galley faced the dinette, an effective in harbour arrangement but not so practical at sea. She also managed a forward facing chart table with a bookcase. There were large double cabins fore and aft and a generous head in the port quarter. She had a moderate rig which was easy to handle and she performed reasonably well off the wind in medium airs. Her tiller steering could be a handful if pushed hard to windward.

YM Review of the Beneteau range June 2001 Full test report August 1988 issue.

Says it all really.

 

[Puggy]

Hey, must have been one of your clients! Were you Marmaris Marina? They were OK boats weren't they.

Yes Marmaris based with Flotillas up towards Datca etc in 92 to 94. Very happy days!