ID Stern Glands

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John100156

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Stern_Glands.jpg

I am in the closing stages of purchasing my next boat a 2002 Princess 45 - I generally understand the types of stern glands fitted but wondered whom manufactures the ones shown?

I guess the link rod will ground the shaft, I assume using brushes against the shaft but the blue tube is not convoluted, like on my old PSS shaft seals so I wondered how these are burped/adjusted/work.

Also what the black collar is on each shaft, between gear box drive and seal. Some form of emergency seal?

Anyway any advice/comments welcome - should have re-sized the image I know, sorry!
 
They are Tides shaft seals, ( princess may call them something else ) black thing is indeed a spare seal and they shouldn't need burping as they are water fed from raw water circuit. Had them changed on our P42 in 2017 when we had cutlass bearings done and they were fine, ( possibly done 12 years ). There should be a red plastic gadget on the boat somewhere to help swap over in emergency. The 45 like the 42 is a great boat :encouragement:.
 
Thanks chaps, that makes perfect sense - I thought I had seen them before, will check-out Tides. I had an F43 which I thoroughly enjoyed, but I really like the P45, few concerns about the Cat 3126's, would probably have preferred Volvo's if I am honest, but I am in contact with Finning and will take oil samples on Friday.... Many thanks.
 
Tides Marine Seals

After about 7 years they should be dismantled and inspected and new seal fitted.

Annually you should check the water flow to the seal from the engine at tick over look for about 4 to 5 litres per minute, if less investigate. They can and do block with calcium build up or scabs of calcium blocking supply line as fittings are small id.
 
I knew I had seen them before but I could not for the life of me remember where - thats great. I like the fact Princess install ball valves on the water feed lines, so it should be an easy task to check flow rate - I was intending to Ryde Lyme the HX/engines if I had any temp problems. I am not confident the former owner may have been dilligent in changing the numerous anodes found on the Cat engines, I have not seen service history yet, hope I'm wrong, so this will be first on the check list....
 
Rydlyme or not I still advise you prove the flow from engine to stern seal.

I had a blockage and cooked one of mine very quickly.
 
John100156 said:
I knew I had seen them before but I could not for the life of me remember where - thats great. I like the fact Princess install ball valves on the water feed lines, so it should be an easy task to check flow rate - I was intending to Ryde Lyme the HX/engines if I had any temp problems. I am not confident the former owner may have been dilligent in changing the numerous anodes found on the Cat engines, I have not seen service history yet, hope I'm wrong, so this will be first on the check list....
Click to expand...

As others have said - Tides Marine, John.
You have seen them before on Jennywren.

In our case, there are two black collars on the shafts, each containing a spare seal.
We were out in the islands one year and our starboard seal started leaking badly.
I read the Tides manual but decided that it would be best to get someone who knew how to replace the seals so we popped in to Portals where Princess are based.
We were only 3 miles away anyway and I thought it would be a good idea to be close to a travel hoist in case anything went wrong.
I watched the engineer change the seal whilst JW was still in the water.
It is a reasonably safe operation but our seals are an older design than the current models.
Our seals have small nut inserts with allen keyed bolts that you have to remove before changing the seals.
And one of ours had corroded so needed to be drilled out.
Anyway, the actual process of cutting the old seal off and sliding one of the new seals from its container on the shaft worked well.
Lots of water rushing in, of course, which doesn't completely stop until you have tightened the nuts and bolts again.

Later that year, I bought some new seals and a completely new Tides seal assembly to keep as a spare.
This is why I know that my old ones are different to the current design.

As you know, we had to remove our port shaft (the other one) last winter.
That seal was showing some wear so I used the new one that I was keeping to replace the starboard seal.
So next winter, I will be buying another new shaft seal and replacing the starboard one which still has only one spare seal on its shaft.

FYI, Angel Cornet is the man for this kind of work here in Sant Carles.
Anything to do with underwater engineering - his guys are good.
I wouldn't want to remove a shaft on my own - his guys are doing that kind of stuff all the time on the fishing boats here in the main port.
For example they pulled my starboard shaft including removing the gearbox flange within an hour or two.

Plug for Tides Marine.
I am in inquisitive kind of person so when I received the spare seal from Tides, I took it apart to see how it works.
And I didn't put it back together properly - there is a small disc that needs to locate before you replace (the now new design's) self tapping screws.
Angel's engineers knew that something was wrong but quite a lot was getting lost in Spanish/English translation.
So they took a short video of the problem.
I sent the video to Tides who immediately phoned me back with the solution.
Great support for a small but crucial component of the boat.

In your cast, I would expect the seals to be the older design so it would be a good idea to check that the allen key bolts are free to move/remove.
A quick turn with an allen key to ensure that it is free is all the is necessary.
All of mine except one were good.

BTW Tides have a special Princess kit which (if IIRC) incorporated the mounting for the galvanic brushes.
So if you are replacing the seals at any time in the future, it is well worth a phone call to Tides in the UK who will help you get the correct replacement.
 
Thanks Mike that's excellent advice and much appreciated - I hope to move the boat over to the dry for a month around w/c 2 September, I emailed Angel yesterday as I wanted him to take some engine oil samples if he has an engineer available on Friday, so I hope to speak to him soon so can raise this. It would make a lot of sense to remove the shafts for inspection and to fit new seals plus a spare whilst on the dry...!
 
John100156 said:
Thanks Mike that's excellent advice and much appreciated - I hope to move the boat over to the dry for a month around w/c 2 September, I emailed Angel yesterday as I wanted him to take some engine oil samples if he has an engineer available on Friday, so I hope to speak to him soon so can raise this. It would make a lot of sense to remove the shafts for inspection and to fit new seals plus a spare whilst on the dry...!
Click to expand...

If you talk to Tides, they will probably say leave the shaft seals.
They always seem very comfortable about their seals.
I was thinking of changing the starboard one - just because the port one had gone.
Theur advice was to leave it - don't mend something that isn't broken.

So, maybe get some spare shaft assemblies and change them if required - as you know lift and block off here isn't expensive.
 
John100156 said:
Thanks Mike that's excellent advice and much appreciated - I hope to move the boat over to the dry for a month around w/c 2 September, I emailed Angel yesterday as I wanted him to take some engine oil samples if he has an engineer available on Friday, so I hope to speak to him soon so can raise this. It would make a lot of sense to remove the shafts for inspection and to fit new seals plus a spare whilst on the dry...!
Click to expand...

Granny egg sucking time make sure the oil is used before sampling?
 
Yes indeed - done this on several boats but good for others to note/consider so thanks for your comment!

Not sure when the oil was last changed I will be enquiring when I get service history, but will run the oil up to temp before taking a sample - usual precautions.

I believe for 3126 Cat insist on specific engine oil (or the Taurus equivalent) which is a shame, I like Shell Rimula R4X...!
 
Hurricane said:
If you talk to Tides, they will probably say leave the shaft seals.
Their advice was to leave it - don't mend something that isn't broken.

So, maybe get some spare shaft assemblies and change them if required - as you know lift and block off here isn't expensive.
Click to expand...

Noted makes sense. Agree MDL have always been very sensible regarding cost of boatyard services in SCM. It's my intention to spend a week out there early Sept., then take her over to the boatyard for a month, so should have time to pull the shafts and fit new shaft assemblies - I will give Tides a call next week if all goes well.
 
The boat is new to you, good stern seals are essential, when you buy a boat is worthwhile removing props and pulling shafts back and removing the TM seals and inspecting them carefully, I saw a pair last week that were not leaking and not very old but on close inspection when disassembled had a couple of cracks in each, it looked like they bolts securing thew face on had been over tightened. They were replaced, before you remove boat from water check cooling flow to then and when the props are refitted ensure they are lapped and new tab washers fitted ( most manufacturers dont lap props) .

Also check cutless bearings in P brackets and ones in stern tubes if in any doubt while you are doing the above replace all cutless bearings if you are trying to future proof the boat.
 
I have a slight drip on my stern glands Tides lip seal - Serial: 055514 Part Number: SS-1750-3000-01

So I had a local marine engineer from Angel Coronet fit the spare shaft seal, which is likely old and fitted in 2002 but sadly it still drips, not in forward but when standing and in reverse.

I have emailed Tides and Norris today to seek advice, I suspect there may be some slight pitting on the shaft, so I wonder whether to fit new lip seals seeking to position to avoid any pitting after cleaning or whether it might be best to change them to PSS seals which I had fitted on my F43. Any thoughts/advice welcome:
LIP SEAL.jpg
 
Move the seal to a slightly different part of the shaft, you can adjust the flex tube length, only needs to move 20mm
 
Yes, I was thinking about doing that, they are 17 years old now, so I reckon it makes sense to fit new ones. I like the concept using Tides lip-seals, especially the replacement shaft seal which was actually fitted whilst afloat. The PSS type I am leaning toward but welcome further comments as I want to sort this out before Xmas if I can.
 
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