Maurice Griffiths Designs

[chrisbarbour]

Hello,
If anyone could offer advice, or knows of any critical writings/resources for MG boat designs i'd be most grateful for a few pointers!
I am considering a 30 or 31 ft GRP golden hind or waterwitch, which is a bermudan-rigged, hard chined boat with loads of space for it's size, tri-keel profile and lots of character for a GRP boat.
All round it seems ideal for myself. However it's underwater profile looks a bit like a bath-tub and, compared to long keelers, doesn't look particularly stable or sea-worthy! Despite this i have been assured by the owner that it is indeed a very solid sailing boat with a good reputation.
Spaciousness and bottom-taking ability is more important to me than sailing performance, but i want something that I wont grow out of to fast, i.e: something reliable, seaworthy and capable of making leisurely passages.

There dont seem many boats around that fit the bill:
seadog ketch : very solid maybe too pricey
westerly: ugly, cheap, only really a day cruiser (im told)

If the MG is indeed suited for offshore sailing then this seems the best i've come across.

Any tips or advice on alternatives would be greatly appreciated.

 

[oughtoc]

Each to thier own, if you like the feel of it, then buy it. You have to love your boat.

Me, I like wood.....

 

[sarabande]

start with the Eventide owners group. They are a repository for the Griffiths designs and info.

http://www.eventides.org.uk/

 

[Bajansailor]

Have a look on www.amazon.co.uk for books by Maurice Griffiths - for example :
Little Ships and Shoal Waters
The Magic of the Swatchways
Swatchways and Little Ships
Dream Ships
60 years a Yacht Designer

I have Little Ships and Shoal Waters, and it is an excellent read.

GH 31s are pretty seaworthy - Terry Erskine used to advertise (in the 70s and early 80s) how they are made something like 30 odd transatlantic crossings, with various voyages to New Zealand, and perhaps around the world as well.

A pal of mine had one in the late 70s, and I sailed a passage on her from the Grenadines up to Antigua - not the fastest of 30 footers by any means, but fairly comfortable.
I think I would prefer a Sea Dog though, if given the option.

 

[Tranona]

Welcome to the forum. I have owned an MG boat for nearly 30 years and have a good archive of material and plans - although most information is now held by the Eventide Owners group.

My boat is an Eventide 26 design, built by Hartwells in 1963 at the same time as the first Golden Hinds (originally 28 and then 31). Terry Erskine worked for Hartwells and subsequently took over the building himself. The GH is a very different boat from the Waterwitch having deeper draft and more deadrise. The early ones were single chine like my Eventide, but most after about 1969/70 were double chine. Until the early 80's they were all wood, but gradually GRP hulls took over, although decks and coachroofs were epoxy sheathed wood. Terry stopped building in the mid 80s and a number of other builders produced a small number, until Mark Urry (who had built a wood GH) took over the moulds and built a few. There were also a number of 26 footers built, developed from my Eventide 26, but with double chines.

After the history, what are they like? Very different to what you imagine from the shape. Very stable and comfortable, not fast and the early ones were undercanvassed. Some were built as cutters or with a taller mast and there were a few with ketch rig. They live up to their reputation as sound long distance cruisers as well as being handy in shallow water.

The early ones were not very well built and have a number of weak points where rot can set in - although some, like mine were Cascover sheathed which helps. The interior of early boats was spartan and the frames took up a lot of space. SABB and aircooled Lister engines were common. However, later boats, particularly Erskine built boats of the late 70s early 80s were very well built and have more modern layouts down below. Terry had a good business for a while selling to Americans who got a custom built boat which they often sailed away from Plymouth to do trans Atlantic or even world cruises, so you find them all over the world - there are a couple for sale in N America now.

As to whether they are a good buy depends on your plans. They are solid boats, good usable accommodation. Some have gone to the Med, like Richard Hares who has a late Mark Urry built boat and writes in Classic Boat, but as a Med sailor this would not be my first choice. Good Erskine boats sell for £25k upwards - wide range because often huge variation in age equipment and condition.

Seems to fit the bill for what you want. You might also consider a Barbican 33 also a Griffiths design, but round bilge and centreboard. More yachty and less "rustic" than a GH, but also to me less charm and more expensive.

If you PM (Private Mail) me with details of the boat you are looking at I might be able to give you more information. Mark Urry's boat, Moonlight was tested by both PBO and YM when it was new (about 10 years ago!) and more recently as a secondhand boat by Sailing Today. You should be able to access them through the back numbers service.

MG as you may know was editor of Yachting Monthly for over 40 years. He was a great "popular cruising" man and his designs reflected his philosophy. Most designs were built in small numbers and many of the Eventide/Waterwitch family were home built, but the GH was a very successful "production" boat with over 150 built. If your view of life and sailing is on the same wavelength as MG then you can't go wrong with one of his boats.

 

[contessa26]

Welcome.
What excellent replies from people who know a lot more than me! But I love MG designs, and as Tranona puts it, MG's 'view on life and sailing...'
I've read and reread all his books, and keep them close to hand. (Dream Ships is one of my favourites) I've sailed on all sorts of boats, including Eventides, and I love all boats. But as a more eminent poster than me said - you've got to love your boat! And as Arthur Beiser said at the beginning of his book 'The Proper Yacht' "To my mind, unless one's spirit soars at the sight of a boat... it just won't do."
Best wishes.

 

[jimmi]

hi im new to all this,but was wondering my boat could be a maurice griffiths,can anyone help?

 

[Billy_Mizzen]

Try posting this as new thread and you’ll get a much better response! Can’t help you with ID but I’m sure they’ll be someone along soon who can! Just a guess but looks akin to a Magyar 7?

 

[jimmi]

Thanks Billy i,ll try that

 

[Santana379]

I had and loved a (GRP) Golden Hind 31 (Francis Fletcher) from 1999 to 2006. Since then I've had a Barbican 33 (Santana).

The GH is huge inside for a 31.5ft long-keeler. The storage space is just amazing, so of course you tend to fill it, making it even heavier. Not a performance boat in any sense, but a great sea boat in terms of handling the rough stuff and looking after the crew. Stands up to her (small) sail area well thanks to the chines.

The Barbican is only a foot longer (32.5ft) and weighs the same. It carries more sail, and is significantly more (initially) tender requiring much earlier reefing, but probably only early relative to a GH! Sailing performance is a lot better, and we are now sailing in F2 winds that would have had us motoring in the GH.

The Golden Hind is not easy to handle in a marina - the turning cicle is about the size of a football pitch, and the rudder has little or no bearing on the direction she goes in reverse. Having said that the engine power / propellor will have a big influence on that. Basically the GH doesn't like changing direction much, so is fabulous to single hand, and I sailed ours for miles at a time with the rig balanced and the tiller left untended without an auto pilot.

Build quality of the GRP GH is very good indeed, and it was an immensely strong boat. The new owner of ours plans to sail her to Australia. There was a time when the GH had allegedly done more Transats (100+) than any other class, and they are to be found all over the world.

Neither boat is very close winded, as one would expect from shoal draft long-keelers with bilge plates.

PM me if you would like a 'phone chat on my personal experience of both. As a buyer the trouble with the books on and by Maurice Griffiths is that they are naturally not very objective. I am a member of both the EOA and the EOG, and there is much wisdom available at both.