Med Cruising plans - where to go?

[tony_brighton]

Looking at the long range plans, we are contemplating a year off in 2004/5 for cruising the Med. Tentative outline would be about 12-14 months starting with the Rally Portugal, returning via the French Canals (draft = 1.35m), giving about 10 months to cruise the Med. Given a starting point of Gibraltar, where and when would people recommend trying to get to and what is worth seeing?

 

[tcm]

Barcelona and Marseilles are must-see med cities imho. Palma also to a lesser extent. The cote d'azur is a must-see area (st trop -menton)

Greece is cheap but the food is utterly rubbish (the greece-based people may disagree, but the blimmin toliets don't even work, and this wil not go down well with MrsB, so I wdn't bother.

Italy promises much, but is similarly broken since heydays of um 1700 years ago. San remo for example especially disappointing - all the italians go to france, not tother way around.

South of france is totally magical imhop, which is why i'm based there. Awful from the land side of course, hours in traffic. But from the sea, lots to see, easy to make brit and french friends, good anchorages to hang out in to save a few quid yet stay close to the action.
Those main cote-d'azur anchorages again are:
millionaires bay, south side of st trop bay to east of the town
just outside st trop harbour
villefranche bay
between the isles de lerin if it's a reasonably calm
just outside Menton harbour
bay of cannes, yes smack outside the Carlton where it feels a bit banned

You need a decent dinghy with outboard: on board during the day in summer means breezy from onshore winds or from pesky watersjiers.

Summer possible is Corsica, wild etc, bit of a poor mans south of france really, clavi and st florent intersting towns, ajaccio a bit manky

So...up the coast , do the balearix, then hop to barcelona, then marseilles then corsica and save cote d'azur till last.

Of course, i'm jealous as hell.

 

[tony_brighton]

Despite Greece being dodgy - is it worth trying for e.g. Turkey?

 

[sailbadthesinner]

Depends on the wife. I love greece but after a fortnight on the more remote parts can be a bit 'taverna'd out'

ie in some of the more remote bits they just have the same menu in each restaraunt and put a price next to what they have.

Sardinia is a must see i think it is beautiful. And it is a natural staging post if you are going east. My advice would be to be as far East as possible by August to avoid the real crowds in the med. the balearics get v busy august as does the ionian.

The dodecanese are nice and personally i like turkey but i would not reccomend it unless you like the more basic lifestyle. i find the turks v generous and welcoming, some people find them pushy but they are wonderful once you get used to their sales technique.

if you have a year tho i think you must get a taste of it all so do the south coast of france and bits of italy, esp sicily before roughing it up the eastern end.



If it F***s Flies or Floats. Rent it. For god's sake don't marry it.

 

[tcm]

Turkey and Greece; it\'s so cheap!

Well, i don't need to go, I must say. If you fly over greece, the whole place, all of it, is Brown. Sure, it's nice from a blue sea sort of perspective, but then everywhere is quite beutiful if it's hot and sunny, but there's sod all there, even their capital city an embarassing dump, the old buildings knackered and the new ones are half finished to save tax, and your own boat regardlesof how basic, is totally wonderful and luxurious in comparison. Turkey is loved by people who like things to be even cheaper than they are in greece, which is already quite cheap but justifiably so.

Now by contrast, Croatia is making a decent effort, nice dramatic scenery with greenery plus at the end of the adriatic is Venice, so much more worthwhile than crap greece and turkey. And you could drop into the Ionaian to check out how so-so it is. But, for crying out loud, it's full of people for whom the very cheapness is a mark of achievement - "we had a meal for four with wine for 10 quid!" but fail to say that the food and wine was actually overpriced.

This'll put the tin lid on it: the toilets throught greece are so rubbish that, despite them having 3000 years head start on european civilisation, you can't put loo paper in them. You have to use a separate bin, full of everyone else used bog paper. Blurgh. It's bloody awful, and that's without before consulting the wife! Also, the bars have mice zipping around. If they don't have mice, it's because they have loads of stray cats zipping around. There was a raffle to win a free weeks charter, we didn't dare buy any tickets as we couldn't possibly run the risk of going back.

Greece : cheap and nasty
Turkey: even cheaper and further away
Spain: not too bad, bit cheap but warmer off season despite slightly crap food
Italy: ok if you like pasta all the time
S France: much much better than the above. Blimmin flip, that Henry V had got the place after agincourt, married king of france's daughter already and a promise that the whole thing would be property of HM govt England, then went and died just a year or so too early damn damn damn. Just think - Cannes would be "Manchester" and er well it would be a bit wrecked er cancel all that...

 

[davidbains]

I think you're all being a bit hard on Greece. And no-one mentioned how difficult berths are to find Spain. I left Brighton in '89 and my tri has been berthed at Preveza in the Ionian for 5 years now. There are three boatyards where 600yachts can spend the whole winter on the hard. You can also winter afloat in Levkas or Gouvia marinas. It's true the food is basic but I like Souvlaki and my crew lives on squid and octopus and my daughter eats pasta and meatballs, and the moderate prices mean we can do it most nights. In fact for me the most annoying thing about Greece is the paperwork they're trying to push onto yachts for some inexplicable reason which has people leaving. In ten months a trip from Gib to Greece and back to the French canals would seem reasonable. Sail up the Spanish coast, cross to the Balearics, cross to Corsica/ Sardinia, round the boot of Italy (I wouldn't bother with Sicily but the other Italian islands are interesting especially the Liparis if you like volcanoes). Then sail up the Adriatic at least to Split, then back to Dubrovnik where you could winter afloat. Then western Greece ( the Ionian). I suspect the Aegean and Turkey will be too far in ten months and the summer Meltemi makes life difficult in the Aegean. You might have time to circumnavigate the Peloponnese though. I've done it twice and enjoyed it. Go round anticlockwise and back throught the Corinth canal. You can visit Delphi by spending the night at Itea. Then cross back to the toe of Italy and cruise up the west coast of Italy and round the riviera, possibly via Corsica again. Many French yachts make their summer holiday a circumnavigation of Corsica and back. At the end of the summer there will be a lot of yachts waiting near Cap Corse for a good forecast to cross back to France between Mistrals.
Exscuse me copying your "handle"!

 

[MedMan]

Hmm … … the Med in 10 months? That’s a pretty tall order. Our itinerary has been:

1988 Brighton to Almerimar via Biscay, Northern Spain, Portugal and Gibraltar
1999 Almerimar to Toulon via the Balearics, Eastern Spain and Golfe du Lion
2000 Toulon to Malta via the French and Italian Rivieras, Elba, Corsica, Sardinia, the Italian Islands, the west coast of Italy and the Straits of Messina.
2001 Malta to Croatia with extensive cruising of the Dalmatian islands.
2002 Croatia to the Greek Ionian where we now lie.

We have found very little that is not beautiful and it is all worth seeing. The Med is a superb cruising area.

As you only have 10 months I guess you don’t really want to know all this, but I have laid out our route to make what I think is an important point. The Med is a huge, huge area with enough to keep the cruising yachtsman happy for years. If you try to rush all the way across and back in your 10 months you will see nothing properly and end up exhausted! Once we have reached our cruising area for the year we average from 75 to 100 miles a week, no more. That way we can relax, go sightseeing, take in the local atmosphere and make our passages on good days only.

With these thoughts in mind, forget about the Aegean and Turkey - they are far too far away. In all honesty I feel that the Greek Ionian and Croatia come into the same category though, if you up for a few long passages, Croatia is the place that surpasses all others, and by a wide margin.

Of the places within sensible reach, the Balearics are a must but try to go there outside July and August. Mainland Spain has good harbours and marinas allowing visits to Cordoba, Seville, Granada Valencia and Barcelona. A trip to Andorra is also worth while. Western Corsica has some of the most dramatic scenery in the Med, but it is an exposed coast with few ports of refuge. The Italian islands are very interesting (Elba, Capraia, Giglio, Pontine, Maddalena & Aeolian islands) but the mainland is unwelcoming. The south coasts of France and Italy have few anchorages but are still worth visiting outside the high season. Les Iles d’Hyeres are particularly beautiful and you can anchor there. The section of coast from Monaco to the French/Italian border is particularly striking with the Alps forming an impressive backdrop.

Happy sailing.

 

[Mr Cassandra]

Re: Turkey and Greece; it\'s so cheap!

Ok . I agree toilets in Greece are crap, [pun intended ] Taverna food bad ,if you do not know the best places .BUT when you know the right places or get invited back to peoples homes ,then things are a lot different. also if you buy food in supermarkets and local prods they taste so much better than English grow food stuff. I think that is why peops here are going back to organic types of food here . Also if I want to go to the toilet there are two on my boat . so although I can agree with part of what you say , spend a little more time scratch the surface and there is another world here . All imho
cheers bob t

Bob T

 

[tcm]

Re: yes

You make greece etc sound like the uk, with better weather - which i suppose is fair enough really!

 

[tcm]

Re: fab post medman

i bet he meant that he started in 1998 not 1988 but anyway, from his last paragraph, it seems more worthwhile to sit on a bus and visit andorra inland than go to greece or turkey. I agree.

 

[MedMan]

Re: fab post medman

Well spotted. I could have been in a time warp for 10 years I suppose but consulting my log it was indeed 1998 when we left!

 

[summerwind]

I notice that in all of the above posts, no one mentions North Africa.

I am toying with the idea of visiting Tunisia. From the info I have obtained so far it seems like great efforts are being made to attract cruisers, including building large, all mod cons marinas.

Anyone visited recently?

What was it like?

 

[tony_brighton]

Re: "handle" - bizarrely its not a handle. Brighton is my name.

 

[charles_reed]

Re: fab post medman

The Western Med has that effect on one (I mean time-confusion).

I'd totally agree with the sentiment about trying to do too much in too little time.
It's take me 3 years to get from N Wales as far as the Cote Vermielle and I'm going back this spring to do the Baleares, Sardegna and Corse.

In fairness I started off with a fine briskness, which had abated somewhat by the time I got to La Rochelle and Arcarchon.
Even then I only gave Galicia 6 weeks, which was regrettably too short.

I'd rate mediterranean Spain far lower than the Atlantic Spanish coastline and bottled out of doing the Midi because a 15m mast doesn't sit well on a 9.5m boat and the cost of overland transportation was prohibitive.

In fact I'd now give some credence to the remark made to me that the W Med was only there for one to get through to get to the E Med.

 

[davidbains]

Medman, I'm fascinated you left Brighton ten years after us and are now wintering in the same Ionian area. What boat name and boatyard!? Our Aqua Blue is ashore in Preveza Marine.
We did the Adriatic this summer, getting up to Split and then cruising back through the Croatian islands to Dubrovnik. They are fantastic and clean and the locals are friendly and the paperwork is simple despite them being outside the EC. OK you have to pay for your cruising permit but it's worth it. We had a very rapid transit back, Dubrovnik to Erikoussa in 35hrs on a cold front after all the disturbed weather. In fact in normal conditions sailng north up the Adriatic can be tedious unless your boat's very good to windward. I do agree you can spend a lifetime exploring the Med especially if you have any interest in history. A Bimini and a fridge are essential.

 

[LadyInBed]

So much to see, and so little time to see it in.
Of the bit of the French coast I've seen, I found them to be a bit sniffy in Marseilles, but it looks great at night, so went out to Iles du Friou.
The calanque d'en Vau near Cassis is a must as is the Ile de Porquerolles.

 

[Mr Cassandra]

I thought the same ,for five years I have kept my boat in either Prevasa Marine. Cleo`s or Joe Chartons Island in Lefcas. this year left in Poros Aegean.
cheers bob t


Bob T

 

[petem]

blinkin\' philistine!

Checked the dictionary for spelling and it says "a person who is hostile or indifferent to culture, or one whose interests or tastes are commonplace or material". Sound familiar?

 

[tcm]

Re: referee!

I refer the hon gentleman to my erstwhile posting/rant. If there was just ONE building or historical site that you could visit in the whole of europe...what would it be?

Me: the cathedral of Sainte Chapelle, on the Ile de la Cité in Paris. Built in the 1300's the upper floor is stupendous by any standards. Visit as near to midday as possble, with full sun. The stained glass windows depict nothing less than the story of creation itself. The effect of the slim soaring pillars suporting the radiant and awe-inspiring stained glass windows around the entire congregation is ethereal, heavenly, as if enveloped by a butterfly sent from the Gods themselves. Nothing is similar, nothing comes close. I visit every year for an annual fix, and I am hooked.

 

[tony_brighton]

Thanks for the postings - some very informative ideas and opinions. Hope to see you out there.