Kilnquay Falmouth - yacht with trashed genoa!

[KevO]

There's a yacht over on the Kilnquay moorings in Falmouth with a furling genoa that is torn and flapping. Boat has a white hull and coachroof and a thick dark blue stripe around the gunwhales. It looks to be in the vicinity of mooring 205D but that is a rough guess cos of distance and angle of viewing from the top of the high street.

If you have a boat of that description you might wanna have a look.

 

[KevO]

I've got a photo but am struggling to upload it from my phone... Pm me a mob no if you want to check if It's your boat.

 

[KevO]

Owner now aware.

 

[jwilson]

Someone on board the big Hallberg-Rassy now - with a very expensive new sail due to ordered. The one on the roller foil is in many ragged pieces.

Also "Serenade", a Macwester 27 off Greenbank has a genoa unrolled and flogging though still more or less intact. If you know who the owner is please tell him......

 

[KevO]

Someone on board the big Hallberg-Rassy now - with a very expensive new sail due to ordered. The one on the roller foil is in many ragged pieces.

Also "Serenade", a Macwester 27 offGreenbank has a genoa unrolled and flogging though still more or less intact. If you know who the owner is please tell him......

I've even tried to contact the owner through the macwester owners association but they have no details for serenade. The Genoa is still in one piece at the mo but I doubt it will last the night in these conditions.

 

[sailorman]

Why o why do owners not furl the sheets around the sail & or add a sail tie to the furled sail. especially as not covered by insurance when "not set"

 

[nimbusgb]

Why don't owners of boats on open moorings not just hang a sign with a mobile phone number on a rail?

I'd be happy to make a call to the owner of a boat in need of attention.

 

[onesea]

Why o why do owners not furl the sheets around the sail & or add a sail tie to the furled sail. especially as not covered by insurance when "not set"

I secured my roller headsail in a cam cleat for ease of use, then always used to tie an knot in my reefing line to double secure when leaving the boat...

An escaped headsail does seem to be a frequent occurance.

 

[savageseadog]

I secured my roller headsail in a cam cleat for ease of use, then always used to tie an knot in my reefing line to double secure when leaving the boat...

An escaped headsail does seem to be a frequent occurance.

People will say it can't happen when you tell them.

 

[john_morris_uk]

Without knowing the circumstances of the boats mentioned, its worth making the general point that its much safer to furl a genoa ending with a few turns of the sheets round the furled sail.

Some people seem to think it 'looks neater' and acceptable to stop furling when the clew of the sail is left protruding a few inches or when its 'just' rolled onto the foil.

If you leave a corner showing a strong wind WILL eventually get under it and the consequences are often catastrophic. My understanding is that insurance companies take a dim view and describe a sail furled in this way as not secured properly and therefore uninsured. So IMHO never mind the neatness - keep furling until there are a few turns of the sheets round the furled sail.

PS I would consider adding a sail tie as well when leaving the boat, but the clew of our genoa is about 12 feet off the deck when its furled so no chance...

 

[onesea]

Without knowing the circumstances of the boats mentioned, its worth making the general point that its much safer to furl a genoa ending with a few turns of the sheets round the furled sail.

Some people seem to think it 'looks neater' and acceptable to stop furling when the clew of the sail is left protruding a few inches or when its 'just' rolled onto the foil.

If you leave a corner showing a strong wind WILL eventually get under it and the consequences are often catastrophic. My understanding is that insurance companies take a dim view and describe a sail furled in this way as not secured properly and therefore uninsured. So IMHO never mind the neatness - keep furling until there are a few turns of the sheets round the furled sail.

PS I would consider adding a sail tie as well when leaving the boat, but the clew of our genoa is about 12 feet off the deck when its furled so no chance...

Ooooh I could argue here, I am in the neat camp BUT I double secure my jib sheets with tension and reefing line so there can only be 2 - 3" out, if the sail does start working loose hopefully the last 6" of clew will come out and not flog significantly, if it does it will just tighten the rolls above ...

IMHO What really causes this to happen is loosely rolled sails (I know better for sail) and sail ties around clue. Many of the ones I have seen loose started halfway up the leach where its a bit loose and the wind has managed to get under a loosely (or badly)rolled sail... Or people who leave sail tie on and remove jib sheets, to me it is inevitable given long enough it will unroll...

If the sail is securely rolled and sheets securely fastened the sail tie IMHO is a waste of time, by the time the sail has got that loose its already in self-destruct mode...
Each to there own...

I might as well dip out of this I am back without roller furling headsails....

 

[john_morris_uk]

Ooooh I could argue here, I am in the neat camp BUT I double secure my jib sheets with tension and reefing line so there can only be 2 - 3" out, if the sail does start working loose hopefully the last 6" of clew will come out and not flog significantly, if it does it will just tighten the rolls above ...

I think you've argued against yourself. What's the point of your 'neatness' if you admit that the corner can flog albeit you hope 'not significantly'. A couple of extra turns and there's not flogging or possibility of flogging at all.

I agree that one needs to ensure the sail is furled tightly.

I've seen too many sails furled in the manner you use work free and self destruct so we will have to disagree.

 

[Alfie168]

Some of us use a sock to protect the sail. It works.

Tim

 

[fireball]

I agree that one needs to ensure the sail is furled tightly.

And the best way to get the sail furled tightly is to have some load in it whilst furling, that makes it harder to furl - so you could always use a winch to put it away ....
<runs for cover>

 

[john_morris_uk]

And the best way to get the sail furled tightly is to have some load in it whilst furling, that makes it harder to furl - so you could always use a winch to put it away ....
<runs for cover>

I agree; I asked my helper to give me a hand to restow the genoa after our first effort to roll it up when we had bent the sail on failed. He held a little tension on the genoa sheet while I pulled in the reefing line. The result is one very tidily rolled away sail.

I am acutely aware that one cleat separates my genoa from being shredded in the next gale and have some sympathy for those whose sails have been wrecked in Falmouth.

 

[Giblets]

Some of us still have hanked-on headsails!

 

[NPMR]

And the best way to get the sail furled tightly is to have some load in it whilst furling, that makes it harder to furl - so you could always use a winch to put it away ....
<runs for cover>

Thr rolled sail may be quite tight when you have finished rolling but what happens when you put a bit of slack in the luff, so as to not leave the sail under tension when you're not using it? This gives the sail a bit of slack in the upper part where the wind can get in, even if you've rolled the sheets around the sail and have the roller under tension.

our boat is very close to the HR that started this thread, but we seem to have come through unscathed. But it made me wonder.

 

[Seajet]

Some of us still have hanked-on headsails!

No need for the frowny face Giblets,

we get all the - ' Hairy arsed real sailor salt encrusted fun ' of changing much more efficient headsails and they don't blow free on the mooring !

On a less happy note this has happened to a mutual friend leaving him with a big price tag, I still don't understand it as we haven't had severe gales and we put ties around the sail.

Andy

 

[onesea]

I think you've argued against yourself. What's the point of your 'neatness' if you admit that the corner can flog albeit you hope 'not significantly'. A couple of extra turns and there's not flogging or possibility of flogging at all.

I agree that one needs to ensure the sail is furled tightly.

I've seen too many sails furled in the manner you use work free and self destruct so we will have to disagree.

You did not understand:
1) Firstly if sail stowed tight and proper the sail should never flog.
2) If the jib has a few inches of sail showing it will most likely TIGHTEN the roll..
3) If the sheets are wrapped round the sail (or worse a sail tie is the only securing) if the wind gets under the leach it is only going to get worse.

Take it to the extreme if the sail was set with deep reef there is no way the wind would get under the leach to loosen it, unless something fails and sail pays out...

The whole argument is irrelevant if the sail is stowed and secured correctly, it will not matter sheets round or not.

 

[john_morris_uk]

You did not understand:
1) Firstly if sail stowed tight and proper the sail should never flog.
2) If the jib has a few inches of sail showing it will most likely TIGHTEN the roll..
3) If the sheets are wrapped round the sail (or worse a sail tie is the only securing) if the wind gets under the leach it is only going to get worse.

Take it to the extreme if the sail was set with deep reef there is no way the wind would get under the leach to loosen it, unless something fails and sail pays out...

The whole argument is irrelevant if the sail is stowed and secured correctly, it will not matter sheets round or not.

But all you've done is describe how a well rolled sail shouldn't break free and flog and destroy itself...

So stow the sail just as you describe. Now explain any disadvantages of putting a few turns of the sheets round the rolled up sail? It's belt and braces; especially as when people are distracted or in a hurry they might not always get the rolls exactly right?

The only thing against putting a few rolls of sheet round the furled sail is that it seems to offend people sensibilities of what looks neat. IMHO it's a sensible and seamanlike thing to do.