How do you moor a boat on a trot?

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Vid

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What's the best way to both secure the boat but also have a neat system that makes it easy to pick up and leave the trot?

I've just made arrangements to keep my new boat on a trot mooring on a tidal river. I've been given advice on how to secure the boat best but not sure I've understood it properly.

The trot is a series of mooring buoys in line, mine being in the middle with a shore-side and a river-side line on either side. The mooring is the eighth in line, with one astern, so should be quite easy to approach. The mooring buoys are held together by a bridle line. The advice is to moor to the buoys with my own mooring lines and not use the bridle itself. This makes sense, it's the next bit I'm less clear on:

The advice was to attach my mooring lines using shackles on one end and thimbles on the other, attached to a float in the middle so I could pick them up easily. I would use two sets of lines at each end for security. I suppose the shackle on the buoy is a good idea to reduce chafe but I'm not sure about the role of the thimble-end - attached to the boat or the float?

I like the idea, but can't quite see how it works in practice. Also, how tightly moored should I be to the mooring buoys - lines taught and out of the water or with some slack in them. The boat is 24ft and the gap between the trots perhaps 35ft.

Many thanks
 
Shackles - certainly. See no need for thimbles as those ends are going to be on your boat, wound around a cleat, most of the time. My own situation is analogous, except substitute piles for buoys.

When leaving, I tie a simple figure eight knot at the end of each of the mooring warps. Before departure, single-up to one up-tide warp, bringing the lazy warps to the 'buoy' side of the boat. The working warp is 'simplified', leaving just one turn on the cleat, with the end taken outside the rail, so that when it is let go all warps can fall free.

My pick-up buoy has a length of lighter line centered on it. One end of this goes through the figure of eight knots in the stern warps, and ties back onto itself. The other end ties through the bow warps. When ready to depart, let go the remaining warp, chuck the whole lot in the water with the pick-up buoy, or dangle them over the rails of the neighbour if he is there.

Arriving is really just the reverse. Come alongside neighbour if there, or ferry glide in to pick-up buoy if not. Get one up-tide warp on quickly - doesn't need to be prefect. You are now hanging by one line from the buoy and have all the time in the world to sort out and adjust all the bits of string.

You should put loose breast lines onto you neighbour, and tight springs, to stop you surging against each other. Make sure you're not aligned with your neighbour so that rigging or spars might clash when the boats roll.

As to tightness of the lines, not bar taut, but enough so that there is no possibility of more than a foot or two of movement when the tide turns, and so that you don't get shoved too far to leeward in x-winds.

WARNING - be careful not to motor over your own warps, your neighbour's or the bridle. It has been done many times, at least two of them by me!
 
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So ideally, each mooring line could be attached via a shackle through a thimble at one end and then have a loop in the other. A pick-up buoy would have a line that could go through the each loop and stay centred on the trot when the boat wasn't there.

When arriving, the pick-up buoy is collected and an up-tide warp is secured first, followed by the others. The pick-up buoy can reside on the boat whilst it is moored.

Next questions: what material for the mooring ropes and what size would be appropriate for a 24ft on a drying mooring? What are the pro's and cons of nylon, galvanised or stainless steel thimbles? What size should the shackle attaching the mooring line to the buoy be?
 
I use galvanised thimbles, and after having one rot through in six years, I'm now running a replace-after-three-years policy. My lines, for a 28' four ton boat, are 14mm three strand nylon. Shackles are BIG - mostly coz they have to be to go around the ring on the slider on the pile. Each warp has its own shackle.
 
mooring-02.jpg


I took this picture to demonstrate my aghast'ness when I saw how my new neighbour had made off his mooring strops.

But basically this might give an idea of how I have made the bridle to the buoy, we share a shackle on the main chain. Go over in the dinghy first and make your moorings up, it will be much easier than arriving and attempting to make the boat fast in any current and people hanging onto to buoys with boat hooks.

It would be a good idea if you have not been over yet, to take a hacksaw as my experiences have been to cut off the former four users rusted solid shackles.

Another point of note, my shackles (bought from buy and sell on here 2nd hand) are blue pin rated type. They are now around 4 years old (previous owners use unknown) and show no signs of rust at all. I have had them apart about 3 times in that time and just smear a little grease on them while re-assembling. Don't buy the chinese rubbish, even if it comes with a nice plastic plastimo card hanging in the chandlers, they are fully rust coated within 12 months (I guarantee this!), pay a little extra and feel confident your boat is more secure. Plus, it saves cutting away the old shackles every time you move, renew strops etc etc. Sorry to be all managerial, just sharing some hard earned experience. The way things look, I expect to be still using these shackles in 20 odd years time, cost saving must be immense.
 
I'll add my two pennyworth.

We have a trot mooring and the way we use it is as simple as I am able to devise. Firstly put some suitable length strops on the mooring fore and aft. Our mooring is laid as 20 metres between the buoys, so the length between our cleats fore and aft plus the mooring strops needs to be 20 metres - simple. This makes our strops 4.8 metres long from memory - but you must ask about your trot and measure your boat and determine what the correct length is. Its pain and grief for others if you get it wrong as I will mention later.

I made our strops out of 20mm laid line with soft eyes spliced into one end (to drop over the cleats on our boat) and eyes spliced over thimbles at the other end. The thimbled eyes are shackled to the bouy. (The thimbles obviously to save chafe and generally protect the line.)

We then have another gash length of line with some old fenders tied to it that is just long enough to tie between the mooring strops when we are not on the mooring.

To leave the mooring, I get the mooring strops onto one cleat at bow and stern and tie the gash length of line with the fenders to each mooring strop. (Both the eyes put together and a quick round turn and two half hitches is perfect) If the tide is flowing from aft, drop the f'wd strop first and then the stern strop and motor away backwards into the tide. Vice versa if the tide is on the nose. As you motor away you will have left two sets of mooring strops tied together with some old fenders on the line to help you pick it up when you return.

How to return has already been described adequately in another post, but basically motor into the tide, and pick up the line and follow it along to the mooring strops you tied on earlier and hook them over a bow cleat. You can then walk aft with the pick-up line until you get to the stern and drop those mooring strops over a stern cleat and Sally is your brother's sister. A bit of tidying up with putting the strops through fairleads etc, but you are safe and secure. I can do it single handed in my 39 foot boat so long as its not blowing 30 knots.

It all gets difficult if ignorant so and so's pull their lines in too tight further down the trot. Please ignore the person who said, "Pull in your lines enough to stop yourself swinging across the tide etc." Find out the distance between your trot mooring bouys and make sure you moor with that length equal to the length of your boat plus mooring strops. I speak with feeling as some of the people on my trot sometimes make life very difficult for the rest of us...

Hope that is all clear...
 
Twister_Ken said:
And don't forget to mouse the shackles. Trad way is with monel wire, modern way with a cable tie.
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I have used fairly heavy cable ties on my dodgers and as soon as the bag of spares has gone I will go back to string. They crack with the slightest touch after less than a year in the sun... would not be confident with them as shackle 'locks' at all*. Not attempting to preach to the converted here, just don't think they should be used for this application at all. :(

*unless of course you use chinese rubbish shackles that wobble in the threads when new, for they will be so rusted after a few months you will have to saw them off anyhow, no chance of using the F..O.. big adjustable after 4 years as I can (smuggy).
 
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Cher Doggie.

Good point. Being on piles my shackles are underwater most of the time, and after a few weeks from new are 'shaded' by marine growth when they do emerge at LW Springs, so UV doesn't get to the cable ties to cause problems. But I can quite see that sitting on top of a buoy they will do.
 
Vid said:
What's the best way to both secure the boat but also have a neat system that makes it easy to pick up and leave the trot?


The advice was to attach my mooring lines using shackles on one end and thimbles on the other, attached to a float in the middle so I could pick them up easily. I would use two sets of lines at each end for security. I suppose the shackle on the buoy is a good idea to reduce chafe but I'm not sure about the role of the thimble-end - attached to the boat or the float?

I like the idea, but can't quite see how it works in practice. Also, how tightly moored should I be to the mooring buoys - lines taught and out of the water or with some slack in them. The boat is 24ft and the gap between the trots perhaps 35ft.

Many thanks
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A different view from me and do please have a look here for good well tested practices

http://web.ukonline.co.uk/upnor.sailing/moorup.htm

This site gives advice on securing your warps and calculating the length too

I use two bow warps and two stern warps of 16mm for my 2 tonne boat- using cow hitches for the buoy ends (our Moorings Master throws a blue fit if shackles are added to the buoys) and plain ends for the boat cleats- no thimbles needed on these. When casting off I reconnect the marrying line with the connecting braid (hard eyes in the marrying line ends make it easier to reeve the connecting braid through the two eyes under load) and pull the marrying line, up and over the boat stanchions whilst I release the 4 mooring warps and secure them by way of rolling hitches to the marrying line so that they don't wave about in the river waiting to catch the prop of any unwary passer-by.

Don't use floating warps for mooring, for if they become separated from the marrying line whilst you are away they are a real menace to other water users, and to you upon your return!!

PM me if you want to talk it through, and I'll give you my phone number
 
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Now that is a good use for old fenders.

In the event that the boat hooks have gone missing, a larg (ish) round buoy is an good alternative. A loop of whatever cord is available can be dropped over the buoy and held together until the excitement of mooring is past. I like a mooring line that sinks by ther by, it is less of a target for the prop and bilge keels !

73s de
Johnth
 
"- Do not fix your mooring lines to the buoy with shackles and hard eyes (thimbles). We know that some members like to use shackles and eyes to prevent wear to their mooring lines, in a permanent marina berth I would certainly do this, but please do not use them on our mooring trots. Shackles can chafe through the marrying line at the buoy within a few weeks, rendering the whole line wasted, and endangering the whole trot when the line parts unexpectedly (perhaps while you are away)."

Interesting site linked to by Gin. Unfortunately I don't understand the above quote. Do the club leave what they call 'marrying lines' permanently between the mooring buoys on the trot.

I only ask because I don't put the shackles onto our mooring bouys - our mooring contractor does! The moorings are laid and maintained by a professional contractor and dive company and my mooring strops (which I supply) are put on by them and taken off by them at beginning and end of each season.

They use some UV resistant cable ties to mouse the shackles - although I have no idea as to how UV resistant that actually are as I don't have any contact with them normally. I just see them on the shackle on the buoy.
 
john_morris_uk said:
"-
Interesting site linked to by Gin. Unfortunately I don't understand the above quote. Do the club leave what they call 'marrying lines' permanently between the mooring buoys on the trot.

.
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The three clubs on the lower river, of which one is Upnor, all use permanently connected marrying lines when resident boats are away, but when occupied the marrying line is 'broken' by untying the thinner cord which ties the two eye splices together in the middle of the trot leaving the boat's mooring warps taking the place of the marrying line, thus at all times there is a continuous connection in one form or another as explained here holding about 20 trot positions in harmony- I hope that my explanation clarifies any doubts as to the set-up?
 
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Twister_Ken said:
"Shackles can chafe through the marrying line at the buoy within a few weeks"

But they wouldn't if the marrying line (bridle in my vocab) was shackled as well!
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But they are- what we don't want is another shackle being added for each warp which would mean 3 shackles per buoy when all the trots are taken as is often the case.

The recommended system is one that has been in place for donkey's years and is well proven, so it suits us and our neighbours- if it doesn't suit everyone ,elsewhere then that isn't something I would feel able to usefully comment further upon
 
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john_morris_uk said:
They use some UV resistant cable ties to mouse the shackles - although I have no idea as to how UV resistant that actually are as I don't have any contact with them normally. I just see them on the shackle on the buoy.
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Black cable ties are very UV resistant, the clear nylon ones go brittle after a couple of years.

Interesting thread. I was damaged by an idiot on the Isles de Chaussy years ago who didn't know how to leave the trot. I had netting all along the guardrails to prevent little ones from taking an involuntary swim and the idiot ripped all the netting off and gave me a rude hand signal when I protested. Tide was running at many knots at the time and he should not have left anyway, but as others have explained, it is possible.
 
Gin said:
The three clubs on the lower river, of which one is Upnor, all use permanently connected marrying lines when resident boats are away, but when occupied the marrying line is 'broken' by untying the thinner cord which ties the two eye splices together in the middle of the trot leaving the boat's mooring warps taking the place of the marrying line, thus at all times there is a continuous connection in one form or another as explained here holding about 20 trot positions in harmony- I hope that my explanation clarifies any doubts as to the set-up?
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That clears it up in my mind perfectly. On our trots, there is a marrying line provided, but you either unclip it when you are using the mooring (and put your own marrying line in between your mooring strops which is what I do) or leave it in place and work round it. It is clipped to the rings on the buoys by heavy duty metal carabiner type clips, so the shackles (which are all tested and approved) don't chafe on any rope at all.

Interestingly, the whole trot is held together by heavy lines about three or four meters down between each riser coming from each mooring block in the line. The moorings were described in one of the magazine a while ago and I had no idea that there were underwater lines from riser to riser.
 
john_morris_uk said:
Interestingly, the whole trot is held together by heavy lines about three or four meters down between each riser coming from each mooring block in the line. The moorings were described in one of the magazine a while ago and I had no idea that there were underwater lines from riser to riser.
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Oh yes, same for us the ground tackle connects the lines underwater too- it's the surface connections which keep the whole lot in sync. and a constant tension is key- be it boat/warps or marrying line.

One could question the safety of a cow hitch on the warps but in practice they neither damage the Club's marrying lines, nor do they chafe away to the detriment of the boat owner- I use polyester since it remains flexible for longer and my current lines have done two seasons without visible wear, apart from some rust stains, and I reckon on at least two more.
 
I've been on a fore and aft buoy trot for nine years now, here's how I do it:
Two jackstays between the buoys - one tight to keep the distance correct, one slack so it can be hooked and lifted.
Two mooring lines on each buoy, put largeish eye splices in each end of each mooring line - to attach them to the eye on top of the buoys pass each mooring line through the eye then back through the mooring line eye splice to form cow hitches, no shackles needed.
Attach a tie line at each end of the slack jackstay just under a mooring line length from the ends.
When the boat is on the mooring, attach the slack jackstay along the side of the boat.
To leave the mooring attach the mooring lines to the tie line at each end of the slack jackstay, as you don't want the down stream mooring lines floating down the wrong side of the buoy.
Returning, hook the slack jackstay, tie off forward mooring lines, I figure of eight the two mooring lines to the bow cleat as one line, slide boat hook along slack jackstay to aft mooring lines, detach tie line and put a single mooring line to port and starboard stern cleats. This stops the boat moving too far away from trot in strong cross wind.
The reason for symmetrical mooring lines is so you can tie up either way round.
 
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I've picked up on this old thread because this year will be my first on a fore and aft trot, last year I was on a swinging mooring. I take it it woudl be a good idea to set your own lines up on the trot before bringing the boat in for the first time? Or can you pick up the line between the buoys while you sort yourself out?
 
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