Not such a bad piece of legislation

awol

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Despite the knee-jerk moaning on the various fora re drink-navigation legislation proposals, I find it difficult to get excited. Perhaps I am odd, but getting plastered and then navigating a boat has never held much attraction for me and I tend to despise those who do drink and sail.
Drink-driving legislation certainly reduced the toll of destruction on our roads - incidentally, I have never been breathalysed in over 40 years of driving - and the banning of smoking in public places is already showing an improvement in health in Ireland and Scotland. Both these measures are the type of social legislation that is actually beneficial to the majority and drink-navigation probably falls in the same bucket.
Ok, so the freedom to do something is being eroded, but the freedom of the majority not to be subjected to stupid and dangerous behaviour is reinforced.
 

ShipsWoofy

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First they came for the Jews
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for the Communists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left
to speak out for me.


Pastor Martin Niemöller
 

SteveA

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I totally disagree with you - the government in this country is making such a nanny state I wish I could leave.

Smoking ban - why not have a choice, it's not illegal to smoke!

Surely we must have enough legislation alreay for excess drinking.

I think I read recently that Mr Blair and his chums have created 7 new laws a day since he came to power.
 

Major Catastrophe

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[ QUOTE ]
The only problem is that none of them are enforced.

[/ QUOTE ]

But the boat drinking one will be because on a Sunday afternoon as everyone makes their way back to the marina, it will be like shooting fish in a barrel.

It is ridiculous to compare drink driving with drink boating. I don't generally drink and boat, but I have been known to return from a picnic anchorage with more than the legal limit, but there were few pedestrians to hit.

As I have pointed out on other threads, if anchored or tied up for the night the wind blows up and you have to move, that half bottle of red will make you a criminal.
 

ChrisE

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Let\'s have a sense of perspective here

Oh for God's sake, DW, we're talking about drinking and driving, not genocide.

If you're pissed you shouldn't be in charge of a craft, period. We all love our freedoms but that comes with the responsibility of being able to conduct ourselves in a responsible manner when we are called to. Including moving a boat after a few beers. Arguably, a skipper that chooses to get rat-arsed with a big wind forecast shouldn't be in charge in the first place.

Tough love, maybe.

The reality will be that nothing will happen unless a pissed skipper hits something hard and then could be prosecuted.

I find it quite hard to agree with a human rights poem when we're talking about a minor inconvenience to a few people partaking in minority sport compared with the genocidal tendencies of a police state.
 

jimi

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Re: Let\'s have a sense of perspective here

well said Chris, if my boat was TBones by a rat arsed idiot I'd would'nt be happy.
 

Slow_boat

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[ QUOTE ]
- and the banning of smoking in public places is already showing an improvement in health in Ireland and Scotland.


[/ QUOTE ]

I wouldn't be at all surprised if the figures that prove that were, well, interestingly inturpreted to prove that, if you see what I mean. /forums/images/graemlins/ooo.gif
 

benjenbav

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Re: Let\'s have a sense of perspective here

I've often wondered about the process by which one drives one's boat back to the marina after a few sherbets and then the alcohol magically clears one's system in time to drive home.
 

andymcp

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The problem is perhaps less that it's a misguided piece of legislation, but that it fundamentally is a bad piece of legislation. The intention may be honorable, but the delivery is a pile of proverbial.

If I park a car for the night, have a few beers, there are precious few circumstances where I would be forced to jump behind the wheel. Hence single dimension drink drive limits are workable. Child car seat rules have the flexibility to cope with unexpected events whereby you cannot comply. Both of these examples are sensible, workable laws.

Sticking a single dimension, rigid law on recreational boating is a complete turd of a law. As has already been pointed out, there are two dimensions to this legislation that probably give an indication of how ill-thought through it is.

i) There already exists a law allowing the prosecution of anyone drunk in charge of a vessel, regardless of size or speed.
ii) It has been announced several years after the consultation, at the same time that a case based on drunk nautical behaviour that caused a death has come to its conclusion.

Incidentally, it crossed my mind that in other governmental areas, there is a limit on the time I am permitted to use approval for the intended purpose, e.g. building warrants, planning applications etc. There appears to be no limit on how long a govt can use the output of a long-forgotten consultation to enact new laws, however......
 

tcm

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yes, i agree with chrise and jimi who feel it sensibly correct...but also with you in that a law must be a "good" law.

I recently used the argument of being a bit ratarsed to win my flat refusal for not movingboat off fuel pontoon at sable d'olonne at 4am. But what if another boat had needed to do summink, or broken free? I would have had to move, and would have. This just doesn't happen with cars.

Provided that the law is applied sensibly,yep, ok...but laws are there to be applied in an adversarial court system, and hence universally.

I can think of lots of situations where it wouldn't be applied sensibly where the right thing to do would be to move the boat and where (of course!) chrisE and jimi would not be on the Bench.

However...( i dunno if people know this but i heard it anyway...) you are allowed to drive a car whilst over the limit in extreme medical emergency. I don't condone drivihg driving of boats whilst sloshd but there would need to be sensible application of a drinking-boating rule in perhaps les extreme but stil important situations - not least of which arises becos you remain incharge of boat whilst getting lightly lashed below, but you don't do the same in the car.

Without proper application and definition almost to the point of a meaningless law, even a half decent lawyer should fancy his chances: find a drunken party boat, wham your boat into it and wey-hey - it's *their* fault cos the skipper is sloshed!

I think yet more huff and puff here, and no law will result.
 

Sixpence

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I don't know if it's right to say you're allowed to drive a car in such cases but there would probably be an allowance made for extenuating circumstances , but the other extreme is that if you're nissed as a pewt with the car keys in your pocket and no intention of driving , you can get done for being drunk in charge , so I don't know if the same could apply to having boat keys in your pocket when intending to sleep onboard , which would stuff most people
 

DJE

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And one about driving with due care which adequately covers mobile phone use but that don't stop 'em making new laws.
 

awol

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Back from racing - we won, by the way - and am not surprised the majority on this thread don't agree with me. However, it was only a couple of days ago that "lager swilling louts" were being castigated on this forum. If you must get drunk, why not do it at home? When on a boat, act responsibly and stay capable - as the vast majority of boat owners do - you know it makers sense!
And as for the smoking thing - anyone antisocial enough to subject others to the carcinogenic combustion products of smouldering vegetation needs a nanny to look after them.
 

Blue5

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So as I read it if the boat is 7metres long it is an offence, if it is 6.99 metres long it is not an offence. Having difficulty understanding the logic here but no doubt somebody will explain /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
 

Major Catastrophe

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[ QUOTE ]
so I don't know if the same could apply to having boat keys in your pocket when intending to sleep onboard , which would stuff most people

[/ QUOTE ]

I assume that it is the same as parking up your Winnebago for the night in a layby, having a few glasses of wine whilst enjoying the misses pasta before turning in for the night. Are you drunk in charge or going to bed in your temporary home?
 
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