New to this forum - your views on wooden boats.

[pawl]

Hi everyone, having had sailing boats for the last 30 years I'm now looking to buy a motor boat. Roughly about 30 feet and secondhand. What I'm wondering is whether or not a wooden motor boat is practical these days. I don't like leaks and don't want a "money pit", what are the views on this forum please. Before you ask I don't have any previous experience of wooden boats.

 

[Tranona]

Generally avoid. You don't say what sort of boat you are looking for, but in reality there are very few built of wood and most will be over 50 years old. Do you have any examples you have looked at?

 

[pawl]

Generally avoid. You don't say what sort of boat you are looking for, but in reality there are very few built of wood and most will be over 50 years old. Do you have any examples you have looked at?

hi, the only one I have actually looked at is a one off traditional wheelhouse double ender, about 28ft. However, this was built in 2014 and seemed to be leaking like a siave.

 

[Freebee]

if you enjoy wood work, painting ,varnishing and boat maintenance... then a wooden boat maybe for you.....if you just want to go boating then get a grp boat.

 

[pawl]

if you enjoy wood work, painting ,varnishing and boat maintenance... then a wooden boat maybe for you.....if you just want to go boating then get a grp boat.

Hi, thanks for your response, actually, I don't mind varnishing & painting or boat maintenance, I've done plenty of that on my previous boat. What I was hoping for is to hear from those who have had wooden boats and what their experience of those was, good and bad,

 

[harvey38]

There is an extremely good YouTube series I followed called Travels with Geordie, Peters series is all about the owning and upkeep of a couple of timber boats. No bikinis, no stupid self promoting, just a down to earth bloke in Canada maintaining and cruising his passion. Well worth watching but you say you don't have any experience with wooden boats and you don't want a money pit, probably best you avoid a wooden boat.

Peters series will probably confirm your fears but certainly give you aspiration, it did for me

https://m.youtube.com/c/TravelsWithGeordie

 

[Tranona]

Hi, thanks for your response, actually, I don't mind varnishing & painting or boat maintenance, I've done plenty of that on my previous boat. What I was hoping for is to hear from those who have had wooden boats and what their experience of those was, good and bad,

There are many different types of wooden construction and the only generalisation is that they need more painting and varnishing than GRP boats. I owned a 1963 wooden boat from 1980 to 2019 and other than routine painting and some minor localised repairs it was easy to keep up and never leaked. However it was sheathed plywood and I kept on top of it. The 2014 boat you mentioned was probably traditional plank on frame and that sort of construction relies on fastenings to hold pieces of timber that expand and contract so invariably leak if poorly built or not maintained properly. most problems with wooden boats are caused by fresh water ingress through the decks and coachroof and inevitably these have many joints and are exposed to the elements so if not adequately protected will let water in and start rot. Damp boats also exact a toll on interiors, machinery and electrics and neglect starts a rapid downward spiral of decay.

On the plus side a sound, well maintained wooden boat is a pleasure to own provided you accept the extra work required to keep it that way. I think you have to keep an open mind when looking to purchase and assess each boat as it is and don't get too carried away with the ambience when sitting in the saloon looking at the gleaming varnished deck beams and table!

 

[Freebee]

my first boat was a plywood motor cruiser, at the point I owned it was 30 years old,,,,it was seaworthy but everytime i was in a big sea I was quite fearful of the 30 year old glue and fastenings giving way...as soon as I could afford I moved to grp..

 

[vas]

mine is reaching 50yo and it's plywood 43ft f/b mobo. Had it's share of F6s in the Aegean, still fine (knock wood )

 

[Dino]

I used to work with a guy who was big into the traditional sail scene. One day I told him that my Dad had a 38ft Larch on Oak motorboat on the inland lakes when I was young. He put his head in his hands in horror… he couldn’t believe we had a wooden boat on freshwater. I never knew this was such an issue but he said that you need to be on salt water in a wooden boat. He said his friends throw buckets of salt water on the decks regularly especially when it’s rained.

 

[pawl]

There are many different types of wooden construction and the only generalisation is that they need more painting and varnishing than GRP boats. I owned a 1963 wooden boat from 1980 to 2019 and other than routine painting and some minor localised repairs it was easy to keep up and never leaked. However it was sheathed plywood and I kept on top of it. The 2014 boat you mentioned was probably traditional plank on frame and that sort of construction relies on fastenings to hold pieces of timber that expand and contract so invariably leak if poorly built or not maintained properly. most problems with wooden boats are caused by fresh water ingress through the decks and coachroof and inevitably these have many joints and are exposed to the elements so if not adequately protected will let water in and start rot. Damp boats also exact a toll on interiors, machinery and electrics and neglect starts a rapid downward spiral of decay.

On the plus side a sound, well maintained wooden boat is a pleasure to own provided you accept the extra work required to keep it that way. I think you have to keep an open mind when looking to purchase and assess each boat as it is and don't get too carried away with the ambience when sitting in the saloon looking at the gleaming varnished deck beams and table!

hi, thanks that's useful, in fact the recently built boat that I looked at was leaking around the deck/coachroof junction and obviously had been for a while. The deck consisted of timber planking (not teak) epoxy bonded to 18mm marine ply. I could not see any obvious source of the leaks from the outside which might mean that it was coming in elsewhere and running under the decking?

 

[pawl]

I used to work with a guy who was big into the traditional sail scene. One day I told him that my Dad had a 38ft Larch on Oak motorboat on the inland lakes when I was young. He put his head in his hands in horror… he couldn’t believe we had a wooden boat on freshwater. I never knew this was such an issue but he said that you need to be on salt water in a wooden boat. He said his friends throw buckets of salt water on the decks regularly especially when it’s rained.

Well, I agree with you I wouldn't have thought about that either, especially considering the number of wooden boats you find on the Thames. I was aware that softwood such as pine will rot in freshwater but is ok in saltwater but I wouldn't have thought that it was a problem with hardwoods so much.

 

[pawl]

my first boat was a plywood motor cruiser, at the point I owned it was 30 years old,,,,it was seaworthy but everytime i was in a big sea I was quite fearful of the 30 year old glue and fastenings giving way...as soon as I could afford I moved to grp..

That's a good point.

 

[pawl]

There is an extremely good YouTube series I followed called Travels with Geordie, Peters series is all about the owning and upkeep of a couple of timber boats. No bikinis, no stupid self promoting, just a down to earth bloke in Canada maintaining and cruising his passion. Well worth watching but you say you don't have any experience with wooden boats and you don't want a money pit, probably best you avoid a wooden boat.

Peters series will probably confirm your fears but certainly give you aspiration, it did for me

https://m.youtube.com/c/TravelsWithGeordie

Thanks, I'll have a look at that.

 

[Daydream believer]

My first boat was brand new so never had leak problems. However, in 1968 I used to pay Tucker Browns to do just about every bit of maintenance. Yards were different in those days & much better geared up for such work. But to have the hull painted in the 70s would cost me £300-400 every year. So just apply inflation to that & you know that it was not cheap. I expect it would be the same today - If you can find a yard so inclined. So you will have to do it yourself.

I purchased another Stella in 1998 as a virtual wreck & stripped it to a bare hull. I could do that because I could put it in my joinery works. As an example of how different it was for me- I was able to repair 12 ribs on one Saturday using Oak that was a convenient size & left over from a job in the House of Lords. That would take most DIYers 12 weekends

I had the hull sandblasted in & out & I resin coated internally & epoxy sheathed externally. Most DIYers would not have the facility to get the moisture content down to 11% needed. with the air flow etc.

But once completed the boat did not leak one jot. Plus the hull became a rigid shape that it had never been before.
Once finished- 3.5 years of work ( But I was building my house at the same time) I had to antifoul 2 times a year. I could do that on the club scrubbing posts on a tide & living 200 yds away it was easy.
Then to paint the hull each year I had it placed on a road trailer & put by my house. I found hull painting easy. But unlike DIYers I acted like a professional ( Well I was a building contractor) & got on with the job. So 2 weekends for me. I have friends at the yacht club who drag such tasks out for weeks.
Any small repair takes DIY people ages. First to think about it. Then to work out what to do. Then to find the wrong bits. Then to motivate. Then to chat about it. Then to cock something up. Then to stop due to wrong tools etc. Then to get more bits. Then to ask a mate. Then to give up for a while & so on
Wooden boats are an attitude of mind. If you do not have the right mind set for DIY do not bother.

 

[Sumara of Weymouth]

Hi, I've owned my varnished wooden yacht for 33 years. It is carvel built from one log of iroko on oak frames and an elm keel. There are no signs of rot or soft timber and the boat looks as good as the day I bought it. I have replaced the engine and the teak decking (due to wear) but both those issues could happen on a GRP boat. My dinghy is clinker built mahogany on oak and my previous yacht was clinker larch on oak. I simply wouldn't consider owning a plastic yacht, wooden boats are my thing! However, I do spend three weeks every year working full-time maintaining the boat, normally in a shed. If you are not willing, or able, to consistently do the maintenance then the dreaded rot could set in. You say you don't mind painting and varnishing and you have some experience, so I certainly wouldn't rule out the joys of owning a wooden boat. The welcome you get entering harbours, the warm atmosphere below decks and the total absence of condensation and just a few of the benefits. If you spot a boat with nice lines which suits your needs it would be worth hiring a specialist wooden boat surveyor to give it a really thorough going over. To my mind, it is relatively easy to keep rot at bay but once it gets hold it seems devilish hard to get rid of it. Best to find a pristine vessel and keep it that way.

 

[pawl]

My first boat was brand new so never had leak problems. However, in 1968 I used to pay Tucker Browns to do just about every bit of maintenance. Yards were different in those days & much better geared up for such work. But to have the hull painted in the 70s would cost me £300-400 every year. So just apply inflation to that & you know that it was not cheap. I expect it would be the same today - If you can find a yard so inclined. So you will have to do it yourself.

I purchased another Stella in 1998 as a virtual wreck & stripped it to a bare hull. I could do that because I could put it in my joinery works. As an example of how different it was for me- I was able to repair 12 ribs on one Saturday using Oak that was a convenient size & left over from a job in the House of Lords. That would take most DIYers 12 weekends

I had the hull sandblasted in & out & I resin coated internally & epoxy sheathed externally. Most DIYers would not have the facility to get the moisture content down to 11% needed. with the air flow etc.

But once completed the boat did not leak one jot. Plus the hull became a rigid shape that it had never been before.
Once finished- 3.5 years of work ( But I was building my house at the same time) I had to antifoul 2 times a year. I could do that on the club scrubbing posts on a tide & living 200 yds away it was easy.
Then to paint the hull each year I had it placed on a road trailer & put by my house. I found hull painting easy. But unlike DIYers I acted like a professional ( Well I was a building contractor) & got on with the job. So 2 weekends for me. I have friends at the yacht club who drag such tasks out for weeks.
Any small repair takes DIY people ages. First to think about it. Then to work out what to do. Then to find the wrong bits. Then to motivate. Then to chat about it. Then to cock something up. Then to stop due to wrong tools etc. Then to get more bits. Then to ask a mate. Then to give up for a while & so on
Wooden boats are an attitude of mind. If you do not have the right mind set for DIY do not bother.

hi, interesting, thanks. I have spent nearly all of my working life in engineering and associated industries so I know what work looks like at least. Even if I say so myself I'm reasonably good at woodwork and joinery, however, I'm getting on a bit, so not looking for a "project". if I go for wooden it will have to be a boat that is already up to scratch, just want to get some idea of what's involved in keeping that way if at all possible.

 

[pawl]

Hi, I've owned my varnished wooden yacht for 33 years. It is carvel built from one log of iroko on oak frames and an elm keel. There are no signs of rot or soft timber and the boat looks as good as the day I bought it. I have replaced the engine and the teak decking (due to wear) but both those issues could happen on a GRP boat. My dinghy is clinker built mahogany on oak and my previous yacht was clinker larch on oak. I simply wouldn't consider owning a plastic yacht, wooden boats are my thing! However, I do spend three weeks every year working full-time maintaining the boat, normally in a shed. If you are not willing, or able, to consistently do the maintenance then the dreaded rot could set in. You say you don't mind painting and varnishing and you have some experience, so I certainly wouldn't rule out the joys of owning a wooden boat. The welcome you get entering harbours, the warm atmosphere below decks and the total absence of condensation and just a few of the benefits. If you spot a boat with nice lines which suits your needs it would be worth hiring a specialist wooden boat surveyor to give it a really thorough going over. To my mind, it is relatively easy to keep rot at bay but once it gets hold it seems devilish hard to get rid of it. Best to find a pristine vessel and keep it that way.

hi, thanks for that, all very sensible, I agree.

 

[Fire99]

This is a very interesting thread as Wood really is quite a contentious issue. I've only owned one boat that was partly wood. A Freeman 30 which had a GRP hull but Wooden superstructure and topsides. The wooden deck looked amazing BUT.. I found a patch of dry rot that ended up me pretty much taking the entire topsides and entire cabin apart. In the end I sold her on as a project because I had to face the reality I'm really not that interested in large scale woodwork. I maintain the teak deck on my current boat which is enough for me and I do the odd little project involving wood but I just don't think I have a wood craftsman's heart and (excuse the pun) I can lose heart with wood quite quickly. In contrast, a great guy next door to the old sailing club I was a member of, made a new wooden rudder stock and tiller for my old sailing boat, out of reclaimed hardwood windowframes and it was a work of art. No GRP nor metal could ever come close to what he made. But, he was a craftsman. That's the difference. Some say you have to be either Rich or Retired to have a wooden boat, but I'd add one more. A passion for wood. If in your heart of hearts you're more concerened with minimising maintenance rather than sheer beauty, I'd stick with GRP. (But nothing is as beautiful as a wooden boat!)

PS - Just to add, the young couple I sold the Freeman to did an amazing job bringing her back to her former glory and sent me some pics - Paul, if you're reading, You did a smashing job with her!

 

[pawl]

This is a very interesting thread as Wood really is quite a contentious issue. I've only owned one boat that was partly wood. A Freeman 30 which had a GRP hull but Wooden superstructure and topsides. The wooden deck looked amazing BUT.. I found a patch of dry rot that ended up me pretty much taking the entire topsides and entire cabin apart. In the end I sold her on as a project because I had to face the reality I'm really not that interested in large scale woodwork. I maintain the teak deck on my current boat which is enough for me and I do the odd little project involving wood but I just don't think I have a wood craftsman's heart and (excuse the pun) I can lose heart with wood quite quickly. In contrast, a great guy next door to the old sailing club I was a member of, made a new wooden rudder stock and tiller for my old sailing boat, out of reclaimed hardwood windowframes and it was a work of art. No GRP nor metal could ever come close to what he made. But, he was a craftsman. That's the difference. Some say you have to be either Rich or Retired to have a wooden boat, but I'd add one more. A passion for wood. If in your heart of hearts you're more concerened with minimising maintenance rather than sheer beauty, I'd stick with GRP. (But nothing is as beautiful as a wooden boat!)

PS - Just to add, the young couple I sold the Freeman to did an amazing job bringing her back to her former glory and sent me some pics - Paul, if you're reading, You did a smashing job with her!

hi, well I'm retired at any rate, my previous boat, a Vancouver 28, had beautiful high quality teak interior joinery with a cosy saloon where you could have a glass and a yarn of an evening. I would like to have something similar in a motor boat but haven't, so far, seen anything remotely similar. I'm on a bit of a restricted budget, so that doesn't help.