Is self build worthwhile?

ukdiving

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There is very little coverage today in the mags on building your own boat and one could be forgiven for believing it has gone out of fashion. Self build used to be a very common way in to boat ownership but is it so today?

Being in my 50's I have always hankered to have a go and am sure I would find it a satisfying experience but would the end result (assuming I made a good job!) be saleable? How do self builds stand for re sale price compared to the cost of materials? How does cost of build compare to say a relatively new pre-owned factory produced vessel of same size?

I guess the real question is does self build make financial sense? or (apart from the satisfaction) is it a financial lemon and simply better to look in the used columns?

I appreciate that figures and comparisons are going to depend on many variables but I would appreciate any comments form those with experience.

I have been looking at the Selway Fisher plans for the Ailsa 22, a wooden 22 foot trailer sailer. Has anyone experience of building this? Does anyone know what the finished result is like to use?

Any feedback appreciated.
 

BrendanS

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If you want the satisfaction of a job well done, then yes, go for it.

If you want to be able to sell the boat on at a later date for a fraction of the price it cost you to build? Don't do it. Self build boats rarely sell for their worth.
 

tcm

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entirely correct. Self builds are avoided like plagues.

The exception (begins to cry) is sparky, much lamented selfbuild that torched itself on maiden voyage last year, far better built than any production boat....
 

William_H

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Now there is a funny story. I wrote a speel on this subject only to be advised the post had been deleted Come back later there are 2 more replies.
So will try again somewhat abreviated. By old (up to 30 yo) AWB T/S in F/G They are easily restored with a lot of pleasure in doiing so and you may increase the resail value. It might not be your kind of boat. Only build from scratch if you are driven to it for your own pleasure.
Have a look at http:// au.msnusers.com/CASTLE650GROUP for details of my T/S which I think is ideal and I have had for 23 years it still knocks the socks off most fin keel boats up to 25 ft in racing.
you might also get some pleasure from another Oz site
http://groups.msn.com/TrailerSailerPlace
I think 22 ft T/s is a great kind of boat. good luck olewill
 

capt_courageous

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When we started sailing self build was certainly an option. Often using builders 'kit' boats.We looked at fitting out such a grp hull. Doing the sums it would have cost more to do it ourselves than to buy the boat fully fitted out by the manufacturer. I guessed it was because they could buy masts etc. at trade price but we were paying retail. Also self builders have a tendency to go for cheaper and usually smaller options for winches, cleats etc. Their woodwork and finishing is usually very poor. They get it from B&Q when they discover the cost of a bit of teak or decent faced plywood.
Nowadays selling a good boat is hard work. Most people would not even look at a self build job. Times have changed so don't do it.
 

doca

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Out of economic necessity I built a plywood 21 foot van de Stadt from scratch over four years, took about 2 more years to fit it out fully, using it as a motor boat initially. I bought a larger grp boat eventually and tried to sell the 21 footer without success. In hindsight I would not do it all over again. I should probably have worked longer hours (instead of using the same time boatbuilding) to raise the money to buy a grp boat. If you want an interesting long term woodwork project with economic and technical uncertainty, do it,....... if you want to go sailing just don't do it.
 

MarkJohnson12345

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Depends on what you want out of a boat.

There are those who own a boat to either build it of fix it. And those who own a boat for a hotel in the marina. The rest of us own one to sail.

A friend of mine used to build his boat, and after a couple of seasons would sell it and start another. i think he 'did ' this three or four times.

Either way it keeps you off the streets....

Enjoy your poison

regards

/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 

asj1

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In my view not worthwhile both in terms of finance and time. Do you want to go sailing or spend two years building a boat on which you immediately lose money.
If you want the satisfaction of doing the work then buy an older glassfibre boat ( say 20-25 y.o.)from a well recognised class and spend the time re-fitting it, you will then end up with a good strong boat, head and shoulders above ones of a similiar age or younger and you might not lose too much money doing it. Avoid older wooden boats like the plague unless this is to be your full time job !!
 

H4B

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Re: Is self build worthwhile? re asj1

Entirely agree with asj1, plenty of old ( proven) boats around in need of a new owner. Refitting an old one will give you plenty of satisfaction and a lot of experience.It will also take far longer and be more expensive than you thought, but you will have a recognized and hopefully respected yacht that you can sell if needs must. Remeber that our sport/ pastime is highly addictive , common sense ,logic and financial prudence are often sacrificed for it.
 

graham

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Re: Financially Bad Idea

I have built a few small trailersailers over the years.

Dont underestimate either the time or the financial cost. You cant recover either at the end of it.

I would do a rough guess that you would spend roughly £10 000 to build a 22 footer and fit it out very basically. It would probably fetch less than half that on the secondhand market.

The market is awash with 22 footers in various states from pristine to dilapidated. Have you considered buying a sound boat with good hull sails rigging and engine but tatty home built interior? You then get all the expensive bits for less than £3000 to£4000 Spend a year and another £1000 to refit the interior.

you will have the satisfaction of completing the job and provided you started off with the right boat it would still be worth more than you have paid out. Best of Luck whatever you do ,
 

snowleopard

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having built 2 40 footers i gues i'm as qualified as any to answer this one.

if you are thinking of resale value, don't do it.

if you want a boat you couldn't afford ready-made, you'll find it will cost you a lot more than you imagine and more than the designer says, but it will still be a lot cheaper than a new one.

if you enjoy a major project and know you can devote all your spare time for several years, go for it. if you want a boat but don't enjoy serious DIY you'll probably give up part way through as so many do.

the re-sale value will be a lot lower than a professionally-built boat but it depends more than anything on the effort you are prepared to put in on finishing work. our latest boat took 3500 man-hours to build over 3 years. we compared it to a professionally finished boat of similar size which took over 7000 hours and the difference in standard of finish was huge. we could have spent 3 more years and the result would have been worth maybe 50% more but during those 3 years we would have been labouring in a boatyard car park rather than anchored off a caribbean beach.
 

gjeffery

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Don't forget, if you intend to sell the boat, you have either to wait for 5 years after launching, or you have to get the boat RCD classified. I believe that it is necessary 'de jure' to re-classify the boat if any material work is done on it - but personal experience of asking Trading Standards, is that they do not regard enforcement of the RCD as a priority, and they certainly resisted putting their advice in writing!
 

Swagman

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I found worked for me, but that was in Oz, and ten years ago, and Oz does not have the reguations that appear to exist over this side.

We elected to build a 10M class racing yacht.
Rented the female moulds and design rights to buiild - circa A$3,000.
Used farm building for lay-up - A$0.
Materials for glass over foam core to lay-up hull and deck circa A$5,000.
Labour for lay-up - one fibreglass expert for two weeks with self as labor in week one, self as forman week two (it is easy and he was pretty relaxed) circa A$2,000.
Carted hull/ deck loosely bolted together home to Perth on borrowed Betram Trailer, A$0.
Engine and associated prop etc , A$6,000.
Deck Hardware (some secondhand) circa A$5,000.
Spars circa A$8,000.
Sails circa A$9,000.
Keel (plug provided by designer) - circa A$3,000.
Stainless stock - A$1,000.
Stainless fabrication (everybit) - mates rates (£A0).
Instruments circa $A2,000.
Lift to sea - A$600.

It took me 13 months from start to finish - putting maybe every second weekend and 2 / 3 mights each week into the fit out.

Have to confess a lot of time was spent considering how to do something with a beer in one hand and a helpful mate distracting me with advice.

But a great experience - sailed it for 2 years - and sold it for $A90,000 - about double what my hard costs were.

Hope this helps
JOHN
 

Lakesailor

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[ QUOTE ]
simply better to look in the used columns?



[/ QUOTE ]

Your profile tells us nothing about you or your location.
So if you are near to yacht clubs and marinas, do a tour and find something on a notice board that you can <ul type="square"> [*]Negotiate on [*]Ask others about (assuming they are not "helping" the sale) [*]Try out in it's own environment [/list]
You can sometimes pick up a nice little boat this way, especially at the bottom end of the range, where brokers and advertising are out of proportion to the value.
You'll still have plenty of work to do, but you'll get on the water more quickly. Boats are very much like cars, a shabby one is a good bet to spruce up, a basket-case is a money-pit.
 

Birdseye

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Would you build a car? No you wouldnt because you could never make anything half as effective, half as well finished for remotely the same money. Same applies to boats. You might be able to make the hull but you could not compete on interior fit out, and a boat with a poor interior is difficult to sell.

All that ignores the time and heartache. I have yet to meet someone who has gone this route and would do so again.

So do it only if what you want is unavailable to buy. And if its available but too expensive, then you will usually find that its more practical to make up the gap by doing what you already have skills at / are good at.
 

snowleopard

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i have built two offshore boats. i have also built a car.

in all 3 case i got something i wouldn't have been able to afford by other means, the costs being around 1/3 of an equivalent bought ready to go. i didn't do it with any intention of reselling and would expect to do no more than cover the cost of materials if it did.

i would say however that if you regard the time spent building as heartache or something to be endured, don't start, you probably won't finish.
 

ianabc

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Go for the Genoa 55

Mate built a 48 footer in aluminium,

First weld to launch in 12 weeks....self cut al. (I use a portabnle saw with a metal cutting blade and lots of candle wax to cut 1/4 inch al.

Tack welded by mate....then welded by a qualiifed professional weleder ......
 

john c

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self build. One of the ailsa22s was owned by my wife and I.

[we owned it for about 10 years, but bought it for !0K nearly new. It's builder said, on the water it had cost 17K I sold it in very good condition for 4K.She is one of the boats on Selway Fishers Web site. So much to say, too much for a one fingered typist. We loved her.QUOTE=ukdiving;528944]There is very little coverage today in the mags on building your own boat and one could be forgiven for believing it has gone out of fashion. Self build used to be a very common way in to boat ownership but is it so today?

Being in my 50's I have always hankered to have a go and am sure I would find it a satisfying experience but would the end result (assuming I made a good job!) be saleable? How do self builds stand for re sale price compared to the cost of materials? How does cost of build compare to say a relatively new pre-owned factory produced vessel of same size?

I guess the real question is does self build make financial sense? or (apart from the satisfaction) is it a financial lemon and simply better to look in the used columns?

I appreciate that figures and comparisons are going to depend on many variables but I would appreciate any comments form those with experience.

I have been looking at the Selway Fisher plans for the Ailsa 22, a wooden 22 foot trailer sailer. Has anyone experience of building this? Does anyone know what the finished result is like to use?

Any feedback appreciated.[/QUOTE]
 

Wino

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I could not buy what I wanted - so built myself. Result I/we love it. But we could never see the money back, or probably a fraction.
You tend to build every thing a bit heavier, then when you don't like something you rip it apart and try again (double or treble cost)
Would I do it again - No, not at my age
But if I were early middle age and had somewhere to build YES I would.
I met a man last year who has built 5 boats, all to same design and he recons if he builds another one he MAY get rid of all the problems and that's risk you take, a production boat tends to have most if not all defects taken out. When you build your own its amazing what errors gt built in.
 
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