How does your system for reefing look like?

[DangerousPirate]

Todays adventure was to get the boat ready for reefing. I am single-handed, so I installed (or tried to install) a single line reefing system. The boom lacks in-boom reefing systems, so everything is done on the outside with blocks. There is a bowline tied to the booms end, a reefing line ran through the eye of the sail and down to a block mounted a little aft of the eye (instead of directly beneath it), ran the line through two eyes on the boom, a jam cleat, down to another eye a few cm above deck level, then back to the cockpit to the rope clutch. It makes a kicker-esque bend downwards because I miss a block, and didn't have one on the boat, to keep the line parallel until it comes to the mast.

I would like to run the reefing line through the second eye, to replace the cunningham as in the diagram, but for now it should do okay.


Didn't get around to test it yet. But I have two worries:

First: That there is not enough downwards pull to get good sailshape. Traditionally, you have the reefing line tied around the boom and then through the reefing eye, to a block at the end of the boom, and from there you take it forward. But since I don't have a boom that allows this, I had to rethink my approach. As mentioned above, I used a block further to the end of the boom so when I pull the line, it creates a very flat sail and depowers it. Nothing has you lose control more than a baggy main in high winds condition. It just makes everything more difficult. Perhaps two blocks at the end of the boom with the reefing line tied around the boom would have the same result as the in-boom reefing method. Not sure if mine is a good idea or if I didn't think of an obvious flaw

The second: The pre-existing jam cleats on the side of the boom are in the way and create friction in the system, when I pull from the cockpit. It may be difficult to imagine without a picture, but the rope does not fit through the jam cleat. I used random ropes I found and it's all just very temporary. So I may end up de-mounting the jam cleats all together, which obviously were installed to reef on the boom. There also is a small cleat to cleat off. Not going to use that, since it's all coming back to the cockpit now. The worry is that the high friction will make it too difficult to pull the line and reef and planned.

 

[Daydream believer]

Put a ball race pulley on the luff of the sail & run through that.If you do not know how to fit, ask.
The pulley at the gooseneck will change tension when the boom changes tack so it needs to be pivoted right at the pivot point of the boom. Not on the side of the mast.
Do away with the other items causing friction.
Use a single line of 7 or 8mm diameter not odds & s..ds of old line.
Properly executed it is brilliant. Improperly done it is a killer

 

[DangerousPirate]

Put a ball race pulley on the luff of the sail & run through that.

You mean put a block on the eye on the sail? Like this picture?

 

[Daydream believer]

You mean put a block on the eye on the sail? Like this picture?

That is the leech. I said the luff. The weight of pullies on the leech "might" promote leech flutter on older sails. Less line runs through the leech so not so important. However , if you must use them use a light friction ring with dynema shackle spliced on
To fit one on the luff get 1 large SS ring & one shackle put one each side of the cringle with a dynema shackle. The ring should not pull through the cringle. Fit the pulley to the shackle
You may have an issue with the sail not pulling down low enough at the luff. This can be sorted by adjusting the length of the dynema shackle, or moving one of the sail sliders. Before making the dynema shackle experiment with some 3mm cord but do not try to do a working reef with it as it will break

 

[DangerousPirate]

That is the leech. I said the luff. Pullies on the leech promote leech flutter on older sails. Less line runs through the leech so not so important. However , if you must use them use a light friction ring with dynema shackle spliced on
To fit one on the luff get 1 large SS ring & one shackle put one each side of the cringle with a dynema shackle. The ring should not pull through the cringle. Fit the pulley to the shackle
You may have an issue with the sail not pulling down low enough at the luff. This can be sorted by adjusting the length of the dynema shackle, or moving one of the sail sliders.

Right, I didn't read that right,

Well, I do have cunningham rings in right now. I can just use those to pull the sail down.

Regarding old lines: Those are just for now, because it was rather spontaneous. I am going to replace the rope with new ones soon.

 

[Tranona]

I am in the process of doing just this. You may find this helpful bartonmarine.com/tech-info-sail_handling-Fitting_Instructions_for_Single_Line_Mainsail_Reefing_System.asp

I already have the track and blocks for the rear of the boom, just figuring out how best to arrange the turning blocks to go up to the reefing eyes which will have blocks. At the base I am using the Barton mast base organiser.

 

[Daydream believer]

I am in the process of doing just this. You may find this helpful bartonmarine.com/tech-info-sail_handling-Fitting_Instructions_for_Single_Line_Mainsail_Reefing_System.asp

I already have the track and blocks for the rear of the boom, just figuring out how best to arrange the turning blocks to go up to the reefing eyes which will have blocks. At the base I am using the Barton mast base organiser.

I had bits of the Barton system on my last boat but as a 2 part system. The luff was on horns.
However, I must point out an issue in the picture on the link, that you post.
On port tack the reef line may be slack ( Perhaps tight if reefed on the run) & on stbd tack ( especially on the run) the line will pull tight due to the position of the pulley on the side of the mast. I think Barton have this wrong.
If there is no "give" in the system that could - over a very short time- put strain on the sail cringles or turning points. Bearing in mind they are possibly screwed into wood they can work loose.
Just my opinion, but I did have a problem with the block on the mast pulling out & that was only on a 26 ft boat. Might have been partly due to screws being too small, but in any event it highlighted an issue & I had to alter the set up

 

[Stemar]

Big +1 for using a ball bearing block on the tack reef cringle. It transformed the reefing system, just like yours, on Jissel.

 

[Tranona]

I had bits of the Barton system on my last boat but as a 2 part system. The luff was on horns.
However, I must point out an issue in the picture on the link, that you post.
On port tack the reef line may be slack ( Perhaps tight if reefed on the run) & on stbd tack ( especially on the run) the line will pull tight due to the position of the pulley on the side of the mast. I think Barton have this wrong.
If there is no "give" in the system that could - over a very short time- put strain on the sail cringles or turning points. Bearing in mind they are possibly screwed into wood they can work loose.
Just my opinion, but I did have a problem with the block on the mast pulling out & that was only on a 26 ft boat. Might have been partly due to screws being too small, but in any event it highlighted an issue & I had to alter the set up

I agree. When I did this last time I had the turning block on the boom. Bit of a challenge with this new boom as it is the old Proctor roller reefing boom with a big casting on the forward end and a disc to keep the luff of the tolled sail from slipping off. Got some ideas on now to solve ot and in fact going to see a boat with the same rig on Tuesday to see how they overcame it.

All good fun

 

[DangerousPirate]

Big +1 for using a ball bearing block on the tack reef cringle. It transformed the reefing system, just like yours, on Jissel.

Okay, I am totally convinced now.

Will do that instead of passing the line through the eye.

Still not sure about the outhaul/down tension on the luff cringle with my method. Feels like it will get pulled aft, but not down enough. IIRC you have an older, smallerWesterly, so I assume you have it rigged similarily to me?

 

[Daydream believer]

A lot of it is how you apply the reef. Some let all the halyard go to a point marked on the rope. Lock it off then wind in the reef. To my mind this is wrong. The reef line gets caught in bits of sail. I have a fully battened main, so I have a black band on the mast at the point where the batten car comes at the first reef. This is so I can see it when looking up at the reef. I like to look up all the time to see what is happening. One can sew a bit of colured tape to the sail & put a tape on the mast if no batten cars.
I loosen the vang, Take the topping lift up a bit to ease the load on the leech.I go head to wind so the sail flogs slightly to help the lines shake through the various points. Normally do this under power & autopilot, as the autopilot stalls if not making headway.

I uncoil the halyard & release the clutch with a turn on the winch for friction. I do NOT let too much halyard run out. Probably no more than 50% of what I need. Letting off too much allows the sail cloth to jam in the reef line, as the luff block falls over & can twist. A bit of tension holds it in line. The leech part does not stay neatly in line & can twist. All adding to friction.
Think of a floppy mainsheet with the falls getting crossed & the blocks twisting, only worse.

I then start to take in the reef line & concentrate on winching in such that the end at the leech always keeps tight. The halyard gradually slips down the mast as the leech comes down to the boom. I can slip more off the winch as necessary as I go, by flipping it with my hand whilst the reef line is on the other winch. If both lines are on the same side as the winch I keep slipping the halyard clutch instead.

Once I am satisfied that the leech is in tight I carry on but concentrate on bringing the luff down by letting the halyard out more. Then when the batten car is is 9 inches above the mark on the mast, I lock the halyard completely & wind down the luff by winching in the reef line tight. This stretches the sail & finishes the reef.

Let off the topping lift, tighten the vang. Cut the engine, bear off & get sailing. Then coil all the ropes & hang them on barton line tidies. Do not let them snake round the cockpit floor.

 

[Tranona]

Okay, I am totally convinced now.

Will do that instead of passing the line through the eye.

Still not sure about the outhaul/down tension on the luff cringle with my method. Feels like it will get pulled aft, but not down enough. IIRC you have an older, smallerWesterly, so I assume you have it rigged similarily to me?

Look at the diagram in the link I posted. Ignore the turning block on the mast - it should be on the boom just behind the gooseneck. The line then gors up through a block at the cringle and down to a block at the base of the mast roughly in line with the centre if the mast. A refinement is to have a lead such as a halyard diverter on the mast to lead the line to the block at the base. This ensures that the luff is not pulled aft when you tension the foot of the sail. Look at the in boom reefing systems to see what you are trying to replicate.