Is there a Pageant owner with a tape measure out there?

dylanwinter

dylanwinter

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www.keepturningleft.co.uk
as luck would have it two Westerly Pageants have entered the frame of the big seek

is there anyone out there who owns one which is ashore and are prepared to take some measurements for me

four crucial distances I am after

centre of prop to cockpit floor

hull skin to cockpit floor

water level to cockpit floot

and

and end of the prop shaft housing to the leading edge of the rudder

Dylan
 
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Going down to "GANT" tomorrow Dylan. Will measure up for you.

As a guess so far I'd say...

1) 700 mm
2) Hull skin to what point of cockpit floor???
3) 250 mm
4) 380 mm (leading edge)

Those are both approximate until I can get a measure across them in the morning.

Difference between Centaur and Pageant? add 3 or 4 inches to every measurement and you won't go far wrong. That said I believe the cockpits are pretty similar as the Centaur claimed its bigger measurements from the cabin f'wrd.

Don't quote me on any of the above.
 
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Pageant would be easier to mutilate, no doubt about that. The shell is at a guess, less than 1/4 as thick the Centaur, and almost transparent. Forward berth is designed for one and a half slender midgets. The rest of the berths are perfect for very tiny children. Apart from that, about the same headroom as the Centaur. I like it.
 
I think you'll find that the shell is not much less than the Centaur - possibly thicker, both Lloyds. Remember, the centaur needed the reinforcement.
As for berth size - most satisfactory for four adults - as long as they're not lanky gits - in which case stick them in the dinghy over the stern.
 
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elton said:
Pageant would be easier to mutilate, no doubt about that. The shell is at a guess, less than 1/4 as thick the Centaur, and almost transparent. Forward berth is designed for one and a half slender midgets. The rest of the berths are perfect for very tiny children. Apart from that, about the same headroom as the Centaur. I like it.
Click to expand...

cutting a hole in GRP, no matter how thick it is, is not much of a problem

creating a structure that is properly braced and attached to the existing hull is more of a challenge

and I assume that a Pageant has poorer access to the spaces between the hull and the cockpit floor

I am still hoping for a centaur



one of the Pageants is in Ireland (with all the logistical problems that entails) and the other near Chichester Harbour - they came to me rather than me seeking them out.

dylan.winter@virgin.net
 
ganter said:
I think you'll find that the shell is not much less than the Centaur - possibly thicker, both Lloyds. Remember, the centaur needed the reinforcement.
As for berth size - most satisfactory for four adults - as long as they're not lanky gits - in which case stick them in the dinghy over the stern.
Click to expand...
No way is it anywhere near as thick as the Centaur.

I'm only 6'1 and lean, and struggle to get into the forward bunk. The heads cubicle intrudes into the forward cabin on the starboard side, making the girlfriend's, space even shorter. Centaur space is luxurious in comparison. I tried to sleep in one of the rear bunks. Impossible.
 
elton said:
No way is it anywhere near as thick as the Centaur.

I'm only 6'1 and lean, and struggle to get into the forward bunk. The heads cubicle intrudes into the forward cabin on the starboard side, making the girlfriend's, space even shorter. Centaur space is luxurious in comparison. I tried to sleep in one of the rear bunks. Impossible.
Click to expand...


Hmm

I am six foot and my son is 6 foot 3

the women are short though

D
 
dylanwinter said:
cutting a hole in GRP, no matter how thick it is, is not much of a problem

creating a structure that is properly braced and attached to the existing hull is more of a challenge

and I assume that a Pageant has poorer access to the spaces between the hull and the cockpit floor

I am still hoping for a centaur

dylan.winter@virgin.net

one of the Pageants is in Ireland (with all the logistical problems that entails) and the other near Chichester Harbour - they came to me rather than me seeking them out.
Click to expand...

Dylan, the difference between a Pageant and a Centaur is really very minimal. They have the same cockpit floor - with hatch - and the 2.8" length difference is negligible when comparing general dimensions, lay-up, access, controls, etc.
Some say the Pageant is the smaller but better built forerunner of the Centaur. I agree with that and I've sailed both.

To be frank, your plan to gouge a wapping great hole in either is a bit daft and not really very sensible for reasons outlined on this forum and others - neoprene gaiter or not.
Any kind of heavy sea and you're going to be swamped - really quite extraordinarily quickly - however clear you keep the cockpit drains.

If you want to put an outboard on it do what everyone else does and hang it over the transom. I can't see the point of your proposed butchery other than to try and lamely convince others passing to starboard that you have an inboard.

Both boats have relatively tiny cockpits anyway with precious little room to move about - add kids into the equation, booms, travellers and winch positions and the rest and you've really not got a very pleasant sail on your hands. And that's defeating the object as far as I can see.

However, I'll get you your measurements tomorrow. Get the chain sharpened on the chainsaw :-)
 
I know a Pageant in need of a good home; there is some conjecture as to whether her inboard is a goer or not.

However I think the sum £3,500 has been mentioned, she's said to be very good nick down below so probably too posh, albeit left ashore for a few years - she looks fine externally.

Another Pageant at my club was P No.1 ' LGEE ' ( Laurent Giles ) owned for decades by a late colleague, Dennis Warren, an aircraft designer involved with some famous projects and a rather good engineer so he wouldn't have just tolerated anything not to standards; the boat never gave any trouble I ever heard of, but she's on at least her 3rd BMW engine.

A very experienced sailor I know had a Pageant for years, when his kids grew he looked at a Centaur but thought it ' just the same with a bigger forepeak ' so didn't think it a worthwhile step ( they ended up with a Seal 28 and took that many thousands of miles ).
 
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All right, as other Westerlies are in the frame, how about a Windrush? They have that nifty docking outboard arrangement. A roomy 25 footer that is designed for an outboard. The smaller versions, Nomad and 21 have a single cabin layout so might be roomy enough but a bit lacking in privacy.

Cheap as chips and nice looking. Well I like them, but I like my gaffer!

Food for thought?
 
Sophie19 said:
All right, as other Westerlies are in the frame, how about a Windrush? They have that nifty docking outboard arrangement. A roomy 25 footer that is designed for an outboard. The smaller versions, Nomad and 21 have a single cabin layout so might be roomy enough but a bit lacking in privacy.

Cheap as chips and nice looking. Well I like them, but I like my gaffer!

Food for thought?
Click to expand...

headroom

D
 
ganter said:
Dylan, the difference between a Pageant and a Centaur is really very minimal. They have the same cockpit floor - with hatch - and the 2.8" length difference is negligible when comparing general dimensions, lay-up, access, controls, etc.
Some say the Pageant is the smaller but better built forerunner of the Centaur. I agree with that and I've sailed both.

To be frank, your plan to gouge a wapping great hole in either is a bit daft and not really very sensible for reasons outlined on this forum and others - neoprene gaiter or not.
Any kind of heavy sea and you're going to be swamped - really quite extraordinarily quickly - however clear you keep the cockpit drains.

If you want to put an outboard on it do what everyone else does and hang it over the transom. I can't see the point of your proposed butchery other than to try and lamely convince others passing to starboard that you have an inboard.

Both boats have relatively tiny cockpits anyway with precious little room to move about - add kids into the equation, booms, travellers and winch positions and the rest and you've really not got a very pleasant sail on your hands. And that's defeating the object as far as I can see.

However, I'll get you your measurements tomorrow. Get the chain sharpened on the chainsaw :-)
Click to expand...
The Centaur (1969) is actually the forerunner to the Pageant (1970). I've owned both, and I only have to spend one night aboard the Pageant to notice the smaller space. There's really no comparison. The Centaur has sufficient, the Pageant doesn't. Nevertheless, the Pageant is a nice boat.

I wonder whether the lighter hull of my Pageant is because it was built several years later than my Centaur, and a victim of the oil crisis and all that entailed.
 
The standing headroom in a Windrush is just where it's needed and nowhere else. Under the hatch and the raised bit that the hatch slides forward onto when it's open.
There is headroom at the cooker and sink but not in the head or forecabin.
 
Dylan you keep saying that you are concerned about an inboard engine being a magnet for lobster pots...however I was reading somewhere the other day about someone with a well who dropped sheets etc down it, causing the same issue...
 
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