Marina berthing

[MrG]

I was moored up in East Cowes Marina at the weekend, at certain times there was a fair tide running through. Several boats attempted to moor up but found the situation difficult.
Is it not easier to moor with a current flowing and 'Ferry Gliding' into a berth?

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[Twister_Ken]

Yes, but one of the problems with marinas like E. Cowes is that for approx half the time half the berths will always be downtide ones.

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[robp]

Only if you know EXACTLY which way the stream is going. It rarely goes through marinas just as you'd expect. Say you're berthing stbd side to, and passing another boat on your way in. You take way off, lose steerage and get taken on to the vessel you're trying to pass. Good fun in the spring tide we had this weekend..

Bribe em on Ch 80 for a downstream berth!!

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[chriscallender]

The only effective technique I've found for getting into the downtide ones is to stem the tide and then slow down until you creep slowly backwards into the berth.... and if it all goes wrong you've got a reasonable escape route just by opening the throttle.

When doing this I can never manage to get my head around which way to move the tiller because I feel that I am going astern even though I'm still moving forwards through the water, so I typically make a bit of a mess of it anyway!

One thing thats for sure is that the straight in suicide approach rarely works, since you can't stop in time and I've seen plenty of crashes in Cowes caused by attempting it.


Chris

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[jimi]

Saw an absolutely brilliant downtide approach last year in Cowes, S*****l yacht came hammering forward into a downtide berth, two crew at the shrouds with breastropes ready, unfortunately the one with the bow rope jumped off first and tied off as tight as poss to the nearest cleat ... picture the rest .. stern side swiping and ending up jammed across the berth, I ran to help but tripped over my jaw!

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[tome]

This is how I do it also, and have the bow line and forward spring to hand. Trying to go in bow first results in large prop walk (Maxprop) as she goes astern to stem the tide, with potentially disastrous consequences.

I practiced it bows in with reasonable results by building sternway well ahead of the berth, but you have to remember to reverse the helm when steering which isn't always intuitive in the heat of the moment.

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[MrG]

I have never tried going astern into a berth by ' Ferry Gliding' although the theory is sound and I like the sense of control it gives. Going forward I have done few times, along with berths at the ends of pontoons in between other boats...

Mark

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[jimi]

Ferry gliding astern

I've done it a few times .. but you've got to go easy as the rudder kicks over. However if you've got a boat that steers well in reverse then it really can give you complete control when going into an uptide downwind berth.

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[Evadne]

... ferry-gliding in backwards like this works as long as the wind doesn't blow the bows off before you get into the berth:
Downstream+downwind = ok,
downstream+upwind=impossible,
a cross-wind = depends on the wind strength.

The worst one I had was when the gear cable jumped out in forward, so a quick dab astern bacame a quick dab ahead....crunch! Funny how time slows down when you can't do anything about the impending disaster!

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[davel]

I have a pontoon berth in a fast flowing tide on the Hamble.
After a number of small scrapes and near misses I've developed a technique that seems to work well for me when I'm berthing with the tide running behind me (berthing into the tide is fine).

I rig a warp with a large bowline (the knot that is, not a line from the bow!) with a loop diameter of a couple of metres. I run this through a midships cleat with the other end of the warp returning to the genoa winch which is accessible from the helm. As I approach the berth a crew member stands well forward with the loop of the bowline held open. As we enter the berth the crew drops the bowline over the first cleat we pass (ie the cleat at the seaward end of the pontoon finger). The helm then applies a combination of reverse throttle and tension on the warp to bring the boat to a gentle stop. As soon as this is done, the warp is made fast on the winch (self tailing so straight forward) and a little forward throttle is applied with the tiller hard over so as to leave the boat sitting against the pontoon finger with the forward motion held against the spring line. Crew then steps ashore to make off permanent mooring lines at which point the engine is shut down.

I still enter with heart in mouth but so far it's worked OK every time (touch wood).


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[Evadne]

Sounds like a good technique, I'll try something similar next time. Coming from a swinging mooring it's always useful to hear how the locals evolve techniques to cope with their type of berth.

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[tome]

This is ok until the nice bowline jumps off the cleat (not kidding, I had this happen!). I'm now careful to keep some tension on the line to the cleat if attempting a spring brake.

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[Guest]

That sounds neat, I might just give it a try for the hell of it!

I have stopped going to East Cowes for this very reason, come to think of it, why did I go to E Cowes in the first place? Lost nav lights and sustained damage to pulpit a couple of years ago in this marina, chap was very good about it and paid up by return, on receipt of estimate, no argument.


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[davel]

I have one of those cleats with a hole in the middle of it and I thread the warp through this so it can't jump off. This only applies to the midships cleat, I've not yet trained the crew to do it on the pontoon cleat /forums/images/icons/smile.gif.

<hr width=100% size=1>Dave L.

 

[tome]

It was the pontoon cleat it jumped! Worse still I hadn't noticed it until I went slow ahead and the boat in front reared up at me. I went full throttle and managed to snake hip with just inches to spare.

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[Gunfleet]

Sounds great - until you go into a marina with those blooming little hoops instead of cleats!

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[StugeronSteve]

My berth has a strong tidal stream, which on the ebb runs in across the port quarter. I've got a 40' Princess moored next to me on my stbd side with approx 2' of free space between the boats when tied up. Having chickened out on two approaches in the early days i asked one of the HM staff how to do it. Answer: tie up to a hammer head and wait for the tide to slacken. Showing off gets expensive when you screw up!

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[MainlySteam]

As well as waiting for better conditions I am never to proud to back out and go around again. Also was not too proud to ask a friend who was an excellent boat handler to come, with me helming, into some tight spots and give me some advice.

While we have little tide in our berth we do have strong and gusty winds (and takes two people to hold the boat against 15 knots), dock with only a ring at inner and outer end (the boat will not sit powered against a midships line on the outer ring), and just me and my wife with a heavy boat - and my wife having a bad leg so is not able to move fast. What we do getting in/out so shorthanded (and crippled!) may be useful for tide situations.

Before leaving we take our fore and aft dockside mooring lines, leaving them attached to the dock mooring rings (which are about 1m below our deck), and attach them together with a length of about 3/8 inch polyprop rope so that there is quite a bit of excess length and outside everything. I bring the midships going aft spring back to the aft cleat on the boat and release the aft line (which is now connected to the forward line) and hang it on the pile at the seaward end of the dock (alternatively one can have a stand to hang it on). I release the spring (now on the boats aft cleat) and throw that onto the dock at the same time my wife releases the bow line and throws that to the dock. I give a good blast back to get out of the berth before the wind has time to grab us and also get reverse steerage speed (I find I don't prop walk into the dock when alongside it???), then cutting power to get reverse steerage - almost always under windy conditions the bow will blow off the wrong way and if it does the boat will not back down the fairway - if the wrong way, I do a 180 in the fairway by rotating the boat on the spot with alot of power to give heavy propwalk and forward power against the rudder (leave the rudder fixed for the direction I want the bow to rotate in) which works even in quite strong wind as long as one has enough power to get the bow around into the wind (one will be in the fairway stern biased to the wind if the foregoing has happened) and one holds onto forward or reverse power enough to counter drift.

Coming in, I come in as fast as I dare (12 tonnes in cruise trim) but not stupid like, angled towards the dock as much as possible if the wind blows off (we do a 90 turn into the berth). I beforehand tell my wife where to stand to be closest to the outer pile as we run in (midships if no blowing off, further forward if being blown off). She catches the lines as previously hung on the outer pile as we go past (at this stage I am into reverse to stop) and she can usually do that by reaching but has the boathook ready. I knock way off and we both hand the polyprop line and the fore and aft lines connected to it and make fast - if wind is strongish that may not be very tidily and slightly panic stricken. On the very odd occasion my wife misses, I still have time to leap from the cockpit and have a go at it as the pile comes abreast of me. Never missed yet.

Best advice I had for a heavy boat is gently, gently when able, if too windy or current then short sharp bursts to get the boat to respond. I will really power up quite hard when prop walking the boat around, but never for long enough to get enough way on to be dangerous (ie have time to get to the fuel shutoff if jambed in reverse). Rotating the boat on the spot forces that approach rather than backwards and forwarding where you need to get way on for control, and risk drifting off with the current or wind onto other boats.

I am sure there is nothing new in any of the above for anyone, it is just the putting it together that counts. I know that in a current situation the boat will go with the current, whereas in wind with a fin keel keeping way on will stop alot of drift from the wind but I suspect if one cannot confdently get in along side with a good plan, then one should wait for slacker water. Having a plan and if turning to custard get out and go around before it gets to be custard. If you have good strong prop walk, set yourself up so you can use it to extract yourself - it will turn you virtually on the spot, as will a short sharp burst ahead onto to the rudder.

Sorry about the long post, but for myself, and I know for many others (even with alot of experience) the confines of a marina in difficult conditions is one of the most difficult and concerning part of sailing. I see many get boats, have a big problem in the marina and never go near the boat again. Frankly, I used to hate going into a marina berth, now I would much rather be doing something else but do find I don't get into trouble.

John

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[Twister_Ken]

Hoops is good

Stops your neighbour doing a round turn and 16 figures-of-eight on the cleat, thus putting it out of bounds for anyone else.

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[Twister_Ken]

Interesting post, thank you.

I suspect most people develop a good strategy(ies) for parking in their own berth in a variety of tide & wind conditions. For me the nerve-wracking bit is the first time in a new (to me) marina. Until you actually get a boat's length or so off the berth you don't know exactly what the tide's doing, how long the finger pontoon is, how much clearance you've got on the non-docking side, what sort of cleats you've got to hook onto, how many of them there are and where, whether they've already got other people's lines on, whether there's a water/electric box just where your bow is going to end up, even exactly how far down the aisle the pontoon is, etc.

Hence my usual strategy of going absolutely as slowly as possible, while still maintaining a measure of control, and keeping a big fender spare in the cockpit. And the knocks are less cataclysmic that way too!



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