Lifejackets

[longjohnsilver]

The MVII trip sounds like it was good fun, piccies show not at all rough, never give drink to BarryD it's obviously all wasted and shortage of lifejackets on board, Matts must have drawn the short straw as only one not wearing one. If lost at sea would the crew have eaten him first?

How many of us wear our lifejackets out at sea, I honestly can't think of an occasion when I've put mine on, I know I've got loads on board but only ever worn by brats on RIB. Does Dave Steward always wear his or just cos he was on Yank boat and expected it to fall apart;-)
How often do you wear yours, do you even know where they are and how to put them on. I find that they're a pain in the a##e, maybe I should wear them round mykneck and not my waist!

 

[Guest]

IM afraid to be guilty on this one, only wear it when Channel hopping, stupid really as I could drown in the marina.

 

[oldgit]

Out alone + bit cold.Always wear me Seasafe and its got a whistle.

 

[longjohnsilver]

Ah false sense of security!

If out alone and splash old git no longer on boat who's going to hear whistle. No ###### good at all!!!

 

[byron]

Guilty as charged, doubly guilty actually because I sail single handed. I do however have my lifejacket with my flare gun attached and 'grab bag' all in a convenient abandon ship position. I never go on deck at sea so it wouldn't be a case of falling overboard it would be a case abandon ship in which situation one always has a few moments to adjust one's dress before leaving as the toilet signs say.

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[longjohnsilver]

Always thought there was something not quite right about you Byron, do you always wear a dress at sea;-)

 

[Guest]

Re: Lifejackets, excuses

Guilty. Can't think of a v good reason. DaveS skipper sed put one on, so I sheepishly did at one point. It was handy all the time. m'lud. In the med, if you fly overboard, you're swimming. Mebbe 12 or 24 hours or never until it feels cold, unlike uk waters when you have 12 minutes or whatever.

However, I may be one of the few people hereabouts had a genuine man overboard. It doens't happen at sea in boat, slam bang bang or whatever. It happens when you move around a boat instead of sit of arse. So, on yacht no question, but better to clip on. But on powerboat, overboard happens in the marina, or on the way in fiddling with fenders, or off the pontoon when short person slips whilst running to sweet shop, or on the way out putting fenders away, or as setting off (qv mv2 daves thought I was on when wasn't probly nearest thing). Williamson turn no good now cos it's only 2 feet deep over there for about a mile or two. So now what?

IMHO there's no hard and fast rules - it depends on boat type and size, conditions, location, ability of swimmer and lots more. For our man overboard the skipper chap had got the boat around, me on swim platform stripping down and a few seconds short of going in for short person aged 8, but I reckon he could get back himself.

A real manoverboard isn't "solved" by a lifejacket any more than anyone in an airplane is "fine" so long as they have their seatbelt on. It might be the right thing, but might not be. First up to the emrgency exit will be the git who got his seatbelt off first, or never had it on. Those nice big yellow horseshoes things on back of boat - ever thrown one? I missed by miles lands in water and stays same distance away from person in a tide. You need about six to get one near.

I will be able to swim fast to get hold of people quickly with line around waist. But not so with lifejacket over bigjacket over fleece over shirt over vest. In fact, if I was thrown off, there wd have to be special circumstances in which I did n't want to get lifejacket (and jacket and fleece) off pretty pronto inorder to get near to boat and floatble stuff thereon. The falling unconcious is a good point, praps for others.

But imho fairly early on in manoverboard, somebody will have to go in to get somebody else. All kids get lifejacket and those who read (I think) mbm tests saw that 50% ish of them actually (when properly adjusted) held the occupant face down not rolled onto back. So who's gonna gettim? You with lifejacket on over jacket over fleece over etc, or me with rip openable jacket off already and line I brought with me? Get closish with boat, ladder down and engines off when near me on the way back.

And of course, in a disatster, lifejacket a nice selfish sort of thing too. Suppose we hole and all go over. Will I float face up thankyou very much I'm ok, or want to try and go over and help wife/kid/wotsit over there? Tough shit mate, I was told to put lifejacket on over bigjacket over fleece so now I have same flotation as nothing at all parked here 100yds away.

Know what? First thing in a man overboard? Tittering! yes! and then someone tels them to shut up and not be so stupid. It's Barry (or matt or dave or colin or someobody having a laugh! Oops and then then it isn't a laugh. That's the first minute gone.

Discuss, flame etc.

 

[petem]

Re: Lifejackets, excuses

Some valid points.

We make boy (5 yrs) wear his at all times. When going thru lock he's also harnessed to boat.

My wife and I tend to wear one only when the sea's rough or cold. At other time lifejackets are slung over seats ready to be put on.

We also kept a throw bag with floating line attached to the back of the boat.

I always reckon you've got more chance of being run over in the Solent than drowning!

Pete

 

[longjohnsilver]

Re: Lifejackets, excuses

Have already admitted my guilt with extenuating(!) circumstances, or bit of a whimpish excuse really, or actually a whole list of excuses.

Number one, as some of you may know I do a fair bit of diving, doesn't mean I won't drown but does mean I generally have a dry suit close at hand so if boat starts to sink or need to dive in to save someone I would hope to be dry , warm and very buoyant.

Number two is that I hate people telling me what I should do, bit of a bolshy bastard, and also feel a bit of a prat wearing lifejacket in front of others. All very stupid but can't really help that!

Number three is that I have two of those nice self inflating neat fold up comfy jobbies, two brats have cornered those leaving me with bright yellow bulky LJ which probably just as effective but well very bulky (and probably very mildewy). spose I should invest of more self inflating jobbies but too mean to do so and even if I did they would be hi-jacked by the brats.

Still have trump card in not only dry suit but also stab jacket (another form of buoyancy jacket designed for diving with huge amount of buoyancy). This reminds me of time when diving in March (bloody cold!) and surfaced and boat came towards me, boat handler dressed in his dry suit clambers on side to open canopyand falls in. Not a problem you may think, but dry suit open to his waist!! Laughed and laughed till I realised no one left on board and tender on davits blocking way of ladder!! Surprising what brute force and ignorance can achieve.

Rest of day spent in laundrette drying out very wet dry(?) suit and buddy!

Another time on mooring in Lyme Regis many years ago no 2 brat (about 5 years old at time) fell head first into water and all we saw was a pair of feet sticking up out of water (not deep or cold). Said feet ideal grabbing points and 2 brat hauled out complaining bitterly "it's orrible mummm, it's really orrible mummm" Became his catchphrase for years, but as Matt says more accidents in marinas / on moorings / in tenders too and from boat than anywhere else, just when we think we're safe.

Still don't intend to wear LJs but following the various comments will have them out and easily to hand when out at sea, but may wear them on the tender particularly at night, which usually means to or fro from pub.

 

[Guest]

Got in to the habit of wearing them at sea this summer (first trip in anger and all that) and last weekend on jfm's boat asked him where LJ's were. He said in cupboard somewhere and we only put 'em on when we sink. Felt a bit of a pillock for asking really, but then we didn't sink so didn't need 'em. Felt a bit naked without though. Held on to grab handles much tighter than normal.

 

[longjohnsilver]

White knuckle ride.

So that's the meaning of a white knuckle ride is it;-)

 

[Guest]

Re: Lifejackets, origins, rant

Lifejackets originate from the days when you went overboard, and probably died. Nobody but nobody could swim - note that only early mid-1800s a chap decided to go swimming in the med, off the cote d'azure and everybody gathered around to see the loony.

Lifejackets also joly useful when you are On Your Own. They extend the amount of time that you can last. But not by much.

LJ's also for when disabled either as smal person who can't swim, or injured when falling in. More likely on a yacht.

The safe things include ...

1. stay in the cockpit, clipped on esp if alone

2. test for kids to wander up forward on big boat is to droppem over the side, and see if they can can back round to swim ladder

3. Don't drive over legs. People in water near dinghy/powerboat = engine off.

4. Have a massive variety of safety thingys. Floaty lines. Chuckables like yellow horseshoe things. More lines. Goggles to see underwater close at hand. Try making "monkey fist" on and of long floaty line and throwing 50 yds . Wherever you are, imagine disaster right now imho.

5. Practise. Drive around after that fender, abandon driving to wife/hubbie - you're overboard remember? Yeah- Tie a line on, jump in see how long it takes to get back, improve on that, No, not in midwinter, but summer if UK but still a bit of a shock to find how heavy all that clothing actually is and not the same as pyjamas in the swimming pool. Chuck cushions in, see if they float. Radio check ok -but with waterproof radio, sit on the back and call at water level after swiftly dunking it in the water, and the vhf is attached to you, yeah? Tried that fire extinguisher?- I tried a brand new one supplied with new boat after realising that none of crew ever seen a fire extinguisher work - and it didn't. Got a long line?-you need one for a tow mebbe twice the length of the boat. How about a special 150foot floaty line- stilll not long enuf for someone who has falen off into a 2knot tide a minute ago. Ooer

6. Advanced stuff. Your kid goes in and captain helpful over there motors over to him unaware of leg-chooping powers at rear of boat: ensure everyone knows hand up drill, lying on top of water drill. Big big air horn in youir boat not a bad idea to tell others to F Off not parpy ello matey 12v job. And so on.

here endeth the rant, sorry. unless ...Anybody else got any useful stuff from boaty courses that ISN'T celestial navigation, secondary port calcs, plotting yet another course with a pencil around bramble bank, allowing for magnetic deviation on a course two miles long or rescuing a knackered fender after driving over it five times?

 

[BarryD]

For the moment every time I go out, I'm also a good swimmer but until I get to know the boat I don't want to bump my head. Short person will wear his whenever we are underway or he leaves the cockpit until he can take the Matts patened swim test. SWMBO will wear hers when climbing around the decks to apologise to whoever I've just hit.

All will wear in dinghy. LJs available for non / weak swimmers otherwise if you don't want to wear one then you don't have to. My boat my rules, your boat your rules.

Nuffink to see here, move along please...

 

[oldgit]

Can whistle theme from crap Titanic movie then realise life is not worth living on planet that likes rubbish tunes etc etc

 

[Scubadoo]

It depends, if the sea conditions looks bad we both will wear LJs. In winter and going outside the cockpit again wear a LJ but only me. So basically it depends on conditions, however I do hate wearing them just not comfortable. The biggest concern is when you are knocked out!

LongJohn as you mentioned, when diving we have our dive gear which I feel is safer than any standard boating gear. You are either wearing a wetsuit or a drysuit so will last longer in the water, Stab jacket which inflates when required, have my own flares in a pcoket, whistle and a SMB and even a strob light.

I do feel however Matts should have been wearing a LJ in the conditions they descride.

PS. I also know what you mean about thinking you look daft wearing a LJ - I think that is why you see less people wearing them and maybe why Matt didn't (or thought he was in the Med).

RM.

 

[Scubadoo]

Re: Lifejackets, excuses

Not the only one whose done a man overboard. I remember about 10years ago that I had to convince one of the crew member we were safe. Therefore I chucked my mate in the sea to do a demo, the crew member was convinced (or scared of the same treatment!).

RM.

 

[adarcy]

Re LJs

We are usually 3 adults and only bother w LJ when its bumpy/dark.
Certainly put em on when dingy fell off davits in Lyme bay at 0300 when it was blowing a 5 (officially nice 3 else why do you think we were there then)

But strongly suggest using inflatable LJs, lie nice and flat on jacket, can do most things without realising its on yet may just inflate and hopefully turn ones face up if if fall in and KO'd or vice versa

Anthony

 

[longjohnsilver]

Sad story

There's a place near Exmouth which runs its own rescue boat (RIB) and quite a few tears back someone decided it was a good idea to do a night time MOB exercise. They chucked a crew member in, couldn't find him again and he was picked up next morning by the Exmouth lifeboat dead!

Can't remember whether he was wearing a dry suit but think that this exercise took place in Winter!!

RNLI + chaps family were not impressed! Stupid and sad.