IN in EU or OUT from EU

[ianj99]

I'm voting to stay. The prospect of Boris or Gove as PM scares me. Gove wants to repeal the human rights act and reinstate the death penalty! Many of these Brexiter Tories want to undo many of the equality laws and send this country backwards!

You are very easily scared and unfortunately it is likely that if the vote is to remain, it was because too many were also too weak and timid to vote leave.
A vote to remain will see the federalists forge ahead with their plans, led by the Germans & French. The idea that as one of the 27, we have any influence over these is nonsense and in fact our position will be even weaker because they know there will not be another referendum.
Boris gets my vote for PM as well: I have no confidence in Dave & George et al negotiating the terms of leaving in our best interests. They are more likely to adopt a wrecking strategy so their scaremongering prophecies come true.

Vote remain - no thanks, we might as well have surrendered in 1939...

 

[Niander]

Couldn't agree more ....this is the ONLY chance to get out
we are literally giving away millions of pounds every week subsidizing other European country's
and yet suffering massive cuts ourselfs to pay for it
Our own laws are undermined by the European courts and
we are being taken for a ride its time to end it!
Don't believe the daily scaremongering crap off Cameron and his pals.
remember this is our only chance people!

 

[chanelyacht]

I'm voting to stay. The prospect of Boris or Gove as PM scares me. Gove wants to repeal the human rights act and reinstate the death penalty! Many of these Brexiter Tories want to undo many of the equality laws and send this country backwards!

So don't vote for them in an election then - that's in your hands.

Read what Junkers says - he is in a position to decide what happens, and his presence is not in your hands if we stay in.

Repealing the HRA, and replacing with a UK Bill of Rights, would be an excellent move.

 

[Babylon]

Here are all the answers: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-32810887

 

[CAPTAIN FANTASTIC]

The statistic show people who are over 60, blue collar worker, working in local government jobs/civil service, monoglot and financially insecure, are most likely to vote OUT; how does this relate to the Yachting community?

 

[grumpy_o_g]

I think that to change one's mind about Turkey over the last 10 years is reasonable thing. Turkey in 2006 was a very different thing - the AKP had only been in power for a few years and Erdogan couldn't even be Prime Minister at first (though he undoubtedly pulled the strings behind the scenes).

On the the other hand, whilst I like Boris's showmanship and think he is definitely not stupid, I still don't trust him a bit - he's a politician. Boris of course has very strong links with Turkey, his great-grandfather being Ali Kemal. Boris's opinion of Erdogan http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/0...esident-erdogan-offensive-poetry-competition/



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ali_Kemal

 

[Daydream believer]

The statistic show people who are over 60, blue collar worker, working in local government jobs/civil service, monoglot and financially insecure, are most likely to vote OUT; how does this relate to the Yachting community?

Obvious really
People over 60 own boats in retirement & have more time & cash to play with boats than people with jobs & families
Civil servants have more time to play than people who have to work for a living
people who own boats end up financially insecure

 

[fergie_mac66]

Well in post #359 of this thread I posted a video (below) it's an interview with a commissioner of the EU about TTlP one of the biggest things to hit the EU affecting all parts of the EU affecting the NHS. It will have a serious affect on every company in the EU every company in the UK. Ten people have watched it from here. No comments yet? I have not put my opinion on because although it has a big affect on the decision on 23rd everybody should be uninfluenced. Come on though not mentioning the content the Americans on the other side must be rubbing there hands in glee. He is representing you and yours for the future there is nothing we can do about it!

 

[CaptainCava]

It's very depressing that so many of the inners seem to be confusing personalities with real issues. The heroes or villains mentioned earlier in this thread will have zero influence on your lives in a few years time. Vote on the real issues, not whether you do or don't like someone!
I also find it immensely depressing that approximately half of the electorate seem to have no faith in Britain standing on her own two feet. I guess if we stay in we will continue to be run by exactly those sort of people.

 

[chanelyacht]

It's very depressing that so many of the inners seem to be confusing personalities with real issues.

It's what I'd do if I knew I had no other case.

 

[CAPTAIN FANTASTIC]

Obvious really
People over 60 own boats in retirement & have more time & cash to play with boats than people with jobs & families
Civil servants have more time to play than people who have to work for a living
people who own boats end up financially insecure

I like it

 

[ianj99]

It's very depressing that so many of the inners seem to be confusing personalities with real issues. The heroes or villains mentioned earlier in this thread will have zero influence on your lives in a few years time. Vote on the real issues, not whether you do or don't like someone!
I also find it immensely depressing that approximately half of the electorate seem to have no faith in Britain standing on her own two feet. I guess if we stay in we will continue to be run by exactly those sort of people.

+1

Also, many younger voters seem to view it from 'how will it affect me in the short term' and not from 'what sort of country will my kids inherit'.

 

[Bobc]

It's very depressing that so many of the inners seem to be confusing personalities with real issues. The heroes or villains mentioned earlier in this thread will have zero influence on your lives in a few years time. Vote on the real issues, not whether you do or don't like someone!
I also find it immensely depressing that approximately half of the electorate seem to have no faith in Britain standing on her own two feet. I guess if we stay in we will continue to be run by exactly those sort of people.

I'm with you on that.

 

[Bobc]

+1

Also, many younger voters seem to view it from 'how will it affect me in the short term' and not from 'what sort of country will my kids inherit'.

Not just younger voters. I've seen people on here saying that they will vote because of something like the value of their house or their ability to keep their boat in Spain. It's so short-sighted and self-centred. If we have to go through a bit of pain and a couple of years of -0.1% GDP growth, to get to where we need to be, then so-be-it.

 

[CAPTAIN FANTASTIC]

Not just younger voters. I've seen people on here saying that they will vote because of something like the value of their house or their ability to keep their boat in Spain. It's so short-sighted and self-centred. If we have to go through a bit of pain and a couple of years of -0.1% GDP growth, to get to where we need to be, then so-be-it.

We have overtaken France in GDP and indication are that we will be overtaking Germany in 10~20 years, when most of us here will not be around.; all these within EU and because of the EU. Britain is going from strength to strength since the miserable 60's and 70's. So, let's no think about ourselves only and consider our children too, who (thanks god) will be voting IN.

 

[dom]

It's very depressing that so many of the inners seem to be confusing personalities with real issues. The heroes or villains mentioned earlier in this thread will have zero influence on your lives in a few years time.

I disagree.

On the one hand there are the purists who see the referendum as primarily about achieving absolute sovereign power. They are quick to scorn anybody they see as tainted -- basically anybody who has got anything tangible done in Europe. Boris was anointed the natural leader of this group, whereupon he reasoned that by portraying Cameron as one of the tainted, he might be able to bounce the UK out of Europe and become PM himself.

The trouble for Boris is that the vast majority of UK voters are pragmatists: they want to keep their businesses and their jobs and they desire prosperity for their kids.

They have seen Boris et al portray local government as choked in EU bureaucracy, portray city investors as clueless pro-EU folk who 'apparently' supported the UK joining the euro, scoff at pro-Europe CEOs and even portray the Bank of England as EU lackies.

No surprise therefore that the opinion polls first swung towards Brexit! Then slowly but surely the pragmatists saw these groups hitting back and they hit Boris hard. Andrew Tyrie shredded him over lies he had cracked up about EU regulations (unbelievable he couldn't find some real ones!), the city and BoE have ridiculed his arguments and CEOs have dismissed his ideas as "a millimeter deep and totally naive".

Equally unsurprisingly the polls are starting to swing back.

But should we not look above personalities? The trouble is that even those pragmatists leaning towards Brexit have to worry that Boris's incompetent hand would be indelibly written on the fractious divorce he would negotiate with the EU. And that would matter for many years.

It is of course a shame that the Brexit debate has been eclipsed by personalities like this, an example of politics at its very worst.

 

[ianj99]

We have overtaken France in GDP and indication are that we will be overtaking Germany in 10~20 years, when most of us here will be around.; all these within EU and because of the EU. Britain is going from strength to strength since the miserable 60's and 70's. So, let's no think about ourselves only and consider our children too, who (thanks god) will be voting IN.

Prove that we've done so well because we are in the EU.

How do you know that we would not have done even better had we not been in it?

You've taken two completely unrelated facts and linked them just like an 'in' supporter would.

 

[CaptainCava]

basically anybody who has got anything tangible done in Europe.

Who is that then?

 

[CaptainCava]

Boris was anointed the natural leader of this group, whereupon he reasoned that by portraying Cameron as one of the tainted, he might be able to bounce the UK out of Europe and become PM himself.

The trouble for Boris is that the vast majority of UK voters are pragmatists: they want to keep their businesses and their jobs and they desire prosperity for their kids.

They have seen Boris et al portray local government as choked in EU bureaucracy, portray city investors as clueless pro-EU folk who 'apparently' supported the UK joining the euro, scoff at pro-Europe CEOs and even portray the Bank of England as EU lackies.

No surprise therefore that the opinion polls first swung towards Brexit! Then slowly but surely the pragmatists saw these groups hitting back and they hit Boris hard. Andrew Tyrie shredded him over lies he had cracked up about EU regulations (unbelievable he couldn't find some real ones!), the city and BoE have ridiculed his arguments and CEOs have dismissed his ideas as "a millimeter deep and totally naive".

Equally unsurprisingly the polls are starting to swing back.

But should we not look above personalities? The trouble is that even those pragmatists leaning towards Brexit have to worry that Boris's incompetent hand would be indelibly written on the fractious divorce he would negotiate with the EU. And that would matter for many years.

It is of course a shame that the Brexit debate has been eclipsed by personalities like this, an example of politics at its very worst.

What a load of utter rubbish. Anyone with half a neuron would figure out that Boris would have much more chance of being PM if he just toed the line behind Cameron and Osbourne. Cameron has already said he is retiring and most thinking people are beginning to mistrust Osbourne.

 

[FWB]

A great speech by John Redwood.
http://www.express.co.uk/news/polit...ood-voters-to-banish-puppet-parliament-Brexit