Marine Audio - Finding Suppliers and Advice Is Problematic!

[demonboy]

I'm really struggling to find someone I can talk to about setting up an audio solution for my boat. When I search for "marine audio" I might get some online distributors but there doesn't seem to be anyone i can talk to about possible solutions, costs, complete kits, good seperates, installation, power requirements, tips.......

I'm looking to run a multi-channel amp and (hopefully) 5.1 surround for DVD too if poss, but not essential, plus the ability to run seperate speakers up on deck.....and so on.

It would be great if someone could point me in the right direction - just a phone number of someone in the know would be useful. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

 

[steve28]

why not use a set of computer 5.1 or 6.1 speakers, most of them use a 12 volt input

 

[demonboy]

I'm after power - lots of it - and need to run a sub bass too. From my understanding a PC speaker sub bass still needs to be plugged in to mains.

Also this isn't the main concern.....I'm looking for advice on the best multi-channel marine amp, installation, bridging, external waterproof speaks and so on.

The speaker bit is easy but thanks for your reply, Steve. I wasn't aware that they had 12v input.

 

[fireball]

If your after power - try a Car system - plenty of custom builds to put your 18" units in... for anything up on deck though your less likely to get a water/splash proof speaker of any real decent quality/power

 

[geoffatstanpit]

I hope you're on a VERY distant mooring. I don't think I'd want to be in the same bay with your system.

Geoff

 

[Joe_Cole]

If you want fully marinised kit then I don't think you'll find it. I don't believe there is a market for it. The nearest you'll get is for a car.

Will you be posting your passage plans here so that we know where to avoid? /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

 

[pvb]

Jamie, how about...

How about asking the guys at Oyster in Ipswich? They must have handled some pretty impressive audio systems.

 

[Althorne]

Interesting user name. Wonder if it's got anything to do with most of the extra comments your posters have been adding about your proposed music system.
Couldn't be you've been "driven out to sea" I hope. /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[demonboy]

Do you see what I mean when I said it's impossible to find advice?!!!

Of course I won't be disturbing the neighbours, I'm not some Essex-boy with a souped up Mk1 Escort! But some of us really are passionate about our music and require a decent sound system. Decent does not equate to loud, either. I just don't want to be relying on some crappy ancient car-tape player and one speaker. This is a live-aboard, after-all. How many of you have decent stereos and cinema set-ups in your living room? Precisely.

Now, let's start again! Can anyone point me in the right direction? Please?


@ Joe_Cole & frogley- yes, it will be an in-car entertainment solution but there are marine-specific amps (Clarion for example). I just wanted some advice on a good marine amp etc.
@ pvb - our boat's an oyster anyway, so this is a good suggestion. I'm an idiot for not thinking of this myself /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

[fireball]

A suitably placed bass bin will remove the need for bow thruster and once tilted will lift the boat out of the water - allowing for easy cleaning of the hull /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

When anchored it will also mean that you have plenty of swinging space
When visiting other marinas it means you won't be rafted up against...

The downside is that you can't hear when the engine is straining to keep the battery charged when your pulling 60 amps out for the audio system....

 

[jstalpaert]

You can try http://www.clarion-eu.com/uk/. They do have a marine radio/CD (XMD3) and speakers. I've bought one but not installed yet, so can't help you further.

 

[pvb]

Oyster experience...

I'm sure Oyster will be able to point you in the right direction. Bearing in mind your boat, and likely cruising areas, I wouldn't have thought you needed to worry too much about having specifically "marine grade" equipment (other than cockpit speakers) providing the installation is sensibly planned.

By the way, your website is super! I hope you & Liz have a great time, and that you'll remember to keep posting the updates.

 

[broadcaster]

I am guessing that as you live on the boat it will be connected to shore power for most of the time. If so you can get some small home cinema amps with a decent power output/quality, remember for surround sound it is important to get the speaker positions correct or it won't give a good surround image.

If your using a LCD or Plasma for the video then the power requirements will be pretty high anyway, so I presume you won't be using it long on batteries.

Andy

 

[demonboy]

Yes, that's correct broadcaster. In fact the cinema/surround sound wouldn't be used on battery power at all. The stereo will, though, therefore my main requirement is a system that will power 4 channels plus sb on 12v, with the ability to switch on the deck speakers either either in addition to or alternatively to the system down below. I'm guessing I'd need a five channel amp minimum, possibly 2x4channel amps as the SB requires bridging.

@pvb - thanks! Feel free to leave a message in the forum too! I'll be updating some exploits from last summer I've ommited, plus updates on Esper whilst in Turkey. Hoping to spend most of the summer on her, which is why I need my music sorted /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

[jerryat]

HI! I have a four speaker set-up in the saloon. Each side (i.e. Port/starboard) has a pair giving proper stereo. In the cockpit we have two Pioneer waterproof speakers. The problem was how to switch off all four saloon speakers and switch on those in the cockpit. I approached an up-market car stereo installation company here in Plymouth, who treated it as a sort of challenge. They made me up a piece of kit using relays etc such that after connecting everything up, a single on/off switch does the job superbly. It cost £25.00 cash!

The Pioneer CD/tuner is new, plays anything we put in it (except cassettes)
and also allows us to use the auxillary mode to play the sound from either the TV (used for videos) or the laptop (used for DVD's). The aux. does have a drawback in that, for the TV/DVD's we can only have one set of stereo speakers operating, apparently since the aux channel only supplies two, not four speakers.

So it's not perfect, but the sound is excellent, and the perfect siting of the speakers means we can enjoy good music without the volume being high enough to disturb others. Hopefully this will give you a couple of ideas.

 

[TrueBlue]

Agree with that - I have a pioneer XV-DV313 system (small home cinema setup), the speakers are small and so the bass may not to be to your taste, but I find it adequate for my classical music, and the sub-woofer is fine for organ music.

Modern inverters are very efficient so I run the whole thing off my battery bank, including a 21" TV. No probs with flat batteries, but I do have 500Ah @ 24V, but that doesn't appear excessive by today's standards.

 

[Lee_Shaw]

Mailspeed do them.

 

[LeonF]

Interesting...I have a stereo on my little Victoria 800 and its great to have a wild sail with some great symphony playing....I had always thought sea and wind would be the thing but it adds another dimension. But TV and DVD.... surely the point of being on a boat is to get away from the damned things !!!

 

[jerryat]

Entirely agree LeoF, but we have been full cruising for about seven years and the DVD/TV really does help pass some of the winter evenings where ever you are. It's never used during the sailing season. And YES, when the wind really pipes up, we also often have put something 'strident' on the cockpit speakers, and have a wild ride!!

 

[William_H]

The definition of Hi Fi implies that the sound you hear in a concert auditorium is faithfully reproduced to be heard the same way by the HiFi listener. Modern electronics are such that the recording replay mechanism and amplifiers are so close to perfect that it doesn't matter. The real hole in the chain is the speakers and the actual room you listen in. Both areas are difficult on a boat. For base reproduction the experts will tell you there is no substitute for cubic feet (in the speaker box) The problem is that the compressed air on one side of the speaker cone can flow around the edge to balance the low pressure on the other side. Now if you seal the back of the cone then the pressure build up will dampen the movement unless the sealed enclosure is big enough, (This whole effect is more pronounced the lower the frequency) So the ideal for base is to have the speaker in a wall open front and back but no air flow between. Every other method involves attenuating the highs so that the base sounds ok or of tuning for better performance at low frequencies. The next problem is the listening room. A boat cabin like a car is realy bad. You can improve the frequency response by correct use of the equalizer but this will only work for one location in the room. Even then the reflections of sound would be nothing like a proper large auditorium. Obviously for 5.1 sound you would be tied to one seat for proper operation anyway.
The nexpt problem is that the human ear has poor response at both high and low frequency when the sound level is low. So for proper fidelity you need to replay at the level of the original performance. (you would be driven out of the marina) The fix is use of the "loudness" control which does compensate to a variable degree.
The point of all this is that in a boat you will never get a practical form of true HiFi. Certainly spending top money on top range CD player and amplifiers and probably on 5.1 sound is a waste because of the overwhelming limitations of the speaker and auditorium problems.
Just one point also many car speakers are rated at 100 or more watts. The speakers are made to handle this power by being robust and stiff. The result is that they are less efficient than a good domestic speaker (large) and you can get more sound pressure out of a 50 watt speaker driven with 50 watts than a 100watt car speaker driven with 100watts. Look for an sensitivity rating typically 87decibels at 1watt at 1 metre. Remember that a 93db sensitivity gives the same sound pressure for half the power in. If you are talking amplifiers you would find that the cheapest car radio amplifier has a performance that is not perceptably worse than the best stereo amp. (just more power bells and whistles)
I always wanted to be a stereo salesman. The more you charge a person for the product the better they like it cos they can't tel the difference any other way than the price. Spend your money on program material and don't waste money to top price gear the corrosion will get. IMHO
regards will