How to choose the first yacht

[sgreenway]

All,

Firstly,
I was wondering if there is anyone out there who can assist me.

I am lookiing for my first (and last!!!! /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif) yacht.

I am looking for something that is big enough for weekends away, capable of easy cross channel trips, not too lively a motion (er indoors not too keen on being sea sick).

I am thinking of something between 27-33 feet. So any suggestions would be gratefully recieved. I have a budget of about 10k for the boat.

Secondly, need to find somewhere suitable to moor it near(ish) to Margate. cost effective mooring is key, as well as easy access to the sea.

I am sure that there are many more knowledgable people out there than me when it comes to a novice sailer.

Cheers /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

 

[reginaldon]

Secondly, need to find somewhere suitable to moor it near(ish) to Margate. cost effective mooring is key, as well as easy access to the sea.
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North Kent - Oare, Faversham & Conyer Creeks all have a very short tidal window, altho' nice spots, the Swale, near Harty, good but a longish trip by dinghy, Sandwich a longish trip to the sea, Folkestone if there are any available, good window, membership of yacht club nec. and all lift out for the winter. I don't know about Herne Bay. I take it you're not too keen in mooring in Margate!!
You shouldn't find too much difficulty in getting a bilge keel cruiser to meet your requirements.

 

[TiggerToo]

What's your budget?
How many people do you want to accommodate on board?

 

[VicS]

You are going to be hard pressed to find a decent boat of that sort of size that does not need a lot of work/money spent on it for 10K.

You don't say what sailing experience you have but I guess from the fact that you have asked the question you have it is limited.

Personally I think you should buy something smaller to begin with and move up to around 30ft once you have learnt the ropes and can confidently handle a bigger boat. In which case choose a popular design, that will be easy to sell again in a year or two.
You should consider some instruction. "Start sailing", "Competent crew", "Day skipper", "Coastal skipper" and "Yachtmaster" are the RYA courses. I would not disagree with anyone who suggests dinghy sailing for starters either. Also get experience crewing for someone else. That will not only teach you loads but it will enable you to make a better choice of first boat.

As far as the boat is concerned you have to decide if you want a twin keeler, a traditional long keel, a fin keel or even a lifting keel. You may even want to consider a motorsailer.

You'll get a long list of suggestions on here all based on peoples personal preferences, that's why to begin with you have to know enough to decide what you want out of a boat.

 

[sgreenway]

Not that keen to moor in Margate - too many people who may find it funny to play on the boat

 

[sgreenway]

Admittedly I have limited experience with regard to sailing.....

however, I am planning on taking at least day skipper this year. So hopefully should kow more about what i am doing.

The reason for starting out with a larger boat, is that SWMBO is not that keen on being on the water. Especially in a smaller boat.

I am hoping to avoid te situation where I get a smaller boat, then have to trade up in a year or 2s time. Struggle to sell what I have and in effect miss a season of enjoying the size of boat we are looking for.

As i said at the beginning i am looking for a first and hopefully last boat. /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[No Regrets]

I don't think your demands are very realistic on the whole!

Although just about any boat is capable of crossing the channel on a good day, even, god forbid, a Narrow boat, you may be waiting in the port for days, or weeks for suitable weather unless you and the crew are experienced and the boat is wholly seaworthy, even then you're not going to banish sea-sickness if your Wife is a land lubber, or whatever.

Expect large bills for mooring, maintaining etc, as we all know what B.O.A.T stands for..... /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

Expecting to take a 'first' boat out to the open ocean is either brave or foolhardy unless you're a seasoned boater (Correct me if I'm wrong by all means....) especially one with Sails rather than a pair of decent engines. (Awaits flaming from the raggies....)

Good luck anyway /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

 

[SwedishLass]

Cost effective often means drying out therefore lift keelers or bilge are favourite as you can extend the tidal window. The east coast is muddy so you have a wide list of options in creeks etc.

For a first boat it is not just size to consider. There are a lot of boats around the 10K. Start by listing what you want from a boat. Then list your plans for her. You need to factor in winter storage and how much winter work you plan. This will point you towards what materials she is made of. I found my first boat ideal for the East coast and beyond including Belgium and Holland but then I'm biased. I find the centre cockpit eases the motion. Now I sit at the back it is taking a bit of getting used to!

As for first & last..... That's what I said until the next one came along.

 

[bendyone]

An older westerly centre, sabre, cobra, or for a bit more money a Hunter would all make a good first boat.

 

[sgreenway]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think your demands are very realistic on the whole!

Although just about any boat is capable of crossing the channel on a good day, even, god forbid, a Narrow boat, you may be waiting in the port for days, or weeks for suitable weather unless you and the crew are experienced and the boat is wholly seaworthy, even then you're not going to banish sea-sickness if your Wife is a land lubber, or whatever.

Expect large bills for mooring, maintaining etc, as we all know what B.O.A.T stands for..... /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

Expecting to take a 'first' boat out to the open ocean is either brave or foolhardy unless you're a seasoned boater (Correct me if I'm wrong by all means....) especially one with Sails rather than a pair of decent engines. (Awaits flaming from the raggies....)

Good luck anyway /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

I used to be foolhardy, now i am a lot more careful (couldn't spell caucious!!).

I intend to get trained this next season and practise with my own boat. Pottering round the Thanet coastline. Learning the way the boat handles etc.

Then next season having the ability to cross the channel, have the 30ish miles to France. Enjoy the local cuisine and te beer, then sail back the followiing day. Perfect weekend.

Just need the nearest thing to perfect for the boat!!!!!! within budget of course /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

 

[sgreenway]

[ QUOTE ]
An older westerly centre, sabre, cobra, or for a bit more money a Hunter would all make a good first boat.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thank you - at least this is a start!!

 

[MoodySabre]

There is much sense given above.

Here's what's for sale on YBW £9K - £11K
http://ybw.yachtworld.com/core/uk/listin...00&cint=295

You need to look at lots and see what takes you fancy. Some may read OK but in the flesh you know that they are not for you.

Whatever you buy, provided it is safe and reliable, will get you hooked so cut out the first and last stuff - it ain't like that.

Cor, look at that pretty girl...............

/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[srevir]

Westerley Centaur is a good recommendation and just about squeezes into your £10k budget.

Capable of cross channel and sits on the mud nicely.

Make sure you get a survey, whatever you buy.

Size doesn't necessarily help on the sea-sickness front.

I sold my centaur because SWMBO wanted something 'respectable' that she could take friends on - end result a 36ft Bavaria which is not good when it gets rough. This is probably true of most if not all 'modern' beamy' fin keelers

Joining a sailing club is a good idea as it will help you pick up experienced crew and probably lower the cost of all the courses that you will need.

Above all accept the fact that everything will cost much more than you thought and just have a lot of fun

 

[fastjedi]

Running a boat on a budget is possible, but needs skill and patience! I recommend you understand the mooring options first and the boat options later. Waiting lists for cost effective moorings can grow exponentially with length of boat. For example, a 8.2m boat may push you into a 10m mooring with a 5 year waiting list Vs an 8m boat on an 8m mooring with a 2 year waiting list.

I think it's sensible to buy a yacht that will accomadate your aspirations for the next 3 - 5 years ... just don't get crossing the channel till you are ready! ...I would keep an open mind on boat choice at that budget. Better to spend £12K on a boat with a new engine and rigging than buy a dog for £10K then spend another £10K to prepare for channel crossings. In addition, there are plenty of older boats on the market that look good on the outside but are full of diesel, wee and mold on the inside ... probably a hard sell to SWMBO?

 

[NickNap]

Steve
As recommended, you won't go far wrong with a Westerly Centaur - but at 10K, it would be a 'tired' one - if you could up it a little and find one that has been re-engined, it would be better....

 

[KenMcCulloch]

[ QUOTE ]

I intend to get trained this next season and practise with my own boat. Pottering round the Thanet coastline. Learning the way the boat handles etc.

Then next season having the ability to cross the channel, have the 30ish miles to France. Enjoy the local cuisine and te beer, then sail back the followiing day. Perfect weekend.

Just need the nearest thing to perfect for the boat!!!!!! within budget of course /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

[/ QUOTE ]
Hi Steve
I think a lot of people rush into boat ownership when what they really need is to build up experience and skills. The one thing I would suggest above all is to try to sail with as many different skippers as you can. You will learn much more in a season sailing on half a dozen different boats than you will in 2 or 3 on your own. Courses will help you develop technique but competence is a little more elusive and does require you to make mistakes and to discover the limits of your knowledge and skills; most of us manage that in non-catastrophic ways /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif .

I think if your partner is nervous about the sea then you need to be well within your competence zone before you start taking her out otherwise the shouting and recriminations will not be long in coming.

There are loads of very experienced and mostly friendly people on here and if you seek invitations I'm sure a few will appear.
It's much cheaper sailing as crew on someone elses boat than as master of your own.

 

[Sequoiah1]

You are asking for a lot but am sure you will find something. All the aforementioned advice is good if some of it a little on the negative side. I would agree with boats suggested so far and if you can either buy a bilge or lifting keeler, or longish shallow fin that will probably help out your mooring situation to a degree. Preference would go to a bilge keel boat for your location and experience. I believe that Bilge keels can also dampen motion so this may be a plus.

Once you find a boat the both of you feel you can live with in terms of interior and exterior accommodations, you will need it surveyed and possibly delivered to your port of choice. (These are all costs to consider) a survey will probably cost about £300 +vat
for this size boat. Buy the boat with the highest level specification and equipment and ensure that you are getting a good auxiliary engine with it. The second hand market is expanding healthily at the moment and there will be some bargains to be had as well as some lemons so be very aware. Buy a boat that an owner has cared for over a long period.

Westerly Centaur (Available with bilge keel option)
Seawolf 26/ Cobra 26 (Available with bilge keel option)
Macwester 26 (Available with bilge keel option)
Sabre 27 (Available with bilge keel option)
Mirage 27/28 (Available with bilge keel option)
These next have varying keel configurations but will largely be fin keels though, I would suggest that if you are not limited by a mooring depth then again these should be high on your list as well as the above.
Trapper 500, Colvic 26, Jaguar 25/27, Samphire 26, Albin Vega, Cutlass 27, Snapdragon’s, Nicholson 26, Hirondelle Catamaran, Heavenly Twins Catamaran
I did a quick search based on a cost of 8k-12k and samples of all the above come in within these figures, condition would have to be seen. There are plenty of good sea boats but quality of finish and specification would have to be judged over a broad spectrum of boats. I have only put in here well known GRP production boats (though some may be home finished)

Above all, get sailing first especially with your partner, get some experience join a sailing club, find out what you like and what you dont, if you find a boat you like, post the what do you think question to the forum, you are bound to get the pros and cons. Happy voyaging.

 

[Athene V30]

If my boat was for sale she would be ideal!

Look at Cutlass 27, Halcyon 27 as well as Westerly Centaurs. Personally Westerlys always seem very plastic to me but they have a good reputation so each to their own.

Good Luck finding something you like.

 

[liztate]

We had a very similar brief when looking for our first boat (i.e. around £10k, sea kindly, good for channel hopping etc).

Centaurs are roomy, good value for money and seem to live forever (although beware osmosis in all Westerley's). Bit boxy for some though!
There are loads of other reasonable options in addition to those mentioned including Snapdragons, Trappers and Jaguars. We looked at hundreds! Nearly bought a Jaguar 27 - nice lines, sail well, and surprisingly roomy so often used as charter boats.

Take your time looking, thoroughly research every one and get a really good surveyor. Also try not to get too depressed by the survey report - they are often not as bad as they first appear! Enjoy the search!

 

[PIGLETSDREAM]

You could do far worse than look at a Trapper 500 bilge keeler, like a tardis down below, reasonably quick, quite stiff and no issues with the build. A good free members forum with a wealth of knowledge. Quite a few about along the South coast. 27 ft long with a tiller steering.
I remember going through the same process, my advice is

1 Find where you can/want to moor her
2 Draw up a wish list of boats and view as many as possible
3 Collate a wish list of desirable fixture fittings
4 Think about what sort of sailing you hope to be doing in 2/3 years time
5 If possible sail on as many different boats

The difference in the levels of kit against size and comfort is like comparing camping in the winter in a bivvy bag to staying in a luxury log cabin

What ever you do have fun and welcome to one of the quickest ways to empty a wallet