Non-slip...is the best answer on the deck, or on the soles of your feet?

[Greenheart]

I read a thread elsewhere about people arguing the virtues and demerits of different proprietary non-slip types. The issue related to racing-dinghy decks.

It was pointed out that some of the best foam-types are unfortunately inclined to hold water, which can lead to effects akin to osmosis, bubbling up in GRP decks.

The considerable weight, both of the material and of the large amounts of contact adhesive required, was another downside; so was the high price.

I began to feel glad that Pinnell & Bax had been unable to source the quantity I had requested, in the colour I preferred. But no alternative solution appeared...

...until some clever fellow said he'd spent a fraction of the non-slip decking budget, on non-slip boots, which he said gave all the grip one could wish for.

I'd much rather keep some particularly grippy-soled footwear on board, rather than cover my gunwales with something rubbery and unsightly.

Are there any recommendations? I'm thinking dinghy-kit, not "Docksiders".

 

[Iain C]

Dan

If you are talking about trapezing, there is no substitute for pro-grip on a deck, it is by far the best. And you do not need massive quantities of it, just a strip that rolls over the gunwale about 4" wide. When you glue it it will expand so bear this in mind. Chamfer the edges or put tape down to stop it peeling. But do not cover the whole flipping deck for goodness sake.

As an absolute classic example of "it's for boats...mark it up loads" progrip is actually a product used in the orthopaedics industry called Lunasoft SL, available from a company called Algeos. There, I've just saved you a fortune.

You can also use a hi-build paint that has the properties of Artex, or stick on "sandpaper" style grip tape. However both of these are harsh and will destroy clothes in minutes (there is a rubbery one but IMHO it's not much good). I have the gritty tape on the gunwale edges of the 49er, however as you only ever stand up or trapeze, and never sit down, this is probably the only boat where it's OK to use it.

Boots are a compromise. I use Gill Aqua-tech shoes (below the ankle) on the 49er which give lots of grip and lots of feel for trapezing and getting in the foot loops, however the soles are very thin so if you tread on a stone ashore you really know about it. I have Gul "hiking" boots for other duties, which are much more robust and go above the ankle, and also are high enough to give you padding under the toestraps, however they lack feel for trapeze work.

 

[Daydream believer]

pro grip for where the crew put their feet when trapezing but if you have it where you sit ( helmsman) then one cannot slide in & out quickly
On my Phantom I tend to slide aftwards off the stern if caught by a wave so I have put several "dots" of progrip 4 inch diam along the topsides at 18 inch centres to help stop me sliding aft
They act like speed humps, If I feel myself sliding rearwards over them too fast I know an accident is about to happen

 

[Greenheart]

Thanks gents. Iain, it sounds like you've made a personal in-depth study of non-slip, so I'll happily be led by your words. Is the Progrip osmosis rumour not worth worrying about?

I found the Lunasoft product, which looks fine if it's as hard-wearing (and as unaffected by routine drenching) as Progrip...it's certainly available in less brash colours than Progrip, but I can't see a price or the quantities in which they sell it. There's a choice of thicknesses, I wonder which is best for trapeze-gunwale grip? Here's their page: http://www.nora-shoe.com/product-Lunasoft-73.Nora

I get the feeling a couple of the self-adhesive 185cm x 10cm Progrip strips from P&B will do the job, possibly with extra contact adhesive.

One matter I've wondered is whether less non-slip is required by a trapezing crew, than by a helmsman who must find his way carefully to and from the trapezing position while steering...hence large areas of the decks of Contenders are often covered...this 470 singlehander appears to have grey Progrip only on his gunwales, but we don't see him quickly stepping up and out to the position, and I reckon things could go badly after a skid during tacking:

 

[Iain C]

Hmmm, I'm sure I said "Lunasoft SL from Algeos" but no matter. ;-)

Here you go...http://www.algeos.com/nora_lunasoft_sl-colour_sheets_large_1.html Go for the 2mm stuff. It is progrip, it's identical stuff, almost certainly off the same production line. The self adhesive stuff is no good, trust me!

You really, really don't need lots of progrip. Ask any Laser 5000 driver who makes their way out to the wire over a metre of thin air. What progrip does is give you a chance of saving things if you end up going forwards or backwards at speed along the gunwale, for example burying the nose in a wave, or if the crew powers the kite up post gybe when you weren't ready for it. Progrip is essentially redundant in a stable trapezing position at normal angles.

The reason Contenders tend to cover large areas of the back tank in progrip is because when you are trapezing a long way back there is an awful lot of forward pull on the trap wire, and by that point you are wiring very high and not getting the friction through your feet. You also tend to screw a clam cleat wedge to the gunwale to give you something else to push against. I've had a Contender.

You don't need acres of progrip on an Osprey, you will push off the c/b case to get out, and being able to slide on the tops of the gunwales is a good thing.

You say you don't see your 470 driver getting on the wire quickly...erm, you never see him tack...

And don't worry about the osmosis thing.

 

[Greenheart]

Thanks again Iain, that's good enough for me, and a useful guide to lots of things I'd absentmindedly wondered about. :encouragement:

Red Progrip...should go with my new toe straps and the numbers on my best sail. And the red lazyjacks...though I may switch to more discreet white 2mm line.

Regarding your concern elsewhere about my lazyjacks being a hazard to a harness-wearer, I should say that the tail of the lazyjacks is long enough to allow the pyramid of lines on each side of the sail to be led horizontally along the boom and secured by a bungee ahead of the gooseneck, once the sail is up. The tails of the lazies run through cam cleats by the shroud bases, so nothing sags free; the tails go into the Hyde bags at the front of the cockpit. All set-up or let-go in a few seconds. I'm waiting to see them on another dinghy.

 

[Iain C]

Happy to be of help. Personally, I'd steer clear of the red and purple versions, as they do tend to get more affected by UV and lose their colour more than the greys, blues and blacks.