Is the CapeHorn windvane really better downwind thanthe Monitor/Aries/etc ?

[Boo2]

Hi,

Q.A.T. : According to the manufacturers' website the CapeHorn windvane excels downwind and is better in this regard than the others on the market. Can anyone here tell me from their own personal experience whether this is true or not ?

I'm specifically looking for answers to this question rather than general recommendations for windvanes.

Thanks,

Boo2

 

[Tradewinds]

Judging by the feedback on the website, which is mostly N American (Canadian) you might get better answers on the Cruisers Forum.

I have his DVD Jean-du-Sud around the World which is OK-ish.

Other than that I can't be of much assistance as I never seen one or know of anyone this side of the Atlantic with one.

A pretty useless response

Sorry

 

[KellysEye]

I've never heard of one or seen one, if what they claim is true it would be well known and a best seller. The great majority of boats we've seen with windvanes have Hydrovanes with Aries a distant second. Having sailed downwind in 50 knots, big seas and a 14 foot swell with a Hydrovane and no problems I find it difficult believe any other vane could be better.

 

[Tradewinds]

I've never heard of one or seen one, if what they claim is true it would be well known and a best seller. The great majority of boats we've seen with windvanes have Hydrovanes with Aries a distant second. Having sailed downwind in 50 knots, big seas and a 14 foot swell with a Hydrovane and no problems I find it difficult believe any other vane could be better.

I'm with you on that - very satisfied with my Hydrovane.

 

[TiggerToo]

looks complicated compared to others I have seen.

 

[macd]

looks complicated compared to others I have seen.

Not at all. In essence the Cape Horn is a fairly conventional horizontal axis servo-pendulum system which isn't complicated at all. There are two basic models: one broadly similar to such as Windpilot; the other using a linkage through the transom to work directly on the steering quadrant, thus avoiding lines in the cockpit and rendering it more suitable for centre cockpit boats.

They're made in Canada so tend not to be seen so often in Europe.

 

[sailor211]

It does not appear to do anything that my monitor does not do, and nothing that is claimed is better my monitor on a 6 tonne 34' boat in winds from 0 to 60 kts

 

[fishermantwo]

I've never heard of one or seen one, if what they claim is true it would be well known and a best seller. The great majority of boats we've seen with windvanes have Hydrovanes with Aries a distant second. Having sailed downwind in 50 knots, big seas and a 14 foot swell with a Hydrovane and no problems I find it difficult believe any other vane could be better.

Any of the horizontal/servo assist vanes as well as a Hydrovane will steer well downwind in fresh conditions. Its when the relative wind is below 5 knots quality shows.

The Cape horn is similar to many other servo units. If you check the angles of the vane and ratios its similar to all the other popular units. Just build your own or buy local.

 

[Pleiades]

Capehorn Wind vane

Had a Cape Horn on Pleiades. Quite exquisitely designed and an ingenious device, beautifully engineered. Most home made windvanes in my opinion look rubbish and just like many Aries vanes they are often not actually connected up and in use. The Cape Horn looked smart, was quite light and swung nicely up out of the water when not in use , which was most of the time sadly because wonderful piece of engineering as it was it didn't actually work, or at least I couldn't get it to do what it said on the tin on my vessel despite much perseverance ........ easily the most sworn-at piece of kit onboard. Swapped it for a Hydrovane which was vastly better in every way and is the best bit of marine engineering on the market imho. Have not used an Aries or a Monitor so can't say how they would have compared on my boat.
Robin
Pleiades of Birdham
MXWQ5

 

[KellysEye]

>Its when the relative wind is below 5 knots quality shows.

I'm not convinced any windvane will work below 5 knots the sail and rudder areas are not big enough. If you have experience of one that does I'd like to know what it is.

As Pleiades said about Hydrovanes 'best bit of marine engineering on the market imho' but they don't work at five knots.

 

[Georgio]

Regarding the original question I think that's called "marketing".

As others have said the Hydrovane is a great bit of kit but struggles in light air (in my experience).

I have a WindPilot pacific that is excellent and steered down to about 3-4kts apparent, I think asking for it to helm below that is unrealistic especially as the apparent wind direction moves so much at these low wind speeds. Dropping the spray-hood helps in these conditions to promote air flow at deck level.

My Windpilot steers for approx. 3000 miles this year in everything from F1-F8 on all points of sail including reaching under spinnaker in 25kts although the boat was quite unbalanced so asking quite a lot.

Hope this helps

 

[panthablue]

I think for dead downwind sailing with a windvane the effectiveness is dependant on the boat displacement. A heavier boat will sail slower, making the relative wind speed higher, making the windvane more effective. For light weight racing boats - not a chance.

The only real guaranteed method that I have seen is the with twin genoas, both poled out either side of the boat. Their sheets are each fed back to the cockpit, round a block, and then tied on to the tiller. For a wheel you could probably attach them to the lower half of the wheel.

I have also heard of the same thing done with a spinnaker instead of twin jibs, again poled out both sides.

The main is not used in both set ups.

 

[fishermantwo]

>Its when the relative wind is below 5 knots quality shows.

I'm not convinced any windvane will work below 5 knots the sail and rudder areas are not big enough. If you have experience of one that does I'd like to know what it is.

As Pleiades said about Hydrovanes 'best bit of marine engineering on the market imho' but they don't work at five knots.

My home built version of a Walt Murray design in Stainless steel will sail downwind with 5 knots across the stern. Upwind it will steer with less. Sailing the day before yesterday solo and on the way home the breeze was about 10 knots, I was broad reaching with about 5 knots relative over the stern quarter. Vane steering, went forward and rigged the cruising chute. Deployed it with a massive wine glass, spent a few minutes in the pulpit sorting it. Watched the vane handle the variations in sail trim as I rooted about sorting out the spinnaker.
Most servo pendulum units use similar ratios. Oar sizes are usually about 1m x 125cm. Windvane 800cm x 200cm. My unit weighs about 12kg.

Windvane forum here. I'm Ramona on this one.

http://www.cruisenews.net/forum/viewforum.php?f=62

Early version of mine;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U66-R0i2c20

 

[Conachair]

>Its when the relative wind is below 5 knots quality shows.

I'm not convinced any windvane will work below 5 knots the sail and rudder areas are not big enough. If you have experience of one that does I'd like to know what it is.

My aries will keep a course dead downwind when i can barely feel any apparent wind at all, though to be fair to long keel and sail balance must help a fair bit. White mans magic, it never ceases to amaze - how can it do that???
It will flop about from side to side with the boat wandering off course but over a few hours it averages out. Another thing I've found is that it will take a few days to really loosen up, light airs I loosen off the control lines as well to get rid of as much friction as poss. And of course sail balance is essential.

 

[Blueboatman]

To make a Hydrovane work in 5kn or less, home build an alloy tubular frame over which you fit a nylon ( ex spinnaker material for ex) sock. Make it as big as you like.
If clever, you will extend one arm down below the pivot and fit sliding lead weights( one above one below) to oerfect the balance.

I have owned Hydro and Monitor, both v good indeed

Also built a wee copy of a Mustafa/with Plastimo type tab and lifting/trip mechanismthat outperformed em both in lightest airs on a wee boat and one transatlantic. But that is another thread drift and in realityt it took many hours to perfect.
Cap Horn should be the dogs wotsits, tho as originally developed and fitted to an Arlberg design with a long keel, most vanes would perform well.
IIRC the designer wanted discrete elegant engineering. No solar array/radar arches/bolt or clunky servopendulum vanes for him!

 

[Daydream believer]

My aeries lift up does not work with the wind aft of the mast unless it is blowing 15-20 kts at least & then it sails a violent "S" course & I risk serious gybes from any broad reach. Sails great up wind though. Better than I can most of the time.

 

[LittleSister]

Capehorn Wind vane

Had a Cape Horn on Pleiades. Quite exquisitely designed and an ingenious device, beautifully engineered. Most home made windvanes in my opinion look rubbish and just like many Aries vanes they are often not actually connected up and in use. The Cape Horn looked smart, was quite light and swung nicely up out of the water when not in use , which was most of the time sadly because wonderful piece of engineering as it was it didn't actually work, or at least I couldn't get it to do what it said on the tin on my vessel despite much perseverance ........ easily the most sworn-at piece of kit onboard. Swapped it for a Hydrovane which was vastly better in every way and is the best bit of marine engineering on the market imho. Have not used an Aries or a Monitor so can't say how they would have compared on my boat.
Robin
Pleiades of Birdham
MXWQ5

I saw one on display at the Earls Court Boat Show years ago, and I was very impressed by the quality and beauty of the design and construction. In those regards the competition all look positively agricultural.

I'm disappointed to hear you couldn't make it work for you.

Now I might have to look elsewhere if I ever come up on the pools!

 

[mattonthesea]

My only experience of Cape horn is from Sailing UMA. I can't see any practical advantage over my three year old Aries. What's arguably better is the aesthetic; little metal work on the stern. Mine is a lot easier to install/attach!

 

[PTB]

10 year old thread .. but interesting as I cant think of much change in windvane gear since then so still relevant

 

[Tradewinds]

Christian Williams had little niggles with his CH unit. Installation or bad design? Would put me off buying one.
Starts from this point in video but I might have missed an earlier problem he had - anyhow, the problem crops up twice.

Install video here