Inboard versus outboard - psychology

dylanwinter

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www.keepturningleft.co.uk
Is there a psychological difference between inboard and outboard people?

As some of you may know, I came pretty close to getting rid of the beast in the bowels of the slug (8hp diesel single cylinder volvo in an 18 foot Mirror Offshore).

The engine is normally fitted to much bigger boats - usually 22 to 24 footers - and the Mirror was assembled around the engine so now that the engine mounts are into their fifth decade they have finally given up the ghost and replacing them is a major job. It is the boats second engine - so I know that an old MD1 has been taken out and this one moved in - but I think they decided to leave the old mounts in situ.

The £1,000 plus for the job of replacing them is equivalent to over half the value of the boat

As per usual I blogged about my predicament. After all I could not go sailing and I wanted to explain why the films had stopped.

I had a decision to make - basically whether to remove the beast and put an outboard on the back of the slug or to fight to keep the engine. It is rediculous that something as cheap and simple as engine mounts can have such an impact - but such are the costs of running an inboard.

Inboard people know that their engines can and do cost them a huge amount of money - yet they bite the bullet.

There was obviously a massive split between the outboard people and those who think that a boat without an inboard is not quite a proper yacht.


700 people have now watched the short film which is basically me sitting under a tree reading out the estimate for the job from the local mechanic.

I was blogging not begging.

. or at least I thought I was

but some of the KTL followers took it into their heads to send oney to my paypal account because keeping the inboard was so important - to them.

$315 US, $140 AuD and £130 came into the account over two days.

I was knocked sideways...surprised.... obviously delighted.. humbled... embarrassed

I asked them to stop because l had decided to fight to keep the beast and that the only way to get it done was doing the job myself.

The money that had come in was more than enough to cover the costs of replacing the mounts - even if I ended up getting them fabricated.

- with enough there to buy in some time from an expert or cover the petrol and beer costs of a knowledgeable volunteer or two

I am going to have a go at getting some of the engine mounts off the engine on Monday - getting some replacements fabricated and then attempt, with the help of a bloke I have never met called Alan Blewitt, to put them back next weekend.

The reasons the people gave for sending money - sometimes half way around the world - to an old bloke they have never met in an effort to persuade him to keep an old engine in an old boat were many and varied

- but I was surprised at how many reasons tended to the emotional side of the arguement.



"The beast is the heart of the slug"

the noise of the volvo was the sound of my youth

an inboard is much more reassuring when the chips are down


I am curious to know - do you feel more secure on a boat when you know that it has an inboard.

Is a yacht with an inboard more of a real boat than one with an outboard hanging over the back?

I have to say that the slug is my first inboard boat - and having it there does have an impact on the way I 'feel' about my little yacht..

I do feel more secure because I have it. When it fires up I feel safe. It certainly made me feel better about Wells bar

Maybe, just maybe - deep down - after all the bad things I have said in the past - I am a closet motorboatalist.

Can anyone recommend a good therapist or cast some light on this personal crisis


Dylan
 
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Have a word with Dr Searush ... to talk about MOBO being a four letter swear word ... :)

keep the faith... :)
 
I dont tink it is a case of a 'real' boat has to have an inboard but, if you are likely to be caught out offshore, an inboard

- has the weight in the right place
-keeps the prop in the water whatever the conditions (or almost so)
-doesnt rely on a sophisticated ignition system which can go wrong
- is more fuel efficient and no worries about slopping smelly petrol about

I am sure you have made the right decision.

If I wasn't off on my own cruise shortly, I would have volunteered to come and help

Best of luck
 
thanks

I dont tink it is a case of a 'real' boat has to have an inboard but, if you are likely to be caught out offshore, an inboard

- has the weight in the right place
-keeps the prop in the water whatever the conditions (or almost so)
-doesnt rely on a sophisticated ignition system which can go wrong
- is more fuel efficient and no worries about slopping smelly petrol about

I am sure you have made the right decision.

If I wasn't off on my own cruise shortly, I would have volunteered to come and help

Best of luck

not much room for more than one person at a time to work

actually come to think of it there is not even enough room for one person to work

I assume that by the end of Monday I shall be tired and emotional

Dylan
 
Current boat has an inboard, and it's of a size that there's no choice. Last boat (27'), I took out a working inboard for the peace of mind of an outboard.
1) If you get something around the prop (perhaps the biggest cause of engine failure? - I'm making it up, but it must be high up the list), it's quick and easy to clear it.

2) There are no holes in the hull

3) You can't die of CO poisoning from an exhaust leak.

4) If it catches fire, it's outside the boat.

5) Bills will be small. This was the clincher as a couple of minor things needed doing.

Motoring against a chop wasn't pleasant, but sailing into one is much more comfortable anyway.
 
is there anything you missed

Current boat has an inboard, and it's of a size that there's no choice. Last boat (27'), I took out a working inboard for the peace of mind of an outboard.
1) If you get something around the prop (perhaps the biggest cause of engine failure? - I'm making it up, but it must be high up the list), it's quick and easy to clear it.

2) There are no holes in the hull

3) You can't die of CO poisoning from an exhaust leak.

4) If it catches fire, it's outside the boat.

5) Bills will be small. This was the clincher as a couple of minor things needed doing.

Motoring against a chop wasn't pleasant, but sailing into one is much more comfortable anyway.

apart from the releif of the financialstress - did you miss the inboard?
 
It's the deep sonorous beat of a slow revving diesel that sounds like your mother's heartbeat in the womb. It is comforting & reassuring.

Whereas the high pitched scream of an outboard is the sound of stress & fear. Not that I'm being emotive, of course. :D
 
If you must resort to an engine then an inboard wins every time. Small commercial boats go inboard for a good reason
 
An outboard hung on the transom is an ergonomic, seamanship and aesthetic disaster.

An outboard in a well has a lot going for it, keeps the prop immersed and one can whip out the engine to clear weed, lines, nets etc, but that can be discounted as the slug doesn't have a well ( taking things to relative extremes, could one be made ?).

For the sort of voyaging you do Dylan, I'd think the inboard with a prop' cutter, and a diving mask, drysuit, rigid boarding ladder & sturdy serrated knife would be the way to go.

Just don't take 'going' too literally, if and when it becomes necessary do it with support people around ! :)
 
In an ideal world I would love an inboard with electric start. Just push the button and off it goes.

When it works.

When it's not costing you a fortune to keep repairing.

When it's not leaking oil or fuel into your bilge.

I guess I like having an outboard because above all it's cheap. If it breaks down, I can take it home to fix it.

But the disadvantage is I have to pull on a bit of string to start it, and it doesn't always start as easy as I would like.

It doesn't have fancy remote controls, so manouvering where you might need to change fro forward to reverse is not as convenient.

But did I mention it's cheap, and DIY servicable?

So that about sums it up. Outboard, cheap and simple. Inboard much better, but likely to cost much more to maintain and repair.
 
I just don't understand this fetish for outboards if one was 30-40 years old it would be a bag of shiat not even worth the cost of a service ( seagulls being the exception :rolleyes:). But a diesel inboard if looked after will last for many years and mechanically simplistic and a lot easier to do repairs on (other than taking out ) than petulant little petrol engines with all their fancy electrics ( that are critical to them running) .
As for paying someone £200 a day to do the whole job :eek: ( maybe I should have taken up marine engineering !!)

Hey but what do I know I am just a beginner :D but I am aiming for an inboard on my project boat and after reading Dylans troubles will be making sure I can get at the damn thing to look after it ( even if it means some major modifications )
 
you pays yer money and makes yer choice

I have had both , both can be good both can be bad.

If an outboard is the right one and fitted well with the right prop then they can do a good job

The same goes for an inboard.

The one big advantage of the inboard is the fuel consumption .

The difference in cost between an outboard and inboard both on original fit and year on year maintenance can buy a lot of fuel

There can be several advantages with outboards (Other posters have mentioned some). One I haven't seen mentioned is a tiller outboard link gives big manoeuvring advantage.

The elecy generating problem of an outboard can be sorted. I have seen 4 outboards where the owners have fitted small alternators. One was also featured in PBO a few years ago.

Both my boats have outboards . On both I had thought to change to inboards but after use I have changed my mind and have not regretted doing so. Note I have been out in both in F8 with heavy seas . I have no problems with cavitation on either.
I have had inboards before on other yachts all have had financial implications and caused considerable sailing down time.

In a large Yacht It would have to be an inboard . Below 24 feet An outboard can be made to be very effective though I wouldn't want a main engine on a bracket on the back. It would have to be a transom well or a internal well .

Edit: fuel consumption is the major issue but if you mainly sail then its no an issue at all .
 
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Just a thought... with an outboard

Do you enjoy a ciggie or cigar in the cockpit in the evening... at anchor..
with all that petrol hanging about down wind... :eek:
or light the stove and flick the match out of the companion way

these things have to be considered... :)
 
Tried an outboard getting out of Southwold Harbour. We got stuck in the entrance. Rocks to port and rotton steel to starboard. Everytime we went over a wave the engine came out of the water and backwards we went :eek: With the rocks looming to port I decided to increase power but soon realised that the outboard was maxed out :eek:

We lived to tell the tale :rolleyes:

We have surfed in in our Beneteau 323 a couple of times but having an engine and a prop IN THE WATER makes all the difference.

Good luck with the DIY. Its not that complicated. Few bolts and a bit of rubber :rolleyes:

What about going all electric ........................... Think GREEN. A boat full of batteries. A deck crammed with solar panels and an ELECTRIC OUTBOARD :eek:

..
 
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The thing is with outboards on small yachts they are usually fitted as an after thought, stuck on a bracket on the back , no thought to the fitting/siting of the of the engine or to the fuel tank(often a plastic tank on a flexi pipe sitting on the floor in the cockpit )Whatever the engine ,in or out it should be properly fitted balanced and the fuel tank should be properly fitted in, self draining, with properly lidded lockers
 
engines seem more likely to get you into trouble than out of it -

today I wrecked two

1/ the Vire inboard

2/ 4hp outboard

so sailed back onto the pontoons -

Vire lost propulsion when leaving the mud berth - impatience probably snapped something -

Outboard became an anchor after running into local sewage pipe ...... inattention !

within 20 mins of one another -

one of those days - all my fault .....

its quite easy to put yourself into a situation with an engine that you would never put yourself in under sail ...... and if the engine goes you might not be able to get out of it under sail .....
 
Stop messing around, Dylan. Just get it sorted! ;-)

A decent outboard that you can be confident is reliable will cost you a very significant chunk of whatever it might cost to sort the beast. Then look at the additional cost of fuel for the voyages you plan for the next couple of years and it's a no brainer.

An outboard is all very well, but it is no substitute for the real thing!

I've sailed many, many miles in boats with outboards, and they certainly have their place in the scheme of things. But for long distance cruising they cost a lot more to fuel; petrol is often unavailable in smaller harbours, so you end up walking or taking a taxi miles to find the petrol station (not necessarily open!); they makes a terrible racket, unless they're big, heavy and costly; if they're on the back of the boat they're a pain; if they're in a a well there's even more noise and fumes (the well I had would also choke the engine on its own exhaust fumes unless you propped the lid open); they don't put out enough electric power to keep a battery charged on a long trip (sure you can put an alternator on some - more cost, aggro and fuel); if things get rough you want something that keeps its prop in the water and won't conk out if it's doused in seawater.

Surely one of the big advantages of a Mirror Offshore is it has an inboard diesel engine (one of the smallest boats to have it as standard)?

You know it makes sense!
 
one of the reaons for a Mirror offshore

Stop messing around, Dylan. Just get it sorted! ;-)

A decent outboard that you can be confident is reliable will cost you a very significant chunk of whatever it might cost to sort the beast. Then look at the additional cost of fuel for the voyages you plan for the next couple of years and it's a no brainer.

An outboard is all very well, but it is no substitute for the real thing!

I've sailed many, many miles in boats with outboards, and they certainly have their place in the scheme of things. But for long distance cruising they cost a lot more to fuel; petrol is often unavailable in smaller harbours, so you end up walking or taking a taxi miles to find the petrol station (not necessarily open!); they makes a terrible racket, unless they're big, heavy and costly; if they're on the back of the boat they're a pain; if they're in a a well there's even more noise and fumes (the well I had would also choke the engine on its own exhaust fumes unless you propped the lid open); they don't put out enough electric power to keep a battery charged on a long trip (sure you can put an alternator on some - more cost, aggro and fuel); if things get rough you want something that keeps its prop in the water and won't conk out if it's doused in seawater.

Surely one of the big advantages of a Mirror Offshore is it has an inboard diesel engine (one of the smallest boats to have it as standard)?

You know it makes sense!

the engine was one of the reasons for buying the mirror

but - last year it cost me £500 in May

then another 300 and six weeks of summer sailing in july and august

and now I am into another massive bill

it is a great thing to have and I think winter sialing would be very tough without it - and my cameras eat battery power

but.... right now the engine feels like a real financial burden

I am hopeful that once I have got around this round of costs then I will start loving it again

but right now - especially after these past few days of warm weather and good winds when I have not been able to go sailing then it feels like a right royal pain in the proverbial

- and I now face several days of keyhole surgery, oily hands, sweaty overalls and barked knuckles.


Grrrrrrr!



Dylan
 
Yes, I know how tough it can be, and I don't mean to downplay that.

Someone once said to me that you have to decide what you want, then decide how much it will cost, then decide if you can afford it (otherwise you're in danger of getting something cheaper, but that doesn't actually meet your needs).

Tedious and challenging as the current situation is, you will probably look back on it as a blip. I do hope so.

(p.s. Forgot to mention before diesel inboard fuel tank range vs. outboard)
 
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