Med - teak Vs fake teak ??

[Portofino]

Prompts by a recent thread by PeteM about managing the colour difference of old n new teak ,I went for a 10 mins walk in the marina ( La Napoule SoF ) I pad in hand ,
Pic paints a 1000 words
In no particular order.
I,am warming ( excuse the pun ) to synthetic as natural seems like the wrong stuff to use !

https://imgur.com/gallery/cnP0M

 

[julians]

Theres some really bad fake teaks about though.

The last two fake teaks photos in your set of photos look fine,but the fake teak before that look pretty terrible imo.

I guess its a bit like fake grass...

I think when my teak deck is gone beyond repair, ill be getting some sort of fake teak,not sure which one though

 

[tcm]

Prompts by a recent thread by PeteM about managing the colour difference of old n new teak ,I went for a 10 mins walk in the marina ( La Napoule SoF ) I pad in hand ,
Pic paints a 1000 words
In no particular order.
I,am warming ( excuse the pun ) to synthetic as natural seems like the wrong stuff to use !

https://imgur.com/gallery/cnP0M

Your pics mainly show some differently-cleaned teak. The passarelles will (or should) be better as when retracted they’re out of the sun. The wearing of the teak is caused by oxidising of the softer parts of the wood. The teak can be renovated to as-new if you use a 2-stage teak cleaner (e.g. wessex chemicals Part one and then dilute oxalic acid, lots of water, be careful not to get the stuff on metal parts) and gentle sponging not brushing. If/when it becomes ridgy, some cautious sanding is needed. If the teak is not too bad and less than a year since it looked fab... then you can keep it pretty dang good with a solution of dishwasher powder to clean it - less aggressive than 2-stage cleaning.

The older Fairline (i think) shows non-solid teak - where the increasingly soggy ply substrata eventually shows through - especially tough conditions on the rear swim platform. The weirdly patchy final pic has simply been cleaned with a single part oxalic acid (aka teak brightener), not 2-stage cleaning.

You’ll get quite good results with dishwashing powder, less harsh that the 2-part which might be used once a season, dishwasher solution say once a month should be fine.

Yes, there are fake teaks but beware that these will usually be recognisable as “false” and hence devalue the boat... and often be not as pleasant underfoot. Some are very hot in med weather, almost unusable in the carib to the extent that one boat i saw kept a bucket of seawater handy to lash about when they needed to walk on the teak... and surely uncomfy in the med summer direct sun. So it would be a good idea to test an installed example of your choice in the same climate - on a hot day!

In order to preserve the teak, one option is to make canvas covers with clips at the edges for whilst you are away, but it’s a faff of course. Another option is to bite the bullet and just replace as required. Another option is an “honest” alternative that doesn’t pretend to be teak - like cork for example.

Or of course, sod it, just enjoy the boat... EXCEPT that in making the original post and going round the marina and posting pix of various teak options shows that you are clearly quite -if not very - picky! So I think it’s just gotta be real teak for you, and you’re gonna have to clean it properly with 2-part teak cleaner once a year and dishwasher-powder solution a few times a season and/or cover it whilst you’re away - cos IMHO nothing but real teak in good condition will suffice for you (and many others too!)

hope this helps

 

[petem]

Thanks Porto, I enjoyed looking at the pics and it kind've proves my theory that there's a lot of unloved boats out in the Med.

Butt, what the hell is on the back of this swim platform...

Is it really a built in BBQ?

 

[MapisM]

I,am warming ( excuse the pun ) to synthetic as natural seems like the wrong stuff to use !

Nah, there's nothing wrong with natural wood.
It's just a matter of using it only wherever it doesn't drive you nuts with maintenance.
Ferretti used to nail the ideal combination since the good old days, imho: externally, they always used teak only in the cockpit, nothing else.
But there's no need to repeat that this is firmly an each to their own topic, because we have already done it to death...

 

[MapisM]

Is it really a built in BBQ?

I believe that yes is the answer. The owner must be American, I guess.
If you walk around a marina anywhere in FL, it's easier to find a boat with no anchor, rather than no BBQ...

 

[Portofino]

It's the time of the year when nearly everybody's teak has noticeably faded .Not withstanding the neglected boats .
That is a gas BBQ on the regal , which has real teak ,but the almost identical ( later / newer ) model next door has synthetic In terms of comfort ,yup real teak for me and solid for longevity.
In terms of colour not fussed , actually like the silver look ,but realise I,am in a minority cos 95 % to great lengths to get the honey colour --and this year thought we would have a go .
Bathing platform gets washed / sprayed in seawater when we motor depending on speed and wave direction anyhow ,that's why we tip the tender upside down .
I wonder if the sea water undos the honey two part effect ---- rarther quickly?? -boat does get a good rinse off back in the marina .
Thx for the detail TCM .

 

[Portofino]

Got cracking on the teak with " wonder teak "
Here's the pics still wet .
Need to wait to be dry before applying the sealer later to day hopefully
Then we will see how it does over the winter kits only €31 and I have all the time in world to fiddle about.
https://imgur.com/gallery/EOh8I

 

[mcanderson]

I see you are in San Remo on B pier, we were opposite that spot when we visited in Sep. Deleted User of this parish was heading to San Remo on Saturday. not sure if he is still there.

Have/do you enjoy San Remo? We did - it was great to get an Italian fix.

 

[Portofino]

I see you are in San Remo on B pier, we were opposite that spot when we visited in Sep. Deleted User of this parish was heading to San Remo on Saturday. not sure if he is still there.

Have/do you enjoy San Remo? We did - it was great to get an Italian fix.

That was June when I 1st tried the stuff .
Yup San Remo is great about 1/2 price, food wise , coffee etc than Cote d Azur and very nice people too .
We do a few ports that way for the full IT experience .
pic ,s of the sealer

https://imgur.com/gallery/dHICA

 

[markc]

I'm thinking of having the cockpit teak replaced over the winter as it seems to be nearing the end of its life. I did think about the fake stuff, like Flexiteek, as my kids drop more food on the floor than goes in their mouths and the teak is just covered in grease spots. However, I just don't think the fake stuff will feel right.

 

[jrudge]

I like the fake stuff in principal for the reasons above, but

1. it is no cheaper than the real stuff form Watsons ( the quotes I had any way)

2. fitting is the same

3. when i come to sell i assume the real teak is more desirable ( unless the buyer is a convert and knows what a pain in the ass with kids and crisps it is!)

If there was a financial advantage I would consider it.

 

[Portofino]

However, I just don't think the fake stuff will feel right.

Your boats imho is a real teak boat :encouragement: of one form or another .

The fake stuff is normally found in sub 30 ft mostly American sports cruisers .

Real stuff varies in veneer thickness form builder to builder., Real solid stuff 12 mm planks comes at a price but lasts years .
As boat size increases so does the teak thickness .
You are well into real teak territory ,perhaps a 6 mm total thickness pre cut and caulked veneer board ?

These so called " two part " systems are easy to use and top up a windy or dull day job and not really a lot of € price of a one main at a restaurant .
As mention ^^^ it just needs constant work to keep it right .
Sea water rinsed is the best stuff to keep it clean and even in colour as it oxidises in the air and UV turning eventually silver .
Lucky for me all my teak is real planks only .

 

[Portofino]

I like the fake stuff in principal for the reasons above,

3. when i come to sell i assume the real teak is more desirable ( unless the buyer is a convert and knows what a pain in the ass with kids and crisps it is!)

If there was a financial advantage I would consider it.

What it needs is for a principle high end builder to go "fake " under the trendy green / eco banner .
Once one does it like hybrid cars then the herd will follow .
Let's face it a Panamera 4 hybrid is ridiculous , but it's marketable and we all feel good in the Porsche show room knowing They do a hybrid , and the other bloke has paid more to drive one

The new San Lorenzo SX 88 , reckons with its carbon fibre hull , li ion bats etc it takes a nod to the tree huggers ( ex the pun )
In that it can anchor with full aircon and stabs for 4-6 hrs before starting the geny .

But it has real teak planks , ---- pushing the eco theme ( marketing BS imho ) this ought to been a fake deck ,perhaps with water spray coolers if hot under foot ?.?
View attachment 66592

Once one starts with fake --- who knows

 

[MapisM]

You are well into real teak territory ,perhaps a 6 mm total thickness pre cut and caulked veneer board ?

Actually, I believe that markc boat is one of the last Ferrettis built with proper thick planks, rather than pre-cut panels.
In fact, I'm surprised to hear that it has to be replaced, rather than just re-caulked and sanded.
Anyhow, of course how long teak lasts does not depend only on how well it was built, but also on how long it remained exposed to direct sunlight and rain, in which climates, etc.
But fwiw, in all the F165 and F175 I've seen, there was still enough wood in the cockpit to allow at least one round of recaulking, before replacing everything.
In those Ferrettis, the ugly bits were the cockpit bench covers, made in plywood... No big deal to replace them, anyway. :encouragement:

 

[markc]

Actually, I believe that markc boat is one of the last Ferrettis built with proper thick planks, rather than pre-cut panels.
In fact, I'm surprised to hear that it has to be replaced, rather than just re-caulked and sanded.

I didn't take a photo, but I'll try and describe - overall the caulk is quite proud due to the loss of the timber and in a few places I have lost the caulk. The recess for the caulk is very shallow but I wasn't sure if this would necessitate replacement of the timber (if just composite) or routing deeper recess for the new caulk.

Also, totally agree about the bench covers - they are already on the 'to do' list!

 

[NGM]

I like the fake stuff in principal for the reasons above, but

1. it is no cheaper than the real stuff form Watsons ( the quotes I had any way)

2. fitting is the same

3. when i come to sell i assume the real teak is more desirable ( unless the buyer is a convert and knows what a pain in the ass with kids and crisps it is!)

If there was a financial advantage I would consider it.

I've just finalised the spec for my new boat and have just deleted the teak for the fly-bridge. Like others I really don't want to be stressed by stains or have the hassle of keeping it looking good. I'll persevere with the cockpit and b/p. I'm pretty sure I'll go with flexiteak , just need to make a decision on colour, obviously the teak changes and the synthetic stays constant. I'm slightly concerned that it may get hot - the marketing spin is that their new product is much cooler and changes colour significantly less. The bimini will be up 90% of the time so mostly the synthetic will be shaded - I certainly wouldn't take a gamble on the heat with the cockpit and b/p. Whilst not the driver of my decision flexiteak is considerable cheaper than the factory fitted teak price - if it all turns out a mistake, I'll strip off and replace with real teak at a later date.

 

[MapisM]

I didn't take a photo, but I'll try and describe - overall the caulk is quite proud due to the loss of the timber and in a few places I have lost the caulk. The recess for the caulk is very shallow but I wasn't sure if this would necessitate replacement of the timber (if just composite) or routing deeper recess for the new caulk.

I'm afraid it's impossible to understand from your description whether you've got solid planks alone or over plywood, because what you describe happens in both cases, over time.
The difference is that with the former, also after 20+ years, usually there's enough thickness left for rooting, recaulking and sanding, with excellent results.
I can't swear that all F165 were built that way, but I've definitely seen one which was - though they might have changed also through the production years of the same model, I suppose...
By early naughties, most if not all builders adopted pre-cut panels with 6mm (if that!) teak planks over plywood, afaik.

 

[MapisM]

I've just finalised the spec for my new boat and have just deleted the teak for the fly-bridge.

My 2c, if I may: delete it also from the b/p.
Mind, I'm not suggesting this because I'd rather have bare grp in that area (though this is very true ).
It's rather because covering afterwards the b/p (either with teak or anything else) is essentially the same job as if done by the builder, if not better, depending on who does it.
Otoh, getting rid of a properly glued teak and revert to bare antiskid grp is a BIG job.
Don't ask me how I know...

Having said that, if you are 100% positive that you can't live without teak on the b/p, it's very unlikely that the saving allowed by the builder (if any) will cover the future refitting cost - particularly if done the way God intended, which ain't what boatbuilders do, nowadays...

 

[petem]

If no teak is specified for the B/P does the builder just leave the area hollowed out?