Med Sailors - Do you carry a liferaft ?

[affinite]

I will no doubt be accused of scrimping on safety by some on here but I'll put my head above the parapet and ask anyway ...

I have a 6 man cannister liferaft on Canopus (LOA under 13.7m by the way) and have a quote (from my Marina) of €763 for a service which will then certify it for 2 years.
I know "what price safety and the lives of the crew" but the service cost has set me wondering if its really necessary to carry an in-test liferaft in my sailing area and I would be interested to hear the opinions of others who do coastal sailing in the Med/Aegean.

We only (plan to) sail in good summer conditions, rarely sail at night and our day sails are usually no more than 25 miles.
We sail in an area with lots of other vessels in the vicinity (Greece/Dodecanese), we carry a good inventory of safety equipment;2 radios, EPIRB, flares, dinghy inflated in davits etc etc.

If you sail the Agean, you know the area and conditions so do you carry an in-test liferaft?

Thanks
Steve

 

[Cardo]

We're not in the Aegean yet, but will be heading that way this summer. We came from the UK (via the French canals) last summer. We don't have a life raft. We have a dinghy on davits (though usually put it away during multi day passages!), life jackets and PLBs. We figure the Med is small enough that help would arrive before fatality, even if we're floating around in a jacket.

 

[RupertW]

Yes we do - a ten man raft which would be hopeless for just the two of us in any big seas, but we got it with the boat. We had to get it serviced as part of the VAT registration last year in Croatia but probably won't get it serviced again. We either tow or keep on the foredeck a 3m rib and in most circumstances would use that.

 

[OldBawley]

No life-raft.

Just like you we do coastal daytime Med sailing. Half of the time I sail single-handed, if I go over the side, nobody is going to turn the boat and pick me up so I am careful.

If real bad weather develops ( In the old days before good weather forecasts ) we carry life jackets.
Happened twice in 15 years of Med cruising, both times in December on long passages.

Boat does not even have guard rails.

This is the way I want to sail, would not recommend it to others.

Everybody should ware life jackets at all times, even using the toilet or cooking a meal, helmets are a must also. NOT the pointed type, to dangerous for fellow sailors and life-rafts.
In Holland, a certificate of competence is required to eat with a knife and fork and one should ware a thimble pointing at someone.

In 30 years of sailing, two fellow sailors drowned coming from the pub, one was hit by the boom and went overboard despite guard rails and life raft, winter also, never to be found. One acquaintance hit by boom, went over the side, unconscious, saved by his sailing jacket who had build in floating.
Happened on a lake, the guy was found floating in the reeds.

Never heard of someone using a life-raft in the Med.

 

[jordanbasset]

We did have a life raft but it was outside the service date. Also had an inflated dinghy

 

[chinita]

We figure the Med is small enough that help would arrive before fatality, even if we're floating around in a jacket.

I hope you don't need help in a hurry. I have sailed from Gib to Malta and, once out of the Straits, not seen a commercial ship at all. Precious few leisure yachts as well.

 

[Tony Cross]

Yes we do, even though we're also coastal day sailors.

 

[Richard10002]

We're not in the Aegean yet, but will be heading that way this summer. We came from the UK (via the French canals) last summer. We don't have a life raft. We have a dinghy on davits (though usually put it away during multi day passages!), life jackets and PLBs. We figure the Med is small enough that help would arrive before fatality, even if we're floating around in a jacket.

Remember the little yacht that got mowed down off the IOW? Med waves and weather can be just as bad.

You might be picked up, or you might not. If the latter, you die, probably quite quickly. If you have a life raft, you will probably live longer, and have more chance of being picked up. £500 isn't a bad life insurance in the circumstances.

 

[noelex]

I don't agree with the "what price safety and the lives of the crew" argument. No one has all the possible safety equipment. We all make decisions primarily on cost. (Space, weight and electricity consumption are sometimes also a factor)

There is a lot of new safety equipment (PLB's, AIS, AIS rescue beacon, HH VHF DSC, better life jackets) to mention a few together with many "peripheral" areas where money can be spent and while not directly determined "safety equipment" can nevertheless make a direct impact on the safety of the crew and boat.
Anchoring gear, standing rigging, and crew training are just a few examples.

The first question is could the 763 euro be spent better to increase the safety of the boat and crew? Given that this is just a service with a reasonable chance the life-raft will function anyway, together with a dingy ready to go, my guess is that the answer would probably be yes.

I would try to spend your safety dollar in the most productive way. This will obviously vary depending on many factors, but spend wisely depending on your individual assessment/circumstances and existing equipment.

 

[capnsensible]

I couldn't imagine sailing anywhere without a life raft.

 

[nimbusgb]

Leaving mine at home this season. Ionian sailing only, inflated dinghy on deck all the time. Epirb and H/Held vhf on board. NEVER more than about 5 miles from land ( bash up to Corfu ) very rarely more than 2 or 3 miles. Only time I was out when it was bigger than a metre swell I had a liferaft aboard.

 

[sailorman]

I don't agree with the "what price safety and the lives of the crew" argument. No one has all the possible safety equipment. We all make decisions primarily on cost. (Space, weight and electricity consumption are sometimes also a factor)

There is a lot of new safety equipment (PLB's, AIS, AIS rescue beacon, HH VHF DSC, better life jackets) to mention a few together with many "peripheral" areas where money can be spent and while not directly determined "safety equipment" can nevertheless make a direct impact on the safety of the crew and boat.
Anchoring gear, standing rigging, and crew training are just a few examples.

The first question is could the 763 euro be spent better to increase the safety of the boat and crew? Given that this is just a service with a reasonable chance the life-raft will function anyway, together with a dingy ready to go, my guess is that the answer would probably be yes.

I would try to spend your safety dollar in the most productive way. This will obviously vary depending on many factors, but spend wisely depending on your individual assessment/circumstances and existing equipment.

Looks like a raft is quite useful at times, sadly this didnt work out.

http://www.caribbean360.com/index.php/news/st_vincent_news/1107362.html

 

[blampied]

Wish this thread had appeared last month.
We had agonised over weather to buy one or not and eventually paid seven hundred for a canister.
We are a 33foot Aquastar motor boat, departing Jersey heading for the Med via the French canals end of April.

 

[Glyka]

I will no doubt be accused of scrimping on safety by some on here but I'll put my head above the parapet and ask anyway ...

I have a 6 man cannister liferaft on Canopus (LOA under 13.7m by the way) and have a quote (from my Marina) of €763 for a service which will then certify it for 2 years.
I know "what price safety and the lives of the crew" but the service cost has set me wondering if its really necessary to carry an in-test liferaft in my sailing area and I would be interested to hear the opinions of others who do coastal sailing in the Med/Aegean.

We only (plan to) sail in good summer conditions, rarely sail at night and our day sails are usually no more than 25 miles.
We sail in an area with lots of other vessels in the vicinity (Greece/Dodecanese), we carry a good inventory of safety equipment;2 radios, EPIRB, flares, dinghy inflated in davits etc etc.

If you sail the Agean, you know the area and conditions so do you carry an in-test liferaft?

Thanks
Steve

769 € are way too much for a 6 person canister. Look for a better offer, 150-200 € would be o.k.

 

[affinite]

Wish this thread had appeared last month.
We had agonised over weather to buy one or not and eventually paid seven hundred for a canister.
We are a 33foot Aquastar motor boat, departing Jersey heading for the Med via the French canals end of April.

I'm going to sound hypocritical but I dont think you will regret having spent the money.
Having the raft there does give a certain ammount of peace of mind.
The next test of your resolve will come at the first service aniversary

 

[affinite]

769 € are way too much for a 6 person canister. Look for a better offer, 150-200 € would be o.k.

Glyka
Its a full service inc test cylinder, replacement of flares, emergency water etc etc but I agree that it sounds way too much
Im obviously also paying for the Marinas "handling fee" but would take the raft somewhere myself if I knew where to go -
Do you know a service centre anywhere near Leros ?

 

[duncan99210]

We have a four person Seago raft. I am happy with it as a basic raft if all goes horribly wrong: I'm not confident of the SAR services in the eastern end of the Med and would prefer something to sit in for a possibly protracted period whilst they sorted themselves out.

Yes, we have a dinghy, which during the summer is either towed or held in the transom inflated (long trips) but would regard it as a last resort as it is not all that stable in anything above a gentle swell, whereas the liferaft has stability pockets to keep it upright, nor does it have any overhead protection, mainly from the sun in this part of the world.

When it comes right down to it, life rafts are one of those personal preference items. I prefer to have one, others don't see the need and would prefer to spend money on something else.

As regards servicing and inspections, we have not been asked about our safety equipment at all in five years and I have not heard of anyone on a private boat being asked except for the well reported Portugese encounters. No idea what the real rules are in Greece but the reality is no one seems to care too much.

 

[Chris_Robb]

Glyka
Its a full service inc test cylinder, replacement of flares, emergency water etc etc but I agree that it sounds way too much
Im obviously also paying for the Marinas "handling fee" but would take the raft somewhere myself if I knew where to go -
Do you know a service centre anywhere near Leros ?

Hi - we are in the same situation. We have a 20 year old Avon 6 man raft. I last had it serviced in 2009 (when it was 15 years old), and I watched it being opened and repacked.

The Guy said that I would now need to service it every year as it was over 15 years old. He knew my plans for Greece, and he said that basically this raft - it weighs a bloody ton - is built of the proper rip stop neoprene and will still be working when all the modern ones had gone to their maker. He said that apart from flares, water, - the gas bottles never fail and in any case just get weighed and never replaced (unless failed??) so his view was that in a small sea area - all you needed was a flotation device - so long as it it inflated, thats all you need.

If I was doing longer voyages well away from land, I would get it serviced.

So - for as long as I am in Greece/Turkey, it won't be serviced.

I carry an EPIRB - which is due for testing at the end of this year. I will trade it in for a new one rather than pay 60% of its value on the service - getting a newer model......

 

[Glyka]

Glyka
Its a full service inc test cylinder, replacement of flares, emergency water etc etc but I agree that it sounds way too much
Im obviously also paying for the Marinas "handling fee" but would take the raft somewhere myself if I knew where to go -
Do you know a service centre anywhere near Leros ?

I 'm talking about a full service as well (including actually inflating the raft). I don't know anybody near Leros but I can give you the phone number of the company that I used. It's in Pireus but probably they can find a way. The company name is "Pyrsos" and the numbers are: (+30)2104176872, 2104539905, 2104520391.

 

[BobnLesley]

Another vote for spending your money in other areas of safety. We finally bought/loaded a life raft just before leaving the Med for the Atlantic; that said, we still did the crossing with the inverted dinghy inflated on the foredeck, complete with pump, repair kit and a second set of emergency water & food tied into it. Whilst the nice man who sold us the shiny-new life-raft promises that if we tie it to the rail, throw it in the water and pull the bit of cord, it will miraculously inflate and stay that way, I've never seen it happen myself; if the faeces ever hits the turbine, I'm hoping it does what it says on the box, but given time I'll be taking the dink along with us too.