Merits of a 12v or 24v "battery set" generator? Opinion please

milltech

milltech

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Merits of a 12v or 24v \"battery set\" generator? Opinion please

I have raised this issue before somewhere in someone else's thread but I'd like to explore some opinions. I know that a small suitcase generator may give you 5 to 8 amps charge and also run power tools, but for boats with an inverter or without the need for mains power, carrying a 50 amp 12v battery charging generator would seem to be a useful thing to do.

In days of yore when 95% of all boats lived on swinging moorings and cruising between marinas was not possible, having a "battery set" aboard was pretty common, older installations might have been Stuart Turner, later one could buy a portable battery set, but none seem available now.

Running your engine to charge the batteries seems generally to be regarded as a "bad thing", and of course does not solve a flat battery problem. If staying in one locality for some days, or away from mains marina sources when cruising, would it not make sense to carry such a brute aboard?

As it happens nobody in Europe seems to maike one anymore that weighs less than 40 kilos, but if there was an option at say 12 kilos, kicking out 50 amps and costing £699 inc vat, does anyone think there would be a market?

Would I be the only buyer?
 
Re: Merits of a 12v or 24v \"battery set\" generator? Opinion please

If you have a battery charger on board of 50 amp or below why not buy a generator from macro they were selling them at £49+vat they thro out 600watts so would supply what you need,they are very quiet and light.they are 2stroke so need petroil to run.I was a bit put off by this but have had no probs starting and use same petroil mix as most outboards.ie 50/1
 
Re: Merits of a 12v or 24v \"battery set\" generator? Opinion please

[ QUOTE ]
but if there was an option at say 12 kilos, kicking out 50 amps and costing £699 inc vat, does anyone think there would be a market?
Would I be the only buyer?

[/ QUOTE ]More than likely (IMHO) you would be the only buyer, or at least one of very few, as for that sort of money one can buy a damn good portable gen set with "clean" electrical output, silenced and enclosed such as one of the Honda range of portables, or one could go for something more down market but probably adequate such as the 2kw jobbie from Aldi for 149 beer tokens. I personally would be hesitant to power my charger/invertor from a cheapo gennie - too many spikes from the gennie and too many electronic components in the charger / invertor liable to be damaged by excessive voltage spikes.

Having said that I am sure you could find someone with too much money (and not enough experience) who would jump at the chance of having this years "must have" new accessory.
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“Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity”
Skype id:cliffillupo
 
Re: Merits of a 12v or 24v \"battery set\" generator? Opinion please

Hi Nedmin,

Perhaps you, or someone else, could throw some light on this problem for me. We carried a Yamaha 1000w (sustained about 650watt) portable 'Honda' type generator on our last pond circuit. We have a sophisticated 30 amp multi-stage mains charger.

Plugging the mains charger into the genset, only gave us about 10amps charging according to the digital battery monitor we have. Ok, the batteries weren't flat, but they had run the 'fridge overnoght when we tried it all out. When we turned the engine on (Adverc controlled charging) it bashed in about 30 amps, albeit for a very short time.

Should I have been able to get the full output from the above set-up?

Sorry, milltech, don't mean to hhi-jack your thread. Re that, I'm afraid I agree with Cliff, very doubtful people would pay a lot more for something they can already get a fair bit cheaper.

Cheers jerry
 
Re: Merits of a 12v or 24v \"battery set\" generator? Opinion please

[ QUOTE ]
Sorry, milltech, don't mean to hhi-jack your thread. Re that, I'm afraid I agree with Cliff, very doubtful people would pay a lot more for something they can already get a fair bit cheaper.

Cheers jerry

[/ QUOTE ]

No go right ahead, it fuels the knowledge base. Personally I didn't know about 50 amp chargers, mostly I thought they were much lower, and if your 30 amps didn't actually deliver when connected to a not-so-small mains generator then my suggestion starts to look more reliably attractive.
 
Re: Merits of a 12v or 24v \"battery set\" generator? Opinion please

[ QUOTE ]
I personally would be hesitant to power my charger/invertor from a cheapo gennie - too many spikes from the gennie and too many electronic components in the charger / invertor liable to be damaged by excessive voltage spikes.

Having said that I am sure you could find someone with too much money (and not enough experience) who would jump at the chance of having this years "must have" new accessory.


[/ QUOTE ]

I hadn't really thought about powering an inverter that way, more just boosting the batteries to a full charge in the shortest possible time so that they could do the job!
 
Re: Merits of a 12v or 24v \"battery set\" generator? Opinion please

I'd think it a good idea. A problem we have is that the genset is a 4cyl 2.2litre diesel, so feels a bit daft running it when we need just a few amps, eg to charge batteries. Your tiny genset would effectively be a cheap second baby generator or night generator. Bit I'd prefer it to be diesel, plumbed in properly, u/w exhaust, not rattling around the fordeck. That would add to the installed price

What would the the spec and installation details of your gadget? Diesel or petrol?
 
Re: Merits of a 12v or 24v \"battery set\" generator? Opinion please

Before I used the makro jenny I did various load test and compared voltages the regulation was good.Its only a 2 pole alternator with engine running at 3000rpm giving 50c/s so where are the spikes, should be a far better sine wave than any inverter.Some of the so called sine inverters leave a lot to be desired.I bought a mastervolt one and had a rolling line on the tv.finished up buying an isolating transformer and putting the output thro. this to improve the sign wave.
 
Re: Merits of a 12v or 24v \"battery set\" generator? Opinion please

I think what you are proposing is a 12v generator with built-in smart charger??

I for one would rather see a separate charger that would run off the mains when available and off a generator otherwise.

I did the maths for running a 30A Sterling charger off a 240v suitcase generator: it worked out that you need 700W power to deliver the 30A, not 360w as most people would think! A unit that delivered 50A of charge would have to be 1200w and would be a fair bit bigger than a suitcase type.

I imagine for the weight you're talking about the power unit would be a petrol 4-stroke. Most people wouldn't want that installed below decks so stowage becomes a problem.

At the price you're suggesting you'd be competitive against a top-quality generator and charger but seriously undercut by the cheapo 2-stroke units (<£70)
 
Picture and spec here

batchargesml.jpg


Features include:
Environmentally friendly Honda50cc., 1.8 kw. 4 stroke engine.
Bosch 55 amp alternator, regulated or supercharge, by the flick of a switch.
Short circuit and over voltage protected.
Safe from electrocution (12 volt DC only)
Super bright LED amp display for charging indication.
Lightweight - whole unit weighs only 11 kgs.
High current leads, with gold banana style plugs supplied.

Ideal uses:
Farmers -can supply enough charge for a flat battery in approx. 5 minutes to start their car or tractor.
Camping.- the unit can charge flat batteries at 55 amps. max. (run a car fridge and lights or any other 12 volt appliances.)
Boating/yachting - can be used as a reliable emergency lighting power or battery charge.
Boost charger back-up for 1.2 volt solar power site.
Emergency services - 12 volt lighting.
Mobile mechanics.

WEIGHT: 12 kg.
DIMENSIONS: (LxWxH): Approx. 410 x 275 x 370 mm.
ENGINE TYPE: Honda GXH50 air-cooled OHV 4 stroke
DISPLACEMENT: 49.4 cm
MAX. ENGINE POWER: 1.8 kw (2.5 ps)/7000 rpm.
FUEL TANK CAPACITY: 1.2 litres
OIL CAPACITY: .25 litres
FUEL TYPE: Unleaded petrol
STARTING SYSTEM: Recoil
ELECTRIC OUTPUT: 12 volt dc
MAX VOLTAGE (low): 14.2 volts DC (regulated)
MAX VOLTAGE (high): 15.2 volts DC (regulated)
MAX AMPS (Continuous): .55 amps
MAX. VOLTAGE (Cut-out): 18 volts
AMPMETER DISPLAY: Digital (1 decimal point) LED
LEADS: 3 metres long twin & alligator clamps
ALTERNATOR: Bosch 12 volt 55 amp self exciting 3600 rpm.
 
Re: Picture and spec here

What a good bit of kit.I wonder how quiet it is?I have a kawasaki 1800kw gen.but you need a reinforced jock strap to carry it, thats why i bought the macro jenny because its light.how much are they?Tried to find out on their site but it wouldnt come up.
 
Re: Picture and spec here

No sales job except that I thought if there were a few people we might share a shipment, nothing to do with Allgadgets, I don't see myself as an engine vendor. All that oil, pdi and warranty stuff, no Sir! It's all I can do to start them.

The problem is it's a colonial product and to get one here by UPS with duty and vat worked out at £750. Many buys make better deal that's all.
 
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