Now this is REAL boating!

Forbsie

Forbsie

Well-Known Member
Joined
9 Mar 2002
Messages
3,494
Visit site
Having read the exploits and tribulations of various V***o owners over the past couple of weeks, I would like to, with the very kind help of Boatone, present my own engine troubles. Just to remind the panel, I have a Buckingham 25, acquired free out of a garden. The engine is a Ford Sierra 2.1 diesel with Bowman heat exchanger and Lancine Marine marinization kit.

Pics of engine at http://www.boatsontheweb.com/forbsie (no comments about the stern shot, please!!).

There are indications that it may have been a never completed marinization job.

What to do with it now? It has very weird pipework all over the place such as the exhaust going a full circle before exiting the boat and one pipe over another to reduce diameters. Generally it looks like a botched job. As Boatone has said, take it out anyway - to fix or dump. I am not frightened of replacing the engine but do you have any comments, looking at this wonderful photography, whether it is worth recovering?
 
Looking at those pics, I'd say you've got your work cut out here. Take the thing out and have a good look at the thing. Being and ex car engine you can't really be sure how many miles or hours the thing has run. Strip all the marinizing bits of and keep. Strip the enginge and have a good look at it. then you can decide whether to repair or replace. But you do have the kit and the gearbox!

Wha'dya mean "I'm always playing with this engine" its the only way to get it to run!
 
Hit it with a hammer - it either breaks or works

Did you budget for a new engine or a rebuild? If not then just patch it up and leave well enough alone. It will either run for years or blow up in a cloud of steam at the first bend - once it's blown up, that's the time to take it it and try and figure out where the pipework goes...

Looks like a large enough project <G>

Go left, YOUR OTHER left for pete's sake
(IMHO, BTW, FWIW and NWGOI)
 
As previous posts, it looks a mess, obviously been exposed to the elements for a long time. Take it out and sort it out on the bench, much easier than in the boat, then you can check all the various bits and pieces and clean things up. I would also partially strip the engine to assess the internal condition and recondition if required. If OK then re-assemble it with the marinisation bits and pieces and bench run it to see if everything is OK. It all depends on your finances, if you can afford a new engine, fit it, otherwise it will be cheaper to repair/rebuild the existing. Lancing Marine will help I'm sure. A nice winter job. Hull looks OK though.
Good luck, keep us informed of progress
 
Umm, probably about to mildly contentious here!
Firstly I don't think its a Sierra lump it was probably a 1980/81 Granada. The engine is actually a Peugeot, used in I think P 504's. The reason I know that it's Granada is that I had the misfortune to own one. Much later talking to a guy who worked in Fords warranty department, he said that a vast amount were replaced under warranty, frequently they were replaced with the later Peugeot 2.3litre unit that was definitely used in the Sierra.
The 2.1 suffered from corrosion of the block where the bottom of the liners met it,
this is what had happened to mine. It looked like a blown head gasket when they
started investigating and ended as a complete NEW replacement engine as the old one was not suitable for exchange! The end bill was around £ 1800 in 1985.

So my contentious bit is that I'd dump it and find something else, possibly a 1.6D from an Escort and marinise that.

Jim
-------
 
Looks like a nice boat! I like the blue. Does the engine work, as in turn the props and such. If so, chuck in river and off you go. I would. As barryD says, fix it after it's blown up, not before.
 
Forbsie's engine is something else! I have to say that whatever I was expecting to see I was ill-prepared for what I was confronted with. I had offered to drop by and cast an eye over said engine some time ago cos he's not that far away from me, his boats similar in many ways to my previous Norman 32 and I do need to get out more. The lure of an offer of a pub lunch also had not a little to do with it!

Its quite likely that the engine has run at some time, still indications of diesel in loose pipes etc, but it certainly looks like a botched amateur install. Pipes of every imaginable size seem to run hither and thither and although we could trace some sort of logical progression from raw water intake via oil cooler to impeller pump through heat exchanger out into exhaust bend (bend????? more like a pipe sculpture of the large intestine) it was (is) all rather convoluted and ill planned. The engine doesnt fit the boat, no-way floorboards can be replaced around it and would definitely need boxing in on top. No fixing nuts on at least two engine mounts. Drive belt path significantly out of true. Small manually operated fuel lift pump/filter sort of tacked on to a bit of angle iron.Rubber fuel lines and spill rails. Hoses nested inside hoses to try and match diameters etc etc.
All hoses actually disconnected and lying around loose but we did manage to sort of see how eveything might connect up! Lancing Marine gearbox connects to Sonic Outdrive shaft thru transom. Couldnt really look at outdrive cos tide in but looked in much better nick than engine!

My view, as Forbsie says, would be to get it out and then decide what next. Inside boat needs a good clean out anyway and if engine is ok at least in could then be reinstalled properly with new pipe runs etc etc. If its total cr*p it will need to come out anyway so nothing lost!

To those here who advocate running it until it goes wrong............forget it !!!! It aint going to go without major action plan. Forbsie very philosophical about all this (whch IMHO very good thing cos less likely to throw himself off ladder at high tide) and obviously relishes labour-of-love nature of bringing boat back to life so common sense out of window and practical approach to doing it anyway much more important!

Thanks for the coke and crisps Forbsie - nice to meet you and sorry no pony tail!!
Look frorward to seeing how things progress!



www.boatsonthethames.co.uk
 
It doesn't inspire confidence does it?
I'm not sure I would want to take it on the water as it is, the wiring and plumbing looks like a recipe for disaster.

Chances are, engine may be ok, after all if you had installed this, having paid out for marinising kit etc: you would make sure engine was sound before fitting. It may be that things just went downhill from there.

I would do minimum amount of work to try and get engine to run up as it is, if this ok ( no excessive smoke, good oil press etc ) I wold then take it all out, clean it up, paint it, then re install it properly replacing all that dodgy wiring and plumbing.That sort of work is more a labour of love, than costly, but you must make sure the basic ingrediants are sound.
good luck.
 
Ahh So! Now we see why it was given away free with no Weatabix! Maybe that tells us something. Maybe better to sit back a bit and look at alternatives before spending dosh. As I understand it, boat costs to date, stand at £0000. Lets presume engine ****. So can one find new engine from scrap yard that will fit, and how much. Then how much to maranate?? it. Pinching bits from old engine where possible. Now got some idea of cost of boat in working condition. So how much is boat worth now?? If more than cost of job, carry on, if less then??? From experience, trying to put right other peoples cock ups can be very expencive and maybe with no rewards. Specially as engine dont seem to fit boat. Or how about. Just stick an outboard on the back and have a useable boat by the weekend.

No one can force me to come here-----------
----- I'm a Volunteer!!!

Haydn
 
He was a bit of a plumber, wasn't he, the guy who installed that. Either that, or a dexion's midnight runner.

Looks a massive job. I'd be inclined to get an auxill outboard, incase it busts, and otherwise just run it and see wot happens.

The Vee belt was badly out of alignment though, might need a fix.

Agree it looks good, esp the blue hull

Is there a competition going on over arse shots, eh BarryD, that I dont know about? :-)
 
Engine is definitely coming out - that's one decision made. I have spoken to Lancing Marine and looked on CoastalRide.com (unfortunately they are on holiday until weekend) and reckon with all the b****ring about it will be cheaper to put in a new lump. Lancing were even talking around the £650 mark for a 40hp! Add some engineering time and there is really no question...well only one!

How does one get the engine out of the boat?
 
Now then, there's an interesting question.............
Surely there must be some where on the island with a small crane? Shouldnt take long, after all at least two of the mounts dont have nuts on already! Just need to disconnect the connection to the stern drive which looked easy enough to get to.
Pretty much everything else was disconnected already!!!!
Ask the guys in the yard, Im sure theyll have come across the problem before.
Glad Lancing Marine were helpful, thought they would be.




www.boatsonthethames.co.uk
 
Nice hull but motor, aaaaagh!

Start afresh, what a sight that motor is. I really like the application of the dexion stuff. The 0 cost so far and the expected cost of replacement motor will make it a reasonably economical purchase if the hull is OK. At least with a fresh start and some interest on your part you will know afterwards how it all works. By the look of the photos understanding the present installation would defy the most persistant of engineers and most likely it didn't go too well in the first place, except as a garden ornament. Looks like a worthwhile project, good luck.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

Top