IPS Problems

[jtarmey]

We have recently taken delivery of a new boat fitted with Volvo IPS 600 drives and on 3 occasions within the first few week of ownership experienced the engines going into limp home mode without warning and with no apparent fault on the diagnostics. This seems to baffle the boat builder and the engine manufacturer who imply this has never been seen before. Are we really unique? has anyone else had problems with IPS 600 and did you get it resolved by Volvo Penta? Apart from that the engines run sweet, acceleration is good and IPS is a dream to use when everything is working. Right now confidence in our new retirement toy is pretty low - should we have bought a golf villa instead? Will limp home mode turn to swim home mode one day. Help!

 

[Nautical]

What boat are they fitted to? have you got joy stick ?

 

[jtarmey]

Nordwest 420 with 72 hours on the clock with joystick

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

Let me guess. Nord West are blaming Volvo and vice versa? Can't help you with the problem itself but IMHO, this is a safety issue and you should be playing hardball with the dealer. Sounds like you should see a lawyor to discuss your legal position. Maybe a legal letter reminding the dealer of your right to reject the boat (if the lawyor says you still have it) would knock some heads together

 

[Nautical]

Sounds like an electronic problem, had this before on D6's on legs and had the EVC's reset, happened after a particularly hard landing during no1 hull testing, launched off the wake of a big flybridge and a bigum thump so hard knocked all the master trips off, settings all went to get home mode and we limped home. VP man reset everything and problem solved. Have to say though if intermittant could be something like temp sensor problem, sensors are very sensitive on the evc's and if they read incorrect engines go into limp mode, check also water coolant level had this once and again a small drop past the bottom level will set the evc's into limp mode, sure as eggs everything went to limp. I am not entirely sure but I think once limp mode has been activated the evc's need resetting again. Other problem had on another D6 was unusally sticky actuator, fine astern but into ahead sent evc into limp mode again, worth a check.

Other area to look at is fuel starvation probs at full chat, evc's control almost everything and will always revert to limp mode if any variant is detected, fuel, water, boost, oil pressure, exhaust, charging etc. Sounds to me another more experienced VP man with lots of evc experience might be a starting point.

Not convinced that VP man is top dollar if evc's are in limp mode you should be getting diagnostic read out or at very least red or amber light flashing in the warning dials.

 

[DavidJ]

Hi Judi and welcome to the forum.
I can understand your gloom at the moment because most of us have been through it with new boats. I made the mistake of going into problem solving mode with my new boat so my advice is just hand the problem over and take a legal stance rather than a helpful practical one.
But take heart, all of these type of problems get sorted in the end and you will have some wonderful retirement boating in the future.
I haven't seen an IPS in action yet but I know I'll envy that controllability when mooring.

ps Make detailed notes of every conversation you have with everyone concerned with this problem. It's interesting how people try to rewrite history when backed into a corner.

 

[Nickcf]

You don't say where you are based so the legal position may differ but I'd certainly suggest you follow the advice already given- ie hand the boat back to the dealer you purchased from as, legally, it is their responsibility to fix it. They should deal with VP.

Advise them in writing that if they can't fix it within a reasonable time (say two weeks) then you are rejecting the boat as not fit for purpose and require a full refund.

nick

 

[jtarmey]

We are UK south coast based but collected the boat from Sweden in June this year. Comments very much appreciated. Rumour has it that we are not the only ones with limp home problems hense the original posting on this forum. On the plus side the 420 is very comfortable, beautifully built and apart from this engine problem deserves the awards that it has won. If we get the engines sorted we will be very pleased.

Judy T

 

[kcrane]

Let us all know when you get it fixed, the Nordwest's look like lovely boats and are high on our "next boat" list. Once you are up and running you'll have a queue waiting for the offer of a ride.

 

[jlfrank68]

Hi judy,

I am not 100% positive but, I may have answer to your problem or at least it may help you elinating it when dealing with volvo or the manufacturer.

I work in the marine industry and have first hand experience of this problem as well as hearing of similar experiences from other people in the industry.

The problem seems to be the link between the IPS system and the autopilot (I have only expierenced this with Raymarine equipment so far). The auto pilot and IPS argue about how much the boat can turn and result in the IPS system having a sulk and sticking you into limp mode. I know that this problem has effected boats from several manufacturers who were not aware that this problem existed. Infact it only seems to becoming more apparent with the increase of boats being sold with IPS.

I would try and chase down the IPS/Nav gear route with whoever is looking after your aftersales/warranty issues.

I hope this has been of help to you in sorting your problem out.

 

[jtarmey]

JL Frank68,

Thank you. We ceratinly have that combination of Raymarine auto pilot (great tool - very acccurate) and IPS 600. We will take this up with Volvo.

Currently the latest discussion with Volvo is whether or not there is a fault page in OEM mode even when ther is no current fault on the system (press minus sign on EVC control for 7 secs, hear the beep and OEM mode displayed. Then rotate the knob to scroll through the menu to find the Fault Page and hopefuly read off fault codes). We have only once seen a fault page and that was when there was an ongoing fault still existing - the starboard engine would not start - turned out to be loose wires on the starter motor - but a fault code was displayed until we fixed the problem. Once fixed that fault is no longer recorded in the diagnostic system. Not to save old faults would seem to be a logical design decision by Volvo except that when trying to find internmittent faults like ours there is no history to recover once the engines are shut down. When the engines are shut down all faults are scubbed from the menu so there is nothing for the visiting engineer to see when he comes to the boat full of confidence that he will fix the fault.

Next visit by Volvo UK planned shortly - give them credit they are certainly trying - with the aim to show us that there is a fault page in the OEM menu. This is interesting as Volvo Sweden say there is only a fault page when faults exist.

Insider tells us that Volvo are working hard on a solution and there is now doubt that they do stay in touch at a senior level - but it is still nice as a new boat owner and someone new to boating to get reassurance and help from others with more expecience of this hobby.

Watch this space.

 

[nova]

Any progress with Volvo. Our new boat with IPS cuts out at sea to limp home mode. Volvo seem unable to explain fault except to suggest it is Raymarine at fault.

 

[jogaraj]

King George

I bought a 2009 Silverton Ovation 52' Yacht in June of 2008 in the USA, equipped with triple Volvo 600 IPS installed. Since that purchase I have changed my Port Transmission two times, my Center Transmission two times, my Starboard Transmission once, my Port side lower (pod) unit once, all due to failure, and my Center Engine's #2 cylinder has blown out, requiring the block to be replaced.

Through all of this drama, I must say that Volvo Penta has been very supportive, and cooperative by giving me fast response and replacement parts. Sometimes on warranty, other times at a generous price reduction on the parts.
I am now so fearful of taking my boat out to the ocean (I am an offshore boater) not knowing what's gonna fail next, and how will I get home. i've been towed home a few times.

Has anyone else experienced these problems.? please share with me

 

[LukcyOne]

We had EXACTLY the same problem not long after purchasing our boat - in fact it was about after six hours on the trip home !

We were crossing the Thames estuary at about 27 knots when suddenly the port engine went into limp mode. The strange thing was, was we were on the flybridge at the time - I put both throttles into neutral then went downstairs and the engines worked perfectly.

Putting it down to a glitch, we carried on, it happened again about an hour later. OK, so a bit of a problem with the port engine which we would have to get looked at... BUT, half an hour later the starboard did the same !

If we turned everything off (all 12v) then restarted it was fine - OR if we went downstairs (without restarting) it was also fine ! Really strange.

Obviously this is a major problem now - cruising at 27 knots then one engine cuts down puts the boat into a severe swing ! Alarms go off of course and its a bit of a panic - especially the first time !

To cut a VERY long story short, and after many visits from Volvo (and a discussion with a Volvo expert in the States which shouldn't of happened due to Volvo's strict policies on out of State help (!!)) Volvo replaced BOTH helm units. They then came out with us for a FOUR HOUR trial (which they paid for the fuel by the way) and everything seems to be sorted. We have since been to Holland and back with no problems.

Common sense suggests that it IS a problem with the link to the AutoHelm - and I agree with this - however, changing the helms HAS sorted the problem (for now)

We had a rather strange letter from Volvo after the event (before they paid for the fuel) stating that they would pay the fuel bill as long as I signed a piece of paper to state that the problem was solved and I would not claim again !!! I told them to stick it where the sun doesn't shine and was quite annoyed. Obviously they soon retracted that !!

Volspec were our agents, so maybe worth a call to them... They were brilliant and I have no hesitation in recommending them !

 

[DougH]

All good advice but I suggest you do something very simple before taking any further action.

REBOOT the system. Turn off all electrical supply to the Engine/ECU and leave off for at least an hour.

This should clear the log of the ECU of any spurious data.

If this does not work then the good advice offered can be followed.

We have had the same experience (MAN engines) and found out that when the boat was new so much information was sent to the ECU log that it shut down one engine to limp mode.

Remember the first 2 years of a new boat can seem be a head ache but it soon gets better.

 

[MapisM]

Now, that's funny!

Will limp home mode turn to swim home mode one day.

Nothing to add to what has already been said I'm afraid, and sorry if this sounds as schadenfreude, but your concern above really made me ROTFL.
I'm sure that if VP understands how easily the "IPS swim home mode" concept could spread around the web, they'll do something to fix it.
All the very best.

 

[Imperial One]

My experience with IPS drives is that VP UK have a head in the sand attitude to fixing anything - IPS or not. We had some issues in the past on various boats and VP UK said nothing wrong at our end.
Finally, we got a Dutch VP engineer on the boat who within 4 minutes had diagnosed the issue as a sensor and fixed it within 15 minutes.
My advice, ignore UK and go to the top man in Sweden, tell them UK are not helping you solve the issue and remind them that you have an international warranty on the engines.
Keep the faith, these are great engines, nothing wrong with them as units, it is nearly always down to a poor installation or a lack of experience on the part of the engineer in my experience.
In short with VP, it all depends on attitude of the engineer who looks at the issue for you......and sadly UK are not as good as other countries with regard to customer service.

 

[Nautical]

"....VP UK have a head in the sand attitude to fixing anything"........

That must be the understatement of the century !

 

[C'sTheDay]

I have a IPS 500 system that was giving me problems the last two years. You would use the Joystick and in the middle of the motion it would work or decide to drop out. Also go into limp mode. They quoted me about $4000.00 to replace the Joystick. This year I got feed up with the reprogramming and didn't want to pay the 4K. I took it on myself to figure it out. It was easy after I thought about it. Check to see if someone upgraded your software. Even if they didn't this might be worth a try. Start your engines and let run a few minutes, then turn them off. Wait then remove the Joystick connectors to the control board. Mark which connector goes to ware. I don't know if it maters but I did it anyway. Wait about 10 minutes then plug them in again. Wait about 20 minutes. I tried to start the engines right after I plugged it in and nothing worked. The longest half hour ever. Give the computer time to recognize the Joystick. Start the engines. let run a few minutes then try Joystick. If it works it will probably keep working. if it doesn't, shut the engines down and wait another 20 minutes. There is no guaranty it will fix your problem but, it fixed a lot of other problems I had too.
You will need to get behind the control to get to the wires.

TC

 

[C'sTheDay]

JL Frank68,

Thank you. We ceratinly have that combination of Raymarine auto pilot (great tool - very acccurate) and IPS 600. We will take this up with Volvo.

Currently the latest discussion with Volvo is whether or not there is a fault page in OEM mode even when ther is no current fault on the system (press minus sign on EVC control for 7 secs, hear the beep and OEM mode displayed. Then rotate the knob to scroll through the menu to find the Fault Page and hopefuly read off fault codes). We have only once seen a fault page and that was when there was an ongoing fault still existing - the starboard engine would not start - turned out to be loose wires on the starter motor - but a fault code was displayed until we fixed the problem. Once fixed that fault is no longer recorded in the diagnostic system. Not to save old faults would seem to be a logical design decision by Volvo except that when trying to find internmittent faults like ours there is no history to recover once the engines are shut down. When the engines are shut down all faults are scubbed from the menu so there is nothing for the visiting engineer to see when he comes to the boat full of confidence that he will fix the fault.

Next visit by Volvo UK planned shortly - give them credit they are certainly trying - with the aim to show us that there is a fault page in the OEM menu. This is interesting as Volvo Sweden say there is only a fault page when faults exist.

Insider tells us that Volvo are working hard on a solution and there is now doubt that they do stay in touch at a senior level - but it is still nice as a new boat owner and someone new to boating to get reassurance and help from others with more expecience of this hobby.

Watch this space.