"Minister defends plan to reduce life raft requirements"

[Baddox]

Baroness Kramer may believe that the air-sea rescue service that the government cut recently would be close in the event of an accident but I’d still prefer to be waiting in a life raft than a rubber ring.

"The government has insisted its plans to allow pleasure boats to carry fewer life rafts will not compromise safety.

It is proposed that craft operating in waters no further than five miles off the coast will, in summer, be allowed to provide more lifebelts instead."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-25747413

 

[oldgit]

FFS.

 

[prv]

The story isn't all that clear, but from the quotes at the end it sounds like the idea is for small tripper boats to be allowed to carry a single liferaft sufficient for all on board. At the moment they have to carry a minimum of two rafts even if they only carry a handful of passengers.

Pete

 

[rhumlady]

With 2 at least 1 should work but when you are down to 1 and it doesn't work your up sh*t creek paddle or no.

 

[onesea]

With 2 at least 1 should work but when you are down to 1 and it doesn't work your up sh*t creek paddle or no.

Why not make them carry 3 or 4 liferaft's and lifeboat as well just in case?

TBH I do not see an issue, on here there is a big enough debate as to if LR's are worth having at all. Yet we sail further than 5' Nm from a safe haven.

Ok if the boat is operating in a really remote location with minimal infrastructure that might be considered different but for 95% of day trip boats whats the problem?

 

[Twister_Ken]

Heard some of the debate on 'Today in Parliament'.

Baroness Wotsit did at least sound as if she knew what she was talking about, whereas those posing questions seemed to have no more idea about marine safety than Jeremy Clarkson.

 

[alant]

The story isn't all that clear, but from the quotes at the end it sounds like the idea is for small tripper boats to be allowed to carry a single liferaft sufficient for all on board. At the moment they have to carry a minimum of two rafts even if they only carry a handful of passengers.

Pete

Its the number they are licensed to carry, not the "handful".

 

[alant]

Why not make them carry 3 or 4 liferaft's and lifeboat as well just in case?

TBH I do not see an issue, on here there is a big enough debate as to if LR's are worth having at all. Yet we sail further than 5' Nm from a safe haven.

Ok if the boat is operating in a really remote location with minimal infrastructure that might be considered different but for 95% of day trip boats whats the problem?

They carry a whole variety of passengers, from those aged 1 yr old (below that age doesn't count), up to grannies in wheelchairs, on routes eg Poole Quay to Swanage Pier. Even on a pleasant summer day, how many of those could you guarantee surviving abandoning ship around there?

The only vessels, which 'might' consider a reduction in liferafts, are RIB charters, where everyone is already wearing a LJ.

 

[onesea]

They carry a whole variety of passengers, from those aged 1 yr old (below that age doesn't count), up to grannies in wheelchairs, on routes eg Poole Quay to Swanage Pier. Even on a pleasant summer day, how many of those could you guarantee surviving abandoning ship around there?

The only vessels, which 'might' consider a reduction in liferafts, are RIB charters, where everyone is already wearing a LJ.

None what so ever no guarantee with 1 or 6 LR' or any other equipment depends on to many factors, my point is 1 LR ver's 2 really going to make a difference?

As for charter rib's the only advantage they have is they normally operate in packs not solo.

If you want to do a risk assessment on this maybe a full Lifeboat would be best solution? At least davit launched Life rafts would be an improvement.

You can always do more the question is what is reasonable.

 

[Spirit of Glenans]

Perhaps this thread would be more at home in The Lounge Forum ?

 

[alant]

None what so ever no guarantee with 1 or 6 LR' or any other equipment depends on to many factors, my point is 1 LR ver's 2 really going to make a difference?

As for charter rib's the only advantage they have is they normally operate in packs not solo.

If you want to do a risk assessment on this maybe a full Lifeboat would be best solution? At least davit launched Life rafts would be an improvement.

You can always do more the question is what is reasonable.

I believe a "risk assessment" was carried out by the Board of Trade, following the Titanic sinking, which determined the appropriate number of lifeboats/rafts, from which current regs have developed. So, there is a reason for the 1+ requirement. Regarding RIB's, they do not "normally operate in packs", an example being the various Safari RIB's, including the one operating from Poole Quay, which runs out to Dancing Rock.

 

[prv]

Its the number they are licensed to carry, not the "handful".

I assume small boats are only licensed to carry a small number of passengers.

If you're licensed to carry, say, twenty passengers for trips round the bay, having a single 25-man liferaft seems reasonable to me.

Pete

 

[rob2]

I am more concerned by the assertion that the rescue services (recently cut-back) are close by. If you are in summer clothes and find yourself in the sea in a lifering waiting for an airlift you may well not agree!

Rob.

 

[onesea]

I believe a "risk assessment" was carried out by the Board of Trade, following the Titanic sinking, which determined the appropriate number of lifeboats/rafts, from which current regs have developed. So, there is a reason for the 1+ requirement. Regarding RIB's, they do not "normally operate in packs", an example being the various Safari RIB's, including the one operating from Poole Quay, which runs out to Dancing Rock.

Hmmm Maybe just maybe there is space to review/ update the safety requirements if the risk assessment is based on an incident over 100 years ago. Particularly when you consider that one happened in open waters when many of the LSA available today had simply not been invented yet. In the case being considered the vessels concerned are over 240m shorter, in fact one is wider than the other is long (not by as much as you would think). They are also operating where help should be a matter of minutes or hours away not days or possibly weeks away.. There is always the factor of passenger numbers where the numbers involved are different not by a factor of 10 but factor of 100.

For me 1 L/Raft is enough on the boats described.

 

[alant]

I assume small boats are only licensed to carry a small number of passengers.If you're licensed to carry, say, twenty passengers for trips round the bay, having a single 25-man liferaft seems reasonable to me.

Pete

Several 100 passengers, on boats operating out of Poole & Ocean Village/Cowes, under the 5 x 15 rules.
I used to drive some of them & my Boatmaster Ticket, allowed vessels up to 250 passengers, IIRC.

PS there were incidents a few years ago, when one of those went aground at Old harry Rocks, requiring rescue by another boat + RNLI. They were very lucky.

http://www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/ne...hose_vessel_ran_aground_near_Old_Harry_Rocks/