Lifeline batteries

C

Captain_Cava

Active Member
Joined
11 May 2004
Messages
47
Visit site
An earlier post gave some useful information on 12v power.
Some forumites gave favourable mentions to Lifeline batteries.
I was thinking this was maybe the route to go, until I looked at their website.
It would seem you can travel the length and breadth of America and never be far from a stockist..........but in Europe you have a choice of Poole, or Romsey, or Taeby in Sweden.

If you fit out in the UK but then go to say the Med, where do you find replacements, or can you easily find other AGM batteries the same size and terminal configuration?

Alternatively, is it better to just go with bog standard lead acid batteries that are presumably availabe everywhere?
 
I have just gone the AGM route, like lifeline about the same price, you dont need to have lifeline, any good AGM will do!
 
If looked after they are claimed to last 10 years, so replacement might not be an issue for some time. Note also the the same batteries are also marketed under the SunXtender brand for use in renewables - often cheaper.

BTW - like most things, they much cheaper in the USA. I got four of the 8D size in the USA (but I was there already so didn't need to worry about carraige) for just over the price of one in the UK!!!
 
Yep, the states is much cheaper, $ for £ in most cases. But I wouldnt believe 10 years, not if you are a liveaboard! They tend to get hard worked.
 
Just remember you have to treat these very carfully they are electrolite starved and can't be topped up so if they ever get overcharged they are stuffed, they take longer to charge becase you have to restrict the voltage to prevent gassing, they have thinner plates more closely spaced to give the higer charge/discharge currents so more fragile. Otherwise the only difference between AGM and an equivelent wet cell is they are slightly smaller and 3 times the price!
 
A few myths there....

[ QUOTE ]
...they take longer to charge...

[/ QUOTE ]Actually, this is a myth! AGMs have a very high rate of charge acceptance, so they can be recharged quickly - although naturally the charge voltage has to be correctly limited.

[ QUOTE ]
...more fragile...

[/ QUOTE ]Another myth! AGMs are quite robust, and have high vibration resistance.

[ QUOTE ]
...3 times the price!

[/ QUOTE ]That's not true either. AGM batteries are now available at quite a small premium over similar quality flooded batteries.
 
What decided you on AGM and are you pleased with that decision so far?

I bought flooded lead acid (Varta, high quality) in Jan 2005 so hopefully have plenty of life left but, as you say, they have a hard life as liveaboard batteries. I am watching the market carefully so I know which way to jump when the time comes to replace, without having to do a lot of desk research.
 
I went with AGM, for their life (charge cycles), basically that was it, have had cheapo and not so cheapo wet? batteries, before, had a look around and decided to give these a go, I knock hell out of mine, a 420ah bank @ 24v, (I have a seperate 210ah @ 24v engine bank) run two fridges, a freezer on inverter, plus lights, pumps etc. etc. I have a 50 amp mains smart charger, 50 amp engine alternator, with smart charger, four 80watt solar panels (160watts @ 24v), so I try to keep my batteries up, and only ever discharge them 50% but even a good set of "wets" was lasting three/four years, before de-grading badly. I am at anchor for six months of the year, marina for the other six, on shore power. I am also now going to get one of those megapulse thingies, to see if that will help the life as well. Only fitted the new batteries last summer, so dont yet know how they are doing, havent fitted the megapulse thing yet, but if it helps, (its cheap enough) is worth it.
 
I have 560 Ah at 12V flooded Vartas (no engine bank but I have a generator battery that could be used to start the engine), 360W solar, 6kVA generator, 600W sine wave 230V inverter, 80A Mastervolt charger. Apart from the usual loads we have a 12V Spectra watermaker and make all our water in the summer with that - like you, we are 6 months in a winter marina berth and 6 months at anchor. So we are in a very similar situation other than being 12V.

Like you, I never discharge below 50% - and that is rare. What I don't do is draw high amps using the inverter for any time - if we need power the genny goes on. The inverter is only ever on high power for very short periods - five minutes max at 600W. It runs the laptop etc. all day but that is trivial power. So far I am on our first set of flooded Vartas and finger crossed.

With so much in common with you, maybe you won't be surprised to hear that my Megapulse is in the post from the UK as I write! I feel happier knowing that I can keep replacing water, especially in the heat here, and with lots of use which is why I chose top quality flooded. I would have gone for Trojans but my battery box really doesn't lend itself.
 
My freezer doesnt draw a lot to be honest, being an upright top loader, it doesnt lose much "cold" and stays shut most of the time. I will consider eventually getting a 24v water cooled system, with more insulation, but thats when I make more money!
Same solar panel capacity as myself, same current output anyway.

At the moment, the solars I have will run the boat all day and put a trickle in the batteries, but I normally need to run my genny for 2-3 hours every two days, I make water at the same time with an 80E watermaker, which I am thinking of replacing with a larger output one. (Water hungry guests!) Which is a lot better than before the solars. I'll see what these AGM's are like, one thing I do need to get, is a 24v solar regulator at least a 10 amp one.
I considered a wind charger, but dont feel the need for one, in the meddy.
 
I don't think that a wind charger would help us either, in the Med, in the summer. I can get a good 15A from my solar panels** and the Spectra provides 20l per hour on half power (40 on high). It is rated for 30/60 but maybe my membrane is a bit old, the instrument is not accurate, or whatever - I am happy. It draws 10A for 20l/h and 20A for 40l/h which is excellent as we can make 120 litres a day off the solar. We are very water-hungry. Obviously we don't leave taps running but we don't like to economise to the extent that we are inconvenienced. We watch people filling up with cans from a local tap, 30l per day, or whatever. That doesn't suit our way of life and, frankly, the cost of a watermaker is really not that expensive when you compare it with other budgeted items.

**The ratings of solar panels are at their terminal voltage, under ideal conditions when the panels are quite cool - around 30C which is impossible when there is enough sunshine and they are getting warm from current flow. I get 19A max from my 2 x 180W panels whereas I should get 360/13.3 = 27A What do you get from your panels, during the bulk charge phase?
 
Re: A few myths there.... - I should hae been more specific

...they take longer to charge...

True they have a higher acceptance rate so bulk charge is quicker but consiquently plate voltage rises faster and bulk phase finishes (to 14.4v) at around 75%. Equalisation however is limited to 14.4v instead of 14.7/8 so charge rate is then drasitcally down meaning equalisation to 100% takes ages - result long charge times or batteries sulphating due to incomplete charge. If you have alternative energy suystems able to complete equalisation as well as run the ship this could be used to reduce engine run times, but then if that was the case the batteries would not be discharged!

...more fragile...

I ment electrically not physically. Low electrolite volume + sealed system means if you get it wrong and loose electrolite through exess charging the battery is dead. with wet cells you just top it up. Likewise the close tollerances mean any plate buckling due to exess charge or discharge (big inverter?) is more likely to kill the cell but don't know if this is an issue in real life

...3 times the price!

just checked and you are right prices do seam to have come down drematically in the last 12 months which does make a significant difference

Don't get me wrong I don't think these are 'bad' batteries and for a boate used for weekends with shore power available during the week or indide a 'liveaboard' resident in a marina they may be the best choice. Just sounding a note of caution to piont out the limitations that may apply to long distance indipendent cruising.
 
Re: A few myths there.... - I should hae been more specific

[ QUOTE ]
..

True they have a higher acceptance rate so bulk charge is quicker but consiquently plate voltage rises faster and bulk phase finishes (to 14.4v) at around 75%. Equalisation however is limited to 14.4v instead of 14.7/8 so charge rate is then drasitcally down meaning equalisation to 100% takes ages - ...more fragile...


[/ QUOTE ]

This depends on battery manufacturer, Sqaudren batteries tell you not to use smart charging, the battery requires a constant voltage charge of from memory 14.7 volt. This requires no equalisation or float rate, the battery limiting charge current to that required.

Check charge requirement for the battery manufacture that you decide on, or find a battery that matches your current charging systems.

Brian
 
[ QUOTE ]
Sqaudren batteries tell you not to use smart charging,

[/ QUOTE ]
That sounds like an odd thing for a supplier to say. Surely it depends on the 'smart' charger? My Mastervolt can be adjusted to charge at different rates (though I don't think it would cope with a fixed 14.7 since you have to choose from a finite number of charging characteristics). My solar controller won't either.

It seems strange, as though a piece of the puzzle is missing.
 
They recommend you use a constant voltage charger for optimum charging for there batteries.
To me it sounds more like a firm making batteries to be charged from alternators, solar panels etc, ie fixed voltage, thus you need only a simple charger.

I have yet to look into all manufactures, it is part of some research into shall we go back into charger manufacture. But from what I am finding manufactures vary, so my point in check your battery manufactures requirement, don't make an assumption.

Brian
 
You should have checked the facts...

You should have checked the facts! AGM batteries have lower internal resistance and so can take big charging currents during the absorption phase (that's the proper name for what you called "equalisation"; equalisation is something else). They're often specified for their rapid recharge characteristic. Take a look at this Lifeline AGM data sheet from Merlin.
 
I get approx 9-10 amps max, in bright sunshine. Have to be careful about shadow from rigging etc. 120 litres a day would be fine for us, I could use my washing machine with that much! That would save a bunch of money, laundrettes being expensive in Spain. When I do have to collect water, I have 10 20 litre containers, I fill the lot! any that dont go in the tanks, are lashed to the handrails. I dont like scrimping on water either. My 80e only does about 10 litres an hour, basically not enough. I would like a new type, more efficient and quieter. I saw one at the barcelona boat show, that was so quiet, you could have it under your pillow, 60l/hr output as well!
 
We do all our washing on board with our top-loader machine. I think the key thing for a watermaker is where the power comes from. If you have plenty of solar it is nice to be able to run it from dc. Also, there is one less thing to go wrong (generator) before your water supply is stopped! 60l per hour is excellent though I think it is best to run a watermaker every day and for several hours - ideally watermakers are run 24/24 to keep the membrane in good condition. Every other day gives a chance for marine life to grow.

Spectra sell some kind of electric marine life killer like one of those water conditioner things. 99/100 on my sceptical scale! Personally, when not being used for more than a day or so I flush with fresh water and change the pre-filter. I only use storage compound once a year, and would simply flush again with fresh if I wanted to extend the time between uses as the storage compound isn't ideal, either.

Do look at the Spectra and compare; mine was fitted by the PO so I didn't do any research, but I am happy and it is used a lot and the PO was very pleased with it on his circumnavigation.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

Top