Newbie question about putting sails on this weekend at Northney

hennypenny

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Hi all, I am hoping to put the sails on my new to me Bavaria 31. The boat will be ashore at Northney Marina. I have some really basic questions about doing this as I have never bent sails onto a boat of this size. The weather looks ok to me not too windy and no rain.
Questions as follows:

1.) Can this be done on the pontoon in the marina safely? I worry about motoring off somewhere without another form of propulsion should the engine fail, especially as this will be the first time I will have been out on her.

2.) If I do have to leave the marina can anyone suggest somewhere nearby I can head for where I can relatively safely bend the sails on?

3.) Based on the forecast is this a good weekend to do it? In my inexperienced view I feel it is a good weekend to do it

It will be me and my wife, who is a decent dinghy sailor and will be able to help. We are young and inexperienced at big boats, so apologies for these really basic question.
 

johnalison

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The main is usually not a problem and you should have no trouble with this, though nobody would enjoy doing it with too much wind. A furling genoa is harder because it has to be hoisted fully and a cross wind will try to put it in the water. A strong headwind is fine but will cause a lot of flogging before you can furl the sail and so best avoided. If the wind is not too much for comfort but blowing from the side or astern, the easiest thing is to go out and anchor or pick up a mooring where there is little current.

Bending on the main can have its problems, depending on the fixings, whether it is fully-battened, and how the gate is designed, so I would wait for comfortable conditions if possible.
 

hennypenny

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Thanks johnalison thats helpful. I think I might try doing the main in the marina then and just have the sheet as loose as possible. I might then try and pick up a mooring ball outside Northney and try and do the genoa.
Just had a look at windy.com and its saying 4-7 knots gusting 10 which I think sounds doable
 

sarabande

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Wind speed and direction are the constraining factors.

So long as you point the sharp end into the wind in the marina berth you will be OK. And you should be OK up to F3.

Hoisting the sails will sound loud and possibly a bit embarrassing, but take it steadily.

It would be worth running a slider and a piece of old luff tape (if you can find some) or cloth up and down the mainsail and genoa tracks/grooves a couple of times to clear any dust before you hoist, and also to have a can of PTFE spray (Screwfix - it's the same as chandlers....) with a little squirty pipe, so that you can spray the luff tape on the genoa and main lufftapes as you hoist. But beware, your hands will feel very slippery, so cloth gloves.

Assuming you have furling, then lubing the top swivel would be desirable, and also the bearings in the bottom swivel housing. If the genoa jams when nearly hoisted, don't force it but check for a fair lead of the halyard at the top (it's my favourite mistake). And use a soft eye for the genoa sheets to the clew as shackles hurt. You will have to play with the tension of the genoa halyard before you roll it, and re-adjust a day or two later.
 

hennypenny

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Wind speed and direction are the constraining factors.

So long as you point the sharp end into the wind in the marina berth you will be OK. And you should be OK up to F3.

Hoisting the sails will sound loud and possibly a bit embarrassing, but take it steadily.

It would be worth running a slider and a piece of old luff tape (if you can find some) or cloth up and down the mainsail and genoa tracks/grooves a couple of times to clear any dust before you hoist, and also to have a can of PTFE spray (Screwfix - it's the same as chandlers....) with a little squirty pipe, so that you can spray the luff tape on the genoa and main lufftapes as you hoist. But beware, your hands will feel very slippery, so cloth gloves.

Assuming you have furling, then lubing the top swivel would be desirable, and also the bearings in the bottom swivel housing. If the genoa jams when nearly hoisted, don't force it but check for a fair lead of the halyard at the top (it's my favourite mistake). And use a soft eye for the genoa sheets to the clew as shackles hurt. You will have to play with the tension of the genoa halyard before you roll it, and re-adjust a day or two later.

Great stuff thank you very much, some good tips there, I will get some PTFE spray that could be useful
 

john_morris_uk

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As Tim (Sarabande) says, light winds are you friend and try and make it that your bow is into the breeze. Trying to bend on a mainsail when the winds up the chuff is a mugs game.

What sort of mainsail reefing is it? If it’s one of those Bavaria’s with single line slab reefing you might do well to get someone who knows the system to give you a hand to sort out the reefing pennants.

I don’t know many people who put shackles on the clew of their Genoa. Small bowlines are most common and what I’ve always used. Other systems/methods are available...
 

Cardinal

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Wind speed and direction are the constraining factors.

So long as you point the sharp end into the wind in the marina berth you will be OK. And you should be OK up to F3.

Hoisting the sails will sound loud and possibly a bit embarrassing, but take it steadily.

It would be worth running a slider and a piece of old luff tape (if you can find some) or cloth up and down the mainsail and genoa tracks/grooves a couple of times to clear any dust before you hoist, and also to have a can of PTFE spray (Screwfix - it's the same as chandlers....) with a little squirty pipe, so that you can spray the luff tape on the genoa and main lufftapes as you hoist. But beware, your hands will feel very slippery, so cloth gloves.

Assuming you have furling, then lubing the top swivel would be desirable, and also the bearings in the bottom swivel housing. If the genoa jams when nearly hoisted, don't force it but check for a fair lead of the halyard at the top (it's my favourite mistake). And use a soft eye for the genoa sheets to the clew as shackles hurt. You will have to play with the tension of the genoa halyard before you roll it, and re-adjust a day or two later.
All good advice. I suggest that lubing the roller swivels should be regarded as very important and that having a pair of binoculars to check that the halyards especially the genny halyard is not caught round any thing like a topping lift or another halyard would be wise.
 

Channel Sailor

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Assuming afloat, not chocked up ashore. Northney Marina is quite well sheltered so there is a reasonable probability of low wind speed opportunity to hank the sails on. If it is a first time for you on this yacht then I would suggest choose a day with very light wind or calm. Sunday for example is forecast for light winds. I would want to have virtually no wind so I could check the full hoist (with bino’s) batten tensions, slab reefing lines and turning block positions, furling drum operation, genoa sheet runs (inside/outside shrouds) for varying reef positions. A marina berth is perfect if any wind is from no more than say 10 degrees degrees of dead ahead. Turning the yacht around in the berth might help or another option is to ask if you can borrow another more suitable berth for a couple of hours to do it.

In the unlikely event there are no suitable opportunities in the marina then there are plenty of locations nearby: if wind is light NNE then the Harbour Conservancy deep water pontoon on the approaches to Emsworth would be good but take care as it is shallow on the west side. Outside Northney you might find at this time of year a vacant Harbour Conservancy mooring to borrow for a couple of hours but the wind and tides would be wrong for you on Sunday. You could anchor at East Head on a flood tide (if light SW wind) but better still for you on Sunday could be the Pilsey anchorage at slack or an ebb tide and light north wind (Sunday). If not anchoring then better still would be the Itchenor Reach non shore connected visitors pontoon which is often very sheltered and would be good as you could walk along the pontoon with bino’s to check the hoist heights. A spare swinging mooring at the entrance to the Bosham Reach might be very sheltered as well on Sunday. Last weekend there were loads of empty swingingmoorings in the harbour.
 
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LadyInBed

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I do mine on my own, things that help me are
Main
Roll the main from head down to lower reefing and tie roll through reefing crinkles before sliding sail onto boom.
If you can slide any of the bottom toggles onto the mast below the access slot, do it.
Feed the top toggles into the mast and push them up rather than pull them up by the main halyard.
If slab reefing, don't thread the reefing lines through the sail until you start hoisting because pound to a penny you will get them in a twist.
Foresail
Best done head to wind on a swinging mooring.
Shackle the Tack and the Head to the forestay.
Flake the sail along the foredeck on the windward side if there is one.
Attach the sheets to control the Toe before hoisting, then it won't drop in the water.
 

Spirit (of Glenans)

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Regarding the reefing lines; assuming they run from the mast aft though the boom and emerge at the end of it, ensure that they have stopper knots at the end and pull them both right forward and find out which is the shortest. This will be the first reef, the longer one being the second. Whichever side the first line is on, bring the end up on that side, pass it through the cringle and down the other side of the sail. Tie it off, with a bowline, to the aft ring under the boom. Take the second line up the opposite side, to the second cringle and down to the next ring. Check that they are not crossed over in any way and that the knots are secure.
 

gregcope

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Usually bend sails on in marina. Do it light winds.

Advice here on PFTE is good.

Depending on tide you might not feel the 7-10 knots as northney is quite sheltered, esp when tide is out.

In those winds i would stay on the berth, ignore the wind direction and go for it.
 

Seajet

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henneypenny,

' bending on ' the sails is not a big deal, for a start I suggest you do wait and do it when the boat is afloat; ashore even if well stowed they are just extra windage if a big gale crops up again.

For teflon / PTFE spray or anything else you need, Ocean Marine ( formerley Seateach ) now at Thornham Marina / boatyard are the closest, otherwise it's Force 4 at Donnington on the Witterings road.

If you motor out of Northney keep straight in the channel to the large red marker; to port there's a shallow shingle bank, by no means dangerous, just a pain in the transom to go aground on.

There are usually spare deep water moorings in Sweare Deep straight outside the marina, try to select one with no tender attached as that means the owner is unlikely to return when you're busy with the sails, a job of a few minutes when you've done it once.
 
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johnalison

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As LadyinBed says, it isn't necessary or desirable to hoist the main when bending on. My own main, like many now, is loose-footed, so my first action is only to attach tack and clew. I don't know how your gate is arranged, but often the lowest couple of sliders will go into the gate and drop below the gate first. After this you need to start from the top slider (obviously!) and have a tame assistant hold this up out of the way while you feed in the remaining ones. My current gate has a detachable section, but some have spring-loaded sections, but the general procedure is the same.

Although you will see boats hoisting mainsails in marinas, it is something I prefer to avoid myself. Much better to do it quietly out in the blue yonder where nobody can watch. Another job to be done is fitting battens. It is best to tie or fix them in without much tension and tighten them up after see the sail hoisted, about enough to taken the creases out.
 

Spirit (of Glenans)

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As Ladyinbed says, roll the sail from the head down, etc, etc, insert the toggles/slides into the mast slot, pushing the sail up, rather than raising with the halyard, especially if there is an adverse wind.
When it starts to get too heavy, push a section of it up as far as you can and tightly tie two or three turns of a sail tie around the mast, to keep it up there, then push up the another section and tie it off the same way. By this means you can get the sail on without catching the wind. You can then flake the sail by, starting at the bottom, pulling out the sections of luff between each slide alternately to left and right, tidying towards the leech as you go, progressively tying on sail ties at the leech end first and working forward as the sail tapers.
If you need to move the boat to deal with the genoa, rather than wandering about looking for a mooring buoy, why not just go alongside a windward hammerhead pontoon, tie the bow and stern with slip lines, then ease the stern line so that the stern gets blown off the pontoon and the boat ends up head to wind, tied by the bow. When finished you can simply slip the lines and return to your berth. (Be careful not to get your slip lines snarled!)I don't know the geography of your particular marina, but If I need to do something requiring being head to wind, that's what I do here in Malahide, where the wind is generally blowing off the hammerheads.
 

FairweatherDave

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I've just been checking my boat today and there are plenty of moorings spare immediately outside Northney entrance in Sweare Deep. If it was me I would use one for the job and then go for a sail. It can take a suprisingly long time with all the reefing lines, and I usually don't get it right first time. So allow a couple of hours minimum and enjoy Sunday's weather. Both days look fine at the moment but the Saturday one could feel a bit breezy (just a touch) for sail hoisting out on a mooring. But easier head to wind. I haven't read the detailled posts but previously I have extended the halyard with a line so that I can run it round a genoa winch and stand up by the mast or furler. Even when there are two of you that might be useful.
 

ashtead

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Hennypenny you don't say which year of Bav or whether the main is in mast or the preferable reefing point model. Assuming it is with reefing points , at least 2 And maybe a third if specified or added by owner. As a former Bav 34 owner the greatest issue tends to be the full length Batten's which I imagine you have. I would check these are all there and none are split etc plus that you have the required locking nuts to hold in plus the required key to tighten up the nut on trailing edge of sail . Your sail might not have this system but tensioning the battens into the pockets sometimes is frustrating.
Once you have checked batten and nuts etc next check if sail needs cleaning or repairs of course. You don't say if you have lazy jacks and bag but if you do you might wash and reproof these before rigging main. If it's standard system checking reefing lines are rigged and running back to jammers on deck and jammers are labelled. Generally reefing lines are blue and red stripped I have found. Then it's just a case of checking the plastic sliders are on sail and each sliding car is present. You might buy a few extra sliders as these can spring off overboard . Then just feed in sliders to gate .
With the roller you might clean line before hoisting but if you un roll line it helps to mark with tape correct positions.Do all that greasing stuff with the Furlex checking visually all screws are present and tight.
This is tricky point but be are ready to furl once hoisted so crew at winch to hoist needs to be ready to furl with gloves on etc if by hand or round winch etc. rig sheets before furling hoisting of course and hold on to clew as wiound on to furler to ensure tension Hopefully you have on board pack of info on furlex and batten system though so apologies if you have already researched all this. We always hoist sails on pontoon at Haslar which is probably less tucked away than northney. You might find a few other Bav owners down there who will give advice. Good luck. We have just had our headsails cleaned for first time which is quite pricey IMHO so facing same task of refuelling etc and praying with you for a winless weekend.
 
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